Alternate Weapons of War thread...

[Mr. BoJangles]

and in the case that your decellerating, F=m(-A).

Now, you can accelerate really slowly, which will reduce the amount of F. therefore making your ship less susceptible to stress.

 

[Stephen]

and in the case that your decellerating, F=m(-A).

Now, you can accelerate really slowly, which will reduce the amount of F. therefore making your ship less susceptible to stress.

But as the ship has turned around, as far as the ship and crew in concernd the force is in the same direction. as the engine is still on the same end of the ship and propelling the reaction mass away from the ship.

Some kind of fussion or antimatter rocket which can generate a constant one g acceleration would be ideal for rapid interplanetary travel, but the weight of the fussion reactor would likely limit it a half or quarter g. A nerva rocket would soon go through most of its reaction mass and spend most of its time coasting like in the films 2001 and 2010 Authuc C Clarke made those quite realistic. A nuclear or solar powered ion drive would generate a very gentel acceleration but do so for a long time.

 

[Mr. BoJangles]

But as the ship has turned around, as far as the ship and crew in concernd the force is in the same direction. as the engine is still on the same end of the ship and propelling the reaction mass away from the ship.

Some kind of fussion or antimatter rocket which can generate a constant one g acceleration would be ideal for rapid interplanetary travel, but the weight of the fussion reactor would likely limit it a half or quarter g. A nerva rocket would soon go through most of its reaction mass and spend most of its time coasting like in the films 2001 and 2010 Authuc C Clarke made those quite realistic. A nuclear or solar powered ion drive would generate a very gentel acceleration but do so for a long time.

I say combine!

 

[Locke]

Whew. Well, those ships are nice. And, IIRC, Camaro explained once why his ship didn't have SAM's. Though I forget why. It was quite a while ago.

Anyway. Using models from juniorgeneral.com, I have cobbled together generally what I imagined the CGU's infantry weapons looking like. Unfortunately, they're drawn really small.

So...squint, bitches, squint!

Also thanks to juniorgeneral; their pictures of artillery pieces were great base designs. So here are the CGUA's typical field artillery pieces. This does not include siege artillery, which are typically much, much larger and far less mobile.
As part of the Union Army's "deep battle" doctrine, combined-arms methods are practised at nearly every level. Almost all infantry are mechanised, with artillery and chemical warfare groups integrated at the regimental level; all panzer formations have organic infantry support, etc. The most prominent example is the integration of artillery fire-support at the platoon, company, battalion, regimental, and brigade level. From light 37mm pack artillery and 75mm pack howitzers to 50mm towed guns and various individually-carried mortars; dedicated artillery brigades utilise an array of light, medium, and heavy howitzers. Each weapon system is integrated to a network of observation drones and guidance satellites in order to provide pinpoint-accurate fire support with highly capable guided munitions, allowing for smaller artillery pieces to do significantly more damage than expected of their calibre. Chemical (really CBRN) warfare troops also use these to deliver payloads of chemical, biological, or radiological weapons.

You know, I've been wondering for a while: based on your drawings, the CGU seems to be some sort of galaxy-spanning Third Reich. Most of your weapons seem to be absed on this. Is there any particular reason the CGU is so backwards that it is still using weapons with woodgrain stocks and towed artillery?

And Panzerfausts?

Something I drew a bit ago but didn't scan until recently (sorry it's a jpeg. Even the PNG wouldn't fit).
snipSSBNsnip

One minor quibble: why does it have so many windows on it?

A 1940s/50s era jet fighter based largely off the ME-262 with the Tail lifted off the MiG-15 armed with a single motorized 15mm Gatling gun. Although i will say that i have never been fond of the jet engine on wings style of fighter aircraft that was popular in the Korea war era.

Sexy.

View attachment 100873

Ive been sitting on this one for a while

MARS ALLIANCE RETRIBUTION CLASS

The scariest thing about the Retribution is not its firpower, although its certainly not lacking, with 16 laser batteries and four rail guns firing laser bomb head missiles.

The scariest thing about the Retribution is not its range, although it was impressive. a retribution class ship could travel from Mars to Earth, then fly on to Venus and then back to mars without refueling.

You know, technically, a space shuttle could do that. Saying how far it could go is really no testament to a spaceship's operational range. All you have to do is puff your engines once to get going, puff them again to slow down and turn around, puff them back up a couple times. It would take many decades for a space shuttle to do this, but it could be done.

Also, do you have a link to the timeline for this universe? I'd like to see it.

Also, in this futuristic interplanetary war, why don't the two nations simply throw rocks at each other? Say, build a few dozen mass drivers, fill them up with rocks, and aim them at the enemy planet? No way to stop all of them.

 

[Hapsburg]

You know, I've been wondering for a while: based on your drawings, the CGU seems to be some sort of galaxy-spanning Third Reich.

Bit more like Fascist Spain, actually. The Space Nazi thing is mostly aesthetics.

there any particular reason the CGU is so backwards that it is still using weapons with woodgrain stocks and towed artillery?

1. The only weapon with a woodgrain stocks is the parade rifle. Which is, as the name implies, a parade rifle.
2. How the hell else are you going to get field artillery into the field? Self-propelled artillery is an entirely different thing. Mind, all towed artillery can be airlifted in.

And Panzerfausts?

Cheap and simple, disposable weapon. You might as well ask why Zakus have panzerfausts.

Plus, I like the look/shape of the thing.

One minor quibble: why does it have so many windows on it?

What windows?
Those are missile tubes. The side of the sub curves, remember?

 

[backstab]

1. The only weapon with a woodgrain stocks is the parade rifle. Which is, as the name implies, a parade rifle.
2. How the hell else are you going to get field artillery into the field? Self-propelled artillery is an entirely different thing. Mind, all towed artillery can be airlifted in.

Infantry Guns and Anti Tank guns are obsolete now ... I'd doubt that they would ever make a come back .... why waste money on an Infantry Gun when a mortar does the same job but cheaper. Why have anti tank guns when ATGM's are more effective.

Heavy Mortars are taking the place of towed artillery now days so why not use 120mm mortars with Rocket assisted projectiles .... same range ... more damage.

 

[Hapsburg]

Infantry Guns and Anti Tank guns are obsolete now

None of those are dedicated AT guns. And I explain in my TL why they bring back small field artillery.

why waste money on an Infantry Gun when a mortar does the same job but cheaper. Why have anti tank guns when ATGM's are more effective.

If you have enough resources, why not do both?

 

[charl]

A tentative catalogue of major missile systems deployed in the Central Galactic Armed Forces.

I don't think mines make any sense in space. There is no way to hide them, you have to consider the third dimension when placing and the distances involved simply means that the chance of your opponents getting anywhere close enough to the mine is very, very unlikely.

 

[Hapsburg]

I don't think mines make any sense in space.

It's better to think of it as a strangely-shaped missile that loiters.

There is no way to hide them, you have to consider the third dimension when placing and the distances involved simply means that the chance of your opponents getting anywhere close enough to the mine is very, very unlikely.

Hence the thrusters mounted to it. They're generally used in widely-spaced grids at strategic choke points, e.g. around planets or resource satellites or deep space bases. The spacing is such that the mines have little overlap in range; this allows for them to be used effectively over wide areas.

And, actually, the point is that they are seen. They present an obvious danger to incoming enemy ships, forcing them to take other lanes of traffic to avoid them, usually heading right into an ambush by CGN vessels. The goal is that the enemy either realises this, and backs off; or they take the bait and are slaughtered.

 

[Locke]

None of those are dedicated AT guns. And I explain in my TL why they bring back small field artillery.


If you have enough resources, why not do both?

They are being phased out in areas that they already haven't been.

And why not do both, you ask? Well many countries today have resources to do both, but they don't really want to spend a whole lot of money on systems like that. Sure, the US and a couple of others are developing new field artillery, but most of present day artillery is going to be missile based if it isn't already.

Also, about the Panzerfausts: don't tanks have some shielding to prevent that? I know that many US vehicles today ahve a system (forgot the name) that detonates RPGs before they impact the vehicle. And of course, there are development that could shoot a shell/missile out of the sky...

1. The only weapon with a woodgrain stocks is the parade rifle. Which is, as the name implies, a parade rifle.
2. How the hell else are you going to get field artillery into the field? Self-propelled artillery is an entirely different thing. Mind, all towed artillery can be airlifted in.

1. I saw several other weapons with what appeared to be wood on their stocks-what appeared to be a heavy anti-materiel rifle, and some other guns here and there. not just the parade rifle.

2. Mobile artillery could be made to fly under helicopters, especially in a future with stronger and lighter building materials. Vehicles in many sci-fi are cpabale of holding heavy vehicles...

 

[Hapsburg]

They are being phased out in areas that they already haven't been.
And why not do both, you ask? Well many countries today have resources to do both

And many countries today aren't a Galactic state thousands of years in the future. Current trends might reverse depending on the technology developed. Hell, technology developments now are making tube artillery more efficient.
And I don't know where you get the idea that tube artillery is being phased out. If it was, we wouldn't be developing new ones. It has its place, just like rocket artillery.

Also, about the Panzerfausts: don't tanks have some shielding to prevent that?

Human tanks do, yes (though you're wrong about modern active defence systems for tanks- they're only in the design stages now). Anyway, the Panzerfaust isn't strictly an antitank weapon; it's a general-purpose rocket-propelled grenade. It can be used for anti-armour purposes, sure; but it can also be used for anti-personnel, anti-structure, bunker-defeat, anti-door, etc.

I saw several other weapons with what appeared to be wood on their stocks-what appeared to be a heavy anti-materiel rifle, and some other guns here and there. not just the parade rifle.

Then it just appears like that. The parade rifle is the only one that actually has a wood stock.

2. Mobile artillery could be made to fly under helicopters, especially in a future with stronger and lighter building materials. Vehicles in many sci-fi are capabale of holding heavy vehicles...

And I just said that artillery can be taken in by helicopters and aerodynes. Field guns and SPH's.

 

[charl]

It's better to think of it as a strangely-shaped missile that loiters.


Hence the thrusters mounted to it. They're generally used in widely-spaced grids at strategic choke points, e.g. around planets or resource satellites or deep space bases. The spacing is such that the mines have little overlap in range; this allows for them to be used effectively over wide areas.

And, actually, the point is that they are seen. They present an obvious danger to incoming enemy ships, forcing them to take other lanes of traffic to avoid them, usually heading right into an ambush by CGN vessels. The goal is that the enemy either realises this, and backs off; or they take the bait and are slaughtered.

Well that makes more sense, although I still question if it is possible to mine a whole planet or if there even are such things as choke points in space. It's still fully three dimensional. If one side of the planet has a few mines placed in a grid you just fly around it. I suppose it could be used around smaller targets like space stations but since this is space that just means you keep outside of mine range and fire missiles or even asteroids at the station from there.

Though the mines could be used as countermeasures for projectiles in such a case, which actually might be useful (though all the debris would still fly around or towards the station).

 

[Hapsburg]

If one side of the planet has a few mines placed in a grid you just fly around it.

"Grid" in this case being a spherical grid. You know, around the planet (or what have you).

I suppose it could be used around smaller targets like space stations but since this is space that just means you keep outside of mine range and fire missiles or even asteroids at the station from there.

Since the mines have the same, if not greater, range than missiles, it's practically impossible to not be in mine range and still be able to fire one's own missiles. Railguns might work, though.
And no one in this universe has ships large enough to lob whole fucking asteroids; except the CGU itself and the main antagonists of the story, the Zaaroft Empire (mind, antagonist does not mean villain). And the Zaaroft use very different weaponry than the CGU.

 

[Sir Scott]

Im back from holiday and ive got some spare time on my hands , so I think ill put together some more weapons of war in Google sketch. In particular im going to move on from the early 20th century to the second world war era , starting with aircraft

Anybody got any requests? I dont wish to directly copy any OTL designs , but if people want say , a twin-engined ground attack aircraft with 30mm cannon fitted , painted up in the colours of their alternate airforce , im willing to entertain the notion

 

[charl]

"Grid" in this case being a spherical grid. You know, around the planet (or what have you).


Since the mines have the same, if not greater, range than missiles, it's practically impossible to not be in mine range and still be able to fire one's own missiles. Railguns might work, though.
And no one in this universe has ships large enough to lob whole fucking asteroids; except the CGU itself and the main antagonists of the story, the Zaaroft Empire (mind, antagonist does not mean villain). And the Zaaroft use very different weaponry than the CGU.

Gridding a whole planet also sounds incredibly impractical. Planets are big, you know. As for range that's pretty much unlimited in space. You nudge something along one way and it will keep going that way until it hits something or gets snagged in by something's gravity. Therefore a missile has no maximum range in space. So all you need to do is stay far enough away that the mines aren't activated and fire away from there, then just be patient.

 

[crackersncheese]

Gridding a whole planet also sounds incredibly impractical. Planets are big, you know. As for range that's pretty much unlimited in space. You nudge something along one way and it will keep going that way until it hits something or gets snagged in by something's gravity. Therefore a missile has no maximum range in space. So all you need to do is stay far enough away that the mines aren't activated and fire away from there, then just be patient.

And as soon as you launch one missile the defender has an instant lock on your orbit (if he didn't have one before) and the mines go whizzing off on an intercept course.

The thing is space missiles (and mines) are about as hard to justify as fighters. Couldn't a full-sized spacecraft be able to hold more delta-v than a small missile, and thus be capable of evading better than a missile could home? Granted, a missile doesn't save anything for the return trip, but that still makes them only specialist weapons at best, for when your enemy has come a very long way and you know they can't spare much remass for jinking and dodging.

 

[Hapsburg]

By "range" with things like this, it means "effective range". As in, the distance at which its sensors can effectively notice and respond to a detected target, and at which it can still have enough fuel to travel and manoeuvre. I mean, if you expend all your fuel getting to an enemy, and you don't have enough to do manoeuvring burns, you're pretty much SOL as far as being an effective explosive weapon.
And as for why ships use missiles the size of ICBM's rather than the size of space shuttles- it's simply more economical. They can carry more missiles that way; and if they carry nuclear warheads on the missiles, then it doesn't really matter if the launch vehicles is big or not.
And, IMO, space fighters can be justifiable. It all depends on the setting.

Anywho. Now for something completely different but still in the same universe.
My re-re-re-redesign of the Wolf field walker. Yeah, I know, I've done quite a few of these. And the stats are basically the same every time, but just so we're clear on it:
Height: 13 meters
Dry Weight: 22 tons
Full Weight: 45 tons
Accommodation: 1 pilot, cockpit in upper torso
Armour Materials: boron nitride with diamond coating
Powerplant: 2 x ultracompact fusion reactors, 28.2 MW output.
Fixed Armaments: 2 x 20mm rotary cannons, mounted in head; 1 x 30mm automatic cannon, mounted in torso; 1 x 40mm grenade launcher, mounted in torso; 1 x Progressive Blade, mounted on left arm.

 

[Locke]

And many countries today aren't a Galactic state thousands of years in the future. Current trends might reverse depending on the technology developed. Hell, technology developments now are making tube artillery more efficient.
And I don't know where you get the idea that tube artillery is being phased out. If it was, we wouldn't be developing new ones. It has its place, just like rocket artillery.

Developing new ones, yes, but coming our with every size, shape, and flavor of them? No. Do you see any sort of new light anti-tank artillery? any new light anti-aircraft artillery? And there's a reason for it-not just the fact that all of these services have been given up to more mobile handheld and vehicular systems, but also that many of these roles have been concentrated into one or two systems that can fire a wide variety of shells (as well as the before said superior handheld weapons and helicopters, of which there were none during WW2-or at least, none that could even be remotely compared to ones of today). However, back to field arty vs. mobile arty-look at the increased mobility that SPA's have to offer. It can take several hours to set up a modern day field artillery peace with the whole team. An SPA unit only takes a few minutes. SPAs can also operate farther away from supplies than emplaced artillery can, which need a very complex command and control bureacracy in order to be able to be effective, even in today's age fo GPS and guided shells.

So, if you have helicopters that can carry SPAs (wheras today's can not), then why bother with developing more and more (comparably) inefficient field artillery systems? It doesn't matter if your government is galaxy spanning; governments do not like wasting money (they might do it without noticing, or the bureacracy might cause them to lose lots of money like the US's gov't does, but most of the time they aren't intentionally doing it). And when they would logically be producing a comparable amount of equipment that nations do (relative to the military's needs, of course, which in this case would probably equal millions upon millions of artillery pieces), then that translates to alot of money being spent on otudated artillery.

Human tanks do, yes (though you're wrong about modern active defence systems for tanks- they're only in the design stages now). Anyway, the Panzerfaust isn't strictly an antitank weapon; it's a general-purpose rocket-propelled grenade. It can be used for anti-armour purposes, sure; but it can also be used for anti-personnel, anti-structure, bunker-defeat, anti-door, etc.

So...human tanks can withstand this stuff, but aliens can't? Okay...I'll take that, considering tis your scifi universe. And are you referring to the real Panzerfaust, or your Panzerfaust?

Then it just appears like that. The parade rifle is the only one that actually has a wood stock.

That seems rather pointless....any particular reason why? Or more money burning?

 

[Hapsburg]

Developing new ones, yes, but coming out with every size, shape, and flavour of them?

Different situations call for different weapons, simply put. Each kind is specialised, though they're each versatile enough to not suffer from crippling over-specialisation.
And it isn't even a hugely broad repertoire as you seem to be implying; there's only three kinds of howitzer and two mortar types. The infantry guns don't exactly count in this regard, because they're not entirely standardised around a single calibre yet.

So, if you have helicopters that can carry SPAs, then why bother with developing more and more inefficient field artillery systems?

Versatility. Emplaced artillery are used for things that SPA isn't, and vice versa; they each have their own uses and purposes in a fully-equipped army.
Besides, they're not necessarily inefficient or outdated; that's just your perception. You have no way of judging the efficiency of fictional artillery.

And are you referring to the real Panzerfaust, or your Panzerfaust?

The CGU's, obviously, since that's who we're talking about.

That seems rather pointless....any particular reason why?

No, I mean, it just looks like that to you. Not that they are making things that looks like woodgrain but aren't. The only gun with a woodgrain stock is the parade rifle, and it looks like that for aesthetic purposes.

 

[Slings_Arrows]

civil war airship