What is says on the tin. By hook or by crook, have Davy Crockett elected to the Presidency.
Bonus points/cookies if you have him replacing OTL's Andrew Jackson.
Bonus points/cookies if you have him replacing OTL's Andrew Jackson.
AHC: President Davy Crockett
- Thread starter Kung Fucious
- Start date
I don't think you can get Crockett to replace Jackson, since Crockett didn't start his congressional career until Jackson was already President.
In any case, I think you have two good ways to go about this. The easiest would be to have Crockett win reelection in 1835 so he stays active in Tennessee politics and avoids getting caught up in the Texan revolt. If he sticks with the House, he likely becomes the preeminent Anti-Jacksonian in the state's delegation and could be chosen to serve in the US Senate instead of Ephraim Foster when Felix Grundy retires to become Attorney General. From there, its a much shorter skip to the Presidency.
The other way, of course, is that Crockett still goes to Texas but doesn't serve at the Alamo. He eventually returns to Tennessee a hero for his activities and resumes his political career.
Either way, Crockett was a staunch supporter of John Quincy Adams and Henry Clay (as well as an avowed foe of Andrew Jackson), so he is certainly going to end up being a Whig. Perhaps if he was positioned as a more likable Clay, he would end up making a strong presidential candidate.
I could also see him being a good VP candidate for Harrison in 1840, which would get him the Presidency a few months later
In any case, I think you have two good ways to go about this. The easiest would be to have Crockett win reelection in 1835 so he stays active in Tennessee politics and avoids getting caught up in the Texan revolt. If he sticks with the House, he likely becomes the preeminent Anti-Jacksonian in the state's delegation and could be chosen to serve in the US Senate instead of Ephraim Foster when Felix Grundy retires to become Attorney General. From there, its a much shorter skip to the Presidency.
The other way, of course, is that Crockett still goes to Texas but doesn't serve at the Alamo. He eventually returns to Tennessee a hero for his activities and resumes his political career.
Either way, Crockett was a staunch supporter of John Quincy Adams and Henry Clay (as well as an avowed foe of Andrew Jackson), so he is certainly going to end up being a Whig. Perhaps if he was positioned as a more likable Clay, he would end up making a strong presidential candidate.
I could also see him being a good VP candidate for Harrison in 1840, which would get him the Presidency a few months later
Redhand
Banned
The Whigs needed a hero of some kind and got one with Harrison. If they go with Crockett in this scenario, he would likely run a similar campaign and win as long as he had Clay and the New England Whigs behind him.
As a President, I think he might advocate annexation of Texas if it comes up as he was sympathetic to their cause despite being a Whig. How he handles Oregon is beyond me, but I think the British would openly disrespect him for his background and things might get ugly. Webster-Ashburton still happens as OTL as New Brunswick was scared shitless of New England and that wouldn't change.
A war in the 1840s with Britain could go a variety of ways.
As a President, I think he might advocate annexation of Texas if it comes up as he was sympathetic to their cause despite being a Whig. How he handles Oregon is beyond me, but I think the British would openly disrespect him for his background and things might get ugly. Webster-Ashburton still happens as OTL as New Brunswick was scared shitless of New England and that wouldn't change.
A war in the 1840s with Britain could go a variety of ways.
Driftless
Donor
IF Crockett were to succeed Harrison, that would be a seismic shift in approach to treatment of Native Americans. While Crockett had fought in the war against the Creeks, he had more respect for them than many of his contemporaries. Later, as a US Representative, he voted against the Indian Removal Act, which he based on principle, even if not popular at home. One of the quotes from him:
To quote an old soc.history.what-if post of mine:
***
Davy Crockett became a great hero to the Whig Party as a frontiersman and
"man of the people" who could prove that the opponents of Jackson and Van
Buren were not, contrary to Democratic charges, a bunch of effete
aristocrats. He had been defeated for re-election to Congress in 1831
after he broke with Jackson, but won in 1833. He went on a tour of the
Northeast in 1834, defending the Bank of the United States and blaming bad
economic conditions on Jackson. In 1835 he lent his name to a savage *Life
of Martin Van Buren* (compared to which the "negative campaigning" of our
time is laughably tame--but of course that is true of nineteenth century
American politics in general). Defeated for re-election, he left Tennessee
for Texas, and perished at the Alamo.
Suppose Crockett had stayed in Tennessee. The Whigs certainly had a bright
future there--within a few years, former Jacksonians like John Bell and
Hugh White had broken with the Democrats (obviously, Van Buren could never
match Jackson's popularity in Tennesee) and had made Tennessee one of the
stronger Whig states. So perhaps Crockett would get back in Congress as a
Whig.
Then in 1840 the Whigs wanted a Southerner as their vice-presidential
candidate to balance William Henry Harrison, who was considered a
Northerner because he lived in Ohio (even though he was born in Virginia).
In OTL they chose John Tyler of Virginia--a choice that proved catastrophic
for the party once Harrsion died after thirty days in office. Tyler was a
strict states' rights man who had joined the Whigs in a common struggle
over Jackson's "tyranny" but had no sympathy for the Whigs' nationalist
economic program.
So suppose instead that in a bid to have *two* "log cabin" "men of the
people" against the Democrats, the Whigs choose a "Tippecanoe and Crockett
too" slate. Crockett becomes president after Harrison's death. Unlike
Tyler, he presumably goes along with the Whig tariff, bank, and internal
improvement policies. As a Southwesterner he might of course be more
enthusiastic than Northeastern Whigs about annexing Texas, but at least he
would not urge it on the blatantly pro-slavery rationale used by Tyler and
Calhoun. So can he get elected president in his own right in 1844?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.history.what-if/g7pV2CGKV7w/LEbjNuM8xSIJ
***
Rich Rostrom made an interesting point in reply--that Crockett probably would not seek another term in 1844 because the Whigs favored a single term for the president--Harrison pledged himself to this in his inauguration speech. (Of course Crockett might say that 1844 would be his first *elective* term....)
***
Davy Crockett became a great hero to the Whig Party as a frontiersman and
"man of the people" who could prove that the opponents of Jackson and Van
Buren were not, contrary to Democratic charges, a bunch of effete
aristocrats. He had been defeated for re-election to Congress in 1831
after he broke with Jackson, but won in 1833. He went on a tour of the
Northeast in 1834, defending the Bank of the United States and blaming bad
economic conditions on Jackson. In 1835 he lent his name to a savage *Life
of Martin Van Buren* (compared to which the "negative campaigning" of our
time is laughably tame--but of course that is true of nineteenth century
American politics in general). Defeated for re-election, he left Tennessee
for Texas, and perished at the Alamo.
Suppose Crockett had stayed in Tennessee. The Whigs certainly had a bright
future there--within a few years, former Jacksonians like John Bell and
Hugh White had broken with the Democrats (obviously, Van Buren could never
match Jackson's popularity in Tennesee) and had made Tennessee one of the
stronger Whig states. So perhaps Crockett would get back in Congress as a
Whig.
Then in 1840 the Whigs wanted a Southerner as their vice-presidential
candidate to balance William Henry Harrison, who was considered a
Northerner because he lived in Ohio (even though he was born in Virginia).
In OTL they chose John Tyler of Virginia--a choice that proved catastrophic
for the party once Harrsion died after thirty days in office. Tyler was a
strict states' rights man who had joined the Whigs in a common struggle
over Jackson's "tyranny" but had no sympathy for the Whigs' nationalist
economic program.
So suppose instead that in a bid to have *two* "log cabin" "men of the
people" against the Democrats, the Whigs choose a "Tippecanoe and Crockett
too" slate. Crockett becomes president after Harrison's death. Unlike
Tyler, he presumably goes along with the Whig tariff, bank, and internal
improvement policies. As a Southwesterner he might of course be more
enthusiastic than Northeastern Whigs about annexing Texas, but at least he
would not urge it on the blatantly pro-slavery rationale used by Tyler and
Calhoun. So can he get elected president in his own right in 1844?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.history.what-if/g7pV2CGKV7w/LEbjNuM8xSIJ
***
Rich Rostrom made an interesting point in reply--that Crockett probably would not seek another term in 1844 because the Whigs favored a single term for the president--Harrison pledged himself to this in his inauguration speech. (Of course Crockett might say that 1844 would be his first *elective* term....)
He wears many hats, one of them is Raccoon
He could go from President of Texas to US Senator from Texas to President of the USA
He escapes the destruction of Texas forces at the Alamo
"That there Davy snuck like a Fox right under their noses escaping to fight another day!"
Then Crockett is one of the commanders at San Jacinto. Sam Houston dies of his wounds and Crockett is elected President of Texas
After annexation He becomes Governor, then a Senator, and finally President of the USA
He would have stayed retired after that but . . .
Then comes the Civil War so lets throw in President of the CSA for good Measure
Impossible you say? Maybe for mere mortals like David Crockett, but not for O'l Davy!
He could go from President of Texas to US Senator from Texas to President of the USA
He escapes the destruction of Texas forces at the Alamo
"That there Davy snuck like a Fox right under their noses escaping to fight another day!"
Then Crockett is one of the commanders at San Jacinto. Sam Houston dies of his wounds and Crockett is elected President of Texas
After annexation He becomes Governor, then a Senator, and finally President of the USA
He would have stayed retired after that but . . .
Then comes the Civil War so lets throw in President of the CSA for good Measure
Impossible you say? Maybe for mere mortals like David Crockett, but not for O'l Davy!
There was also the late Raymond Speer's generous "review" of a book of mine, which, needless to say, I did not write (except in an alternate universe): https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.history.what-if/tSDD_PhpReI/crI6iQRZ58MJ
***
David Tenner was one of the finalists for the President Adams Award for
Biography with his 1997 volume Tennessee Trailblazer. In that book, he
followed Davy Crockett from his birth to his defeat for re-election to
the US Congress.
Tenner's second volume (Texas Titan) carries Crockett from his trip to
Texas to the day before the election of 1856 sent him to the White
House.
David Tenner likes Davy Crockett. He absolves Crockett of the child
abandonment canard that has been flung at him in life and death. And he
is uniformly sympathetic to Crockett in his retelling of Crockett's
famous romance of the voodoo queen of New Orleans,
Of particular interest to this newsgroup are the what-if potentials
immediately following Crockett's arrival in Texas. Crockett found the
notorious Jim Bowie dead of natural causes when he got to San Antonio.
The other Texan in authority was William Travis, who had gonorrhea in
his privates and megalomania on his mind. Unimpressed by the protests
and proclaimations of Travis, Crockett and his followers left the run
down fort that Travis proposed to defend only a day before the arrival
of Santa Anna's leading battalions.
But lets pretend that Bowie lived long enough to greet Crockett. Bowie
was a tough, respected guy who spoke in term of practical things. If he
had spoken to Crockett, and said that he wanted to hold San Antonio
using the Alamo mission as a fort -- would Crockett have listened to
Bowie? And if Crockett had stayed, would he have survived?
(Of course, as it happened, Crazy Bill Travis had only half a dozen men
standing by him when he defiantly fired a cannonball at Santa Anna's
request that he surrender. A squad of Mexican soldiers broke through
one of the undefended walls and arrested Crazy Bill and the fools with
him. Rescued from the Mexicans after the Battle of San Jacinto, poor
Travis died in poverty ten years later.)
Tenner learned from examples in Santa Anna's career that Santa Anna,
kindly dismissive towards a lone lunatic like Crazy Bill, was put in a
very foul mood by foes who refused to surrender and fought back hard.
It is possible that Santa Anna might have ordered a massacre of any
survivor of a hard fight, had men actually resisted fiercely at the
Alamo.
Without Crockett, would the drunkard Houston (a failed protege of
Crockett's enemy, Andrew Jackson) have rallied the men to a surprise
atttack on the Mexicans at San Jacinto? The evidence supports Crockett's
post-war observation that Houston had been drunk and ineffectual
throughout his period of command. Had Crockett been dead at the Alamo,
it is entirely possible that no trap would have been sprung on Santa
Anna, and Mexico would reannex Texas.
Tenner makes the reader appriciate the many obstacles that Crockett had
as President of the Republic of Texas. Crockett very nearly failed to
get approval and appropriations for the Coast War by which the Texas
Republic seized the east coast of Mexico from Matamoros to the port of
Vera Cruz.
Imagine how different the USA would be without the states of Tamaulipas
and Vera Cruz in it. Those two slave states, naturally enough absorbed
into the Union with the admission of Texas, balanced out Nebraska and
Kansas, and defused a potential sectional crisis about representation in
the US Senate. Besides possibly delaying the construction of
transcontinental railroads, what else might such a crisis have done in
the middle nineteenth century?
As a US Senator after Texas entered the USA, Crockett was a voice for
peace against the War Eagles who wanted to annex California after gold
was discovered in that Mexican province in 1852. Tenner has dug up
archival material showing that many Americans had a fetish about ruling
California. What if those guys had their way? Would Mexico have lost
Arizona, Nevada, and California had war occurred? Would Morminos in
Desereto continue to fuse into the Mexican mainstream or would they have
reverted to the Yankeeism of their ancestors? Would grumpy
anticlericals like Benito Juarez, unaffected by prosperous and
conservative California, ever managed to be president of Mexico?
I look forward to David Tenner's third volume of Crockett's biography.
My only caution to Prof. Tenner is that we don't need quite so much
information on minor characters. Take, for instance, Abraham Lincoln.
Is it necessary to devote 13 pages of Crockett's biography to the life
of the man who will be Crockett's Attorney General? Please give us
fewer digressions tn re Long Dead Whigs like Lincoln, Professor Tenner.
***
David Tenner was one of the finalists for the President Adams Award for
Biography with his 1997 volume Tennessee Trailblazer. In that book, he
followed Davy Crockett from his birth to his defeat for re-election to
the US Congress.
Tenner's second volume (Texas Titan) carries Crockett from his trip to
Texas to the day before the election of 1856 sent him to the White
House.
David Tenner likes Davy Crockett. He absolves Crockett of the child
abandonment canard that has been flung at him in life and death. And he
is uniformly sympathetic to Crockett in his retelling of Crockett's
famous romance of the voodoo queen of New Orleans,
Of particular interest to this newsgroup are the what-if potentials
immediately following Crockett's arrival in Texas. Crockett found the
notorious Jim Bowie dead of natural causes when he got to San Antonio.
The other Texan in authority was William Travis, who had gonorrhea in
his privates and megalomania on his mind. Unimpressed by the protests
and proclaimations of Travis, Crockett and his followers left the run
down fort that Travis proposed to defend only a day before the arrival
of Santa Anna's leading battalions.
But lets pretend that Bowie lived long enough to greet Crockett. Bowie
was a tough, respected guy who spoke in term of practical things. If he
had spoken to Crockett, and said that he wanted to hold San Antonio
using the Alamo mission as a fort -- would Crockett have listened to
Bowie? And if Crockett had stayed, would he have survived?
(Of course, as it happened, Crazy Bill Travis had only half a dozen men
standing by him when he defiantly fired a cannonball at Santa Anna's
request that he surrender. A squad of Mexican soldiers broke through
one of the undefended walls and arrested Crazy Bill and the fools with
him. Rescued from the Mexicans after the Battle of San Jacinto, poor
Travis died in poverty ten years later.)
Tenner learned from examples in Santa Anna's career that Santa Anna,
kindly dismissive towards a lone lunatic like Crazy Bill, was put in a
very foul mood by foes who refused to surrender and fought back hard.
It is possible that Santa Anna might have ordered a massacre of any
survivor of a hard fight, had men actually resisted fiercely at the
Alamo.
Without Crockett, would the drunkard Houston (a failed protege of
Crockett's enemy, Andrew Jackson) have rallied the men to a surprise
atttack on the Mexicans at San Jacinto? The evidence supports Crockett's
post-war observation that Houston had been drunk and ineffectual
throughout his period of command. Had Crockett been dead at the Alamo,
it is entirely possible that no trap would have been sprung on Santa
Anna, and Mexico would reannex Texas.
Tenner makes the reader appriciate the many obstacles that Crockett had
as President of the Republic of Texas. Crockett very nearly failed to
get approval and appropriations for the Coast War by which the Texas
Republic seized the east coast of Mexico from Matamoros to the port of
Vera Cruz.
Imagine how different the USA would be without the states of Tamaulipas
and Vera Cruz in it. Those two slave states, naturally enough absorbed
into the Union with the admission of Texas, balanced out Nebraska and
Kansas, and defused a potential sectional crisis about representation in
the US Senate. Besides possibly delaying the construction of
transcontinental railroads, what else might such a crisis have done in
the middle nineteenth century?
As a US Senator after Texas entered the USA, Crockett was a voice for
peace against the War Eagles who wanted to annex California after gold
was discovered in that Mexican province in 1852. Tenner has dug up
archival material showing that many Americans had a fetish about ruling
California. What if those guys had their way? Would Mexico have lost
Arizona, Nevada, and California had war occurred? Would Morminos in
Desereto continue to fuse into the Mexican mainstream or would they have
reverted to the Yankeeism of their ancestors? Would grumpy
anticlericals like Benito Juarez, unaffected by prosperous and
conservative California, ever managed to be president of Mexico?
I look forward to David Tenner's third volume of Crockett's biography.
My only caution to Prof. Tenner is that we don't need quite so much
information on minor characters. Take, for instance, Abraham Lincoln.
Is it necessary to devote 13 pages of Crockett's biography to the life
of the man who will be Crockett's Attorney General? Please give us
fewer digressions tn re Long Dead Whigs like Lincoln, Professor Tenner.
Davy Crockett was probably the first person of note to state publicly that they would leave the country if a certain person in his case Van Buren was elected President.
He his also the only person that I know of to have followed through on their promise leaving for Texas in November 1835 when the election result became public.
He his also the only person that I know of to have followed through on their promise leaving for Texas in November 1835 when the election result became public.
Now that would be interesting. Though would a Harrison/Crockett ticket work out? A war hero sharing the ticket with a backwoods folk hero isn't exactly balanced. If Crockett (for whatever reason, Van Buren losing the election, him winning reelection, etc.) would he replace Harrison as the Whig nominee in 1840?
A Crockett presidency that was, if not pro-Indian, but certainly more balanced, would be really interesting. Would we see the "State of Sequoyah" proposal get off the ground? What would the domestic policy of a Crockett administration be like?
On of them is a semi-aristocrat who has plenty of experience in government and Indian killing, the other a hero to the common folk as well as the Indians. Also the Free State-Slave State divide.
A more roundabout way to fulfill the AHC and get the cookie is to kill off AJ, and let butterflies put Davy in the White House. A far enough back POD would butterfly the Whigs but Davy is likely to join whatever party Clay cobbles together. Being Harrison's VP is also a good one, lots of people were considered for the ticket including Webster and others.
Perhaps Jackson dies (somehow) during the Battle of New Orleans? Though without an Imperial President like Jackson would Clay be able to cobble together a *Whig party like he did OTL?
There was a short story about a President Crockett in Alternate Presidents. If I recall, it linked his opposition to Indian Removal to Slavery with him running into a runaway half-black/half-indian boy who was the POV character in the story, which causes him to stay in Congress instead of resigning.
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