A Dawn in the Desert- Fremont Republic 2.0

Cyrtenius

I've decided to restart the idea of my old thread, Blood, Sweat, and Grits on the side.
Hopefully it'll be less of a wank and a bit more realistic, and more organized to boot! :D

Prelude: Major Players

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John C Fremont.

Antonio_Lopez_de_Santa_Anna_1852.jpg

Antonio Lopez de Santa Anna.
William_B._Ide%3F.gif

William B. Ide
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John Drake Sloat
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James K. Polk​

How will this play out? You'll see in my first update!
 

Cyrtenius

Excerpt from The Desert Republic

The primary cause of Rise of the Fremont Republic is debated throughout the academic and historical community. Most contribute it to the incredible and changing circumstances caused by the Mexican-American War, though some attribute it to incredible luck.

June 14, 1846: William B. Ide and his men create the Bear Flag Revolt and capture Mariano Vallejo, the Comandante of Northern California.

June 28, 1846: John C. Fremont, hearing rumors about a planned court martial, joins up with the Bear Flag Revolt in Sonoma, California. Fremont replaces William B. Ide as commander, though Ide is kept as the second in command. Comandante Vallejo was officially released, for which he was thankful. However, Mariano was a firm supporter in the US annexation of California. A quick discussion with Fremont lead him even further to support Californian Independence.

Mariano burned his Mexican uniform along with his brothers, and began recruiting Californians to the newly created Californian Battalion.

July 7, 1846: Fremont races to Monterey to beat Commodore Perry, beating him by a matter of hours. When Commodore Perry arrives, he faces a polite resistance. Perry surrenders some foodstuffs and ammunition to the rebels and returns to the United States, shamed. He is quickly replaced by Robert Stockton.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
How does this gibe with Fremont's commission, citizenship, personal history,

LordBuzz said:
Excerpt from The Desert Republic

The primary cause of Rise of the Fremont Republic is debated throughout the academic and historical community. Most contribute it to the incredible and changing circumstances caused by the Mexican-American War, though some attribute it to incredible luck.

June 14, 1846: William B. Ide and his men create the Bear Flag Revolt and capture Mariano Vallejo, the Comandante of Northern California.

June 28, 1846: John C. Fremont, hearing rumors about a planned court martial, joins up with the Bear Flag Revolt in Sonoma, California. Fremont replaces William B. Ide as commander, though Ide is kept as the second in command. Comandante Vallejo was officially released, for which he was thankful. However, Mariano was a firm supporter in the US annexation of California. A quick discussion with Fremont lead him even further to support Californian Independence.

Mariano burned his Mexican uniform along with his brothers, and began recruiting Californians to the newly created Californian Battalion.

July 7, 1846: Fremont races to Monterey to beat Commodore Perry, beating him by a matter of hours. When Commodore Perry arrives, he faces a polite resistance. Perry surrenders some foodstuffs and ammunition to the rebels and returns to the United States, shamed. He is quickly replaced by Robert Stockton.
Click to expand...

How does this gibe with Fremont's commission(s), citizenship, personal history, and - among others - connections with the Bentons?

Including the lovely Jessie:
jbfremont.jpg



Fremont was not William Walker.

Best,
 

Cyrtenius

TFSmith121 said:
How does this gibe with Fremont's commission(s), citizenship, personal history, and - among others - connections with the Bentons?

Including the lovely Jessie:
jbfremont.jpg



Fremont was not William Walker.

Best,
Click to expand...

I hold the belief that Fremont could have realized that some of his military blunders in the past might give someone the opportunity to court martial him, therefore giving him the thoughts to do what I outlined.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
What blunders would those be?

LordBuzz said:
I hold the belief that Fremont could have realized that some of his military blunders in the past might give someone the opportunity to court martial him, therefore giving him the thoughts to do what I outlined.
Click to expand...

What blunders would those be?

If your point of departure is simply "Fremont decides he's actually a wannabee emperor" all of a sudden in June, 1846, this seems a trifle abrupt for someone who had served in the Army with distinction from 1838 to 1846 (seven+ years) rising from 2nd lieutenant to major, was married to the daughter of a sitting US senator, and had connections throughout the circles of power in Washington going back to Joel Poinsett, who had been instrumental in his first appointment as an instructor aboard USS Natchez and then the Topographical Engineers, and has met with no one less than President Polk in 1845, with (what seems obvious) fairly clear instructions to meet with Larkin and cooperate with Sloat et al in the event of war...

It just doesn't track with anything in the man's career, in the 1840s or even in the 1860s - he may not have been much of a combat commander, and he was certainly ambitious, but treason?

Suspension of belief is one thing; this seems rather over the top.

Best,
 

Cyrtenius

TFSmith121 said:
What blunders would those be?

If your point of departure is simply "Fremont decides he's actually a wannabee emperor" all of a sudden in June, 1846, this seems a trifle abrupt for someone who had served in the Army with distinction from 1838 to 1846 (seven+ years) rising from 2nd lieutenant to major, was married to the daughter of a sitting US senator, and had connections throughout the circles of power in Washington going back to Joel Poinsett, who had been instrumental in his first appointment as an instructor aboard USS Natchez and then the Topographical Engineers, and has met with no one less than President Polk in 1845, with (what seems obvious) fairly clear instructions to meet with Larkin and cooperate with Sloat et al in the event of war...

It just doesn't track with anything in the man's career, in the 1840s or even in the 1860s - he may not have been much of a combat commander, and he was certainly ambitious, but treason?

Suspension of belief is one thing; this seems rather over the top.

Best,
Click to expand...

Fremont basically told some of his soldiers to murder three Californians without a perceived threat. This was released during his presidential campaign OTL and almost ruined him. Not to mention in 1847 he was charged with mutiny over a dispute about the real Military Governor of California, but that's before this TL right now.
 

TFSmith121

Banned
Yeah, that's a decade later...

LordBuzz said:
Fremont basically told some of his soldiers to murder three Californians without a perceived threat. This was released during his presidential campaign OTL and almost ruined him. Not to mention in 1847 he was charged with mutiny over a dispute about the real Military Governor of California, but that's before this TL right now.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's a decade later, and considering what's in play in 1846, that's not going to do it.

Likewise, the commander-in-chief (Polk) who - presumably - had given him secret orders - pardoned him for his various contretemps with Kearny, Sloat, etc.

You need someone a lot more piratical than John C. Fremont.

Best,
 
Last edited:

Cyrtenius

TFSmith121 said:
Yeah, that's a decade later, and considering what's in play in 1846, that's not going to do it.

Likewise, the commander-in-chief (Polk) who - presumably - had given him secret orders - pardoned him for his various contretemps with Kearny, Sloat, etc.

You need someone a lot more piratical than John C. Fremont.

Best,
Click to expand...

Thanks for your input! :D
 

TFSmith121

Banned
YAQW...

LordBuzz said:
Thanks for your input! :D
Click to expand...

YAQW...

Walker, sure. Maybe even Wilkinson or even Burr...

Fremont? Not in a million years.

He was many things, but a filibuster he was not.

Good luck, but anyone who knows the history is going to balk at it.

Best,
 

Cyrtenius

TFSmith121 said:
YAQW...

Walker, sure. Maybe even Wilkinson or even Burr...

Fremont? Not in a million years.

He was many things, but a filibuster he was not.

Good luck, but anyone who knows the history is going to balk at it.

Best,
Click to expand...

Hopefully people will enjoy it for what I intend to make this TL.
 
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