A Better Rifle at Halloween

[Sqdn19]

Initially they will seek a conventional analogy for tactical doctrine. IOTL the analogy was light naval forces, autonomous wheeled gunboats. In my concept they are wheeled cavalry with machine gun support and dismounts as part of the all arms battle.

HM’s Motor-Marines? It could also grow out of the semi-independent Scout units of the Boer War.

But the first thing my mind thinks of when I hear gun or torpedo boats on land is the Russian auxiliary Kamchatka…

Tread units that were developed to turn it into a half track.

I always forget how early the Model T came out.

 

[Peg Leg Pom]

The SAS Pink Land Rovers can be traced back to Model T's used in the Middle East in WWI

 

[jlckansas]

Any where a jeep or land rovers been, chances are a Model T has been there before in combat.

 

[diesal]

9th October 1914, Washington.

President Woodrow Wilson was enduring yet another cabinet meeting, the industrial chaos was worsening as the various labor unions began to call wild cat strikes and walk outs. Industrial output was beginning to decline, the Whitehouse switchboard was being besieged with angry calls, its postal office with letters and telegrams. Some of these were coming from the various industrialists whose businesses were being disrupted, but as many were coming from his progressive allies. The communications were of two types, either angry thast not enough was being done to supress the spreading industrial anarchy and bloodshed and prophesying doom if more wasn’t done to stop the spread of the unrest, with calls for the calling out of the national guard to the deployment of the army. The other type of letter took the opposite tack, it was just as strident in proclaiming the harbinger of doom and the collapse of the republic, but in this case it was the repression of the workers rights in the face of intransigent industrial brutality. They called for an expansion the right to strike and an immediate end to the use of strikebreakers and scab labor. They demanded the federal government cease acting against socialist newspapers, they wanted Wilson to sack half his cabinet and bring in a workers utopia.

The cabinet had just received a briefing from Benjamin Strong and Nelson Aldrich on the impact the unrest was having on the stability of the economy and the banking system at large.

The war in Europe was discussed with the French and Russian government bonds being sold on the New York Markets, these large bonds had sold well, better than expected, the recent battlefield successes combined with good rates had brought many of the previous sceptics onto the market. A smaller bond issue by the Belgians which was guaranteed by the Bank of England was oversubscribed sufficient to drive the coupon down by 120 points.

These bond sales were sufficient to impact other bond sales and the share market in general, the share prices of many industrial companies were sliding with investors weighing up the risk of further industrial unrest in the US versus the prospect of a swift entente victory in Europe. Much of the money raised in the bond sales was being recycled back into the US economy being used to place orders for everything from arms to food, however some was leaking out, Japan was a beneficiary with a large order for new rifles for Russia going to the Japanese in place of the American manufacturers. The purchasing agents had already been worried about the industrial unrest and had been caught up in a wildcat strike called at the Winchester Arms factory in New Haven Connecticut, they cancelled further discussions that day and a order was placed with the Tokyo Arsenal.

Strong was adamant that if Wilson and his cabinet didn’t get the situation under control soon the economic impact would grow, with the potential for a bank panic worse than that of 1907. The rest of the meeting was inconclusive with no firm decisions being made, Wilson's bleak mood was steadily worsening, he had worked through the meeting with a severe headache and went to bed that night feeling as though his head was caught in a vice.

 

[NotBigBrother]

Industrial output was beginning to decline, the Whitehouse switchboard was being besieged with angry calls, its postal office with letters and telegrams.

IOTL a phone line was in the White house then, but a telephone set was not yet in the Oval office on the Resolute desk.

 

[diesal]

IOTL a phone line was in the White house then, but a telephone set was not yet in the Oval office on the Resolute desk.

The first phone was installed in 1877, I assume by 1914 they would have had multiple lines and hence a switchboard operator. There is a mention of a switchboard by the time Hoover was President when he had a phone installed on his desk. in 1900 there were 600,000 line in the Bell System in America, by 1910 it was 5.8 million so I think it would be safe to assume at least a ten fold growth in phone lines into the White House between 1877 and 1914 necessitating a switchboard and hence operators. The first long distance call took place in July of 1914. I assume that as well as a phone switchboard there would have been some for of telegraph office contained in the Whitehouse, given its ubiquity in those days.

 

[Sqdn19]

When the Russians are buying most of their imported small arms from the Japanese, ten years after going to war with them, things must be quite bad in the US industrial scene.

But with more 6.5mm ammunition in the Tsarist logistics train, hopefully more of Mr Fedorov’s Automatic Rifles get purchased.

 

[jlckansas]

It is more than just small arms and ammunition that the Czars armies ordered. They ordered locomotives, rolling stock, rails for their railroads, they had started to look at having automobile and truck manufacturers set up factories in Russia to help them build their own in Russia. On the other hand the Russian aircraft industry was ahead of the US in its designs and production of aircraft. Just look at the Ilya Muromets bomber that they produced in 1914 in numbers to equip bomber squadrons.

 

[diesal]

Things are worse than IOTL but with better military performance the bond markets are happier and the Japanese are willing to offer better terms. They recognise that the entente is likely to win and that Japan needs to be on the best possible terms with Russia and Britain. More on Japan's position to follow.

When the Russians are buying most of their imported small arms from the Japanese, ten years after going to war with them, things must be quite bad in the US industrial scene.

But with more 6.5mm ammunition in the Tsarist logistics train, hopefully more of Mr Fedorov’s Automatic Rifles get purchased.

e

 

[Sqdn19]

It is more than just small arms and ammunition that the Czars armies ordered. They ordered locomotives, rolling stock, rails for their railroads, they had started to look at having automobile and truck manufacturers set up factories in Russia to help them build their own in Russia. On the other hand the Russian aircraft industry was ahead of the US in its designs and production of aircraft. Just look at the Ilya Muromets bomber that they produced in 1914 in numbers to equip bomber squadrons.

Indeed. The Arsenal of Democracy wasn’t just the case in the 2nd Round; I understand the US & Tsarist Russia were allies since the 1860s.

Also, isn’t the Ilya Muromets the only bomber to have a positive kill ratio for “dogfights” with enemy fighters?

 

[Somedevil]

So one thing that this timeline likely will cause with a shorter WWI is no Russian Revolution a off shoot of that is it's very likely Igor Sikorsky does not leave Russia/ Ukraine

 

[Salamander]

Wilson's bleak mood was steadily worsening, he had worked through the meeting with a severe headache and went to bed that night feeling as though his head was caught in a vice.

Why do I suspect that Wilson is going to have his stroke a few years early, possibly even a fatal one?

 

[diesal]

9th October 1914, Aguascalientes, Mexico
The tequila poured smoothly, the two men served different masters in the four-sided civil war that was imminent, but they were united by a new hatred. “Damn Gringos, they killed my cousin last week in Veracruz, I don’t care so much for Carranza but I hate the Yanquis so much more. This conference must succeed, if we fail we will fight and the Americans will get fatter than ever picking over our bones. They have taken so much from Mexico, let us be the men who put a stop to it.”
The other man, a native of Vera Cruz were even now American soldiers squatted, where the blood of the martyrs of freedom had been spilt. Could not agree more. “My Jefe and your Jefe will meet, this must come soon, let us do what we can to get all of them to forget their past hatreds and unite for the future.” The first man spoke again “Antonio, your words are correct, I will talk to Villa in the morning, we must accept the conditions of Carranza, let him bring his followers, let Obregon, Carranza, Villa and Zapata meet, they will fight and they will bicker. But let it be with words, lest we drown our precious Mexico in a sea of blood.”
Then Antonio Díaz Soto y Gama raised his glass, his hard eyes shining with agreement saying “To Mexico, unity and damnation to the Americans”

 

[diesal]

Why do I suspect that Wilson is going to have his stroke a few years early, possibly even a fatal one?

Well not to telegraph things yes and no (who is going to miss out on the chaos that actually happened irl)

 

[diesal]

I am coming up on the end of the is hitch, it’s possible that there will be no writing once I am out of the jungle. I hope to finalise the two big things that are cooking at the moment. But if I don’t my apologies, I don’t know why I have included Mexico, this thing sprawls already.

 

[Sqdn19]

No Mexican Civil War is a butterfly; I wonder if that would make the Zimmerman Telegram more or less of a threat.

 

[diesal]

No Mexican Civil War is a butterfly; I wonder if that would make the Zimmerman Telegram more or less of a threat.

I don’t think the Zimmerman telegram is even going to be a thing. The world is moving sideways from how things were in August 1914.

 

[Ramontxo]

That is certainly true. But the Telegram was an act of, nearly, desperation and the Germans are going to approach that state quite sooner in this TL than OTL. So an similar blunder is quite probable. Spain was quite divided at the time*...

*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragic_Week_(Spain)

 

[diesal]

Forgive me but

That is certainly true. But the Telegram was an act of, nearly, desperation and the Germans are going to approach that state quite sooner in this TL than OTL. So an similar blunder is quite probable. Spain was quite divided at the time*...

*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragic_Week_(Spain)

Forgive me but Spain? I know little of Spanish politics, is there any chance they would want a reprise of the Spanish American war? Please no more I have enough threads without more interesting things to read about.

 

[Ramontxo]

Forgive me but

Forgive me but Spain? I know little of Spanish politics, is there any chance they would want a reprise of the Spanish American war? Please no more I have enough threads without more interesting things to read about.

My point was that the telegram being avoided by the butterflies doesn't mean that when pressured to get an way out the Germans may commit an different but, maybe, as stupid blunder. The Spanish "Telegram" would be just a example of this (making France open its own two front war would be very tempting) and Spain being divided would give them hope. Remember that Mexico refused to accept the German offer. I never suggested Spain would accept it. Anyway this is one of my preferred TLs here. And what you plan to do with the German confronting defeat is one thing I wait to read.