An Age of Miracles Continues: The Empire of Rhomania
- Thread starter Basileus444
- Start date
Oh nice job you were right the artist has some truly great artwork!!
Personally i found this on reddit under the title "Byzantine Cyberpunk"
It also included an armenian district of Constantinople
Well we saw alot of that during the time of troubles but some things rhomania has now to keep their rulers in power is the lack of a strong nobel class and an aversion to free trade. This means that other empires will have a tough time trying to back other rulers since they don't have a way to really influence the local population. Another way of keeping things steady is the Emperors eyes, it dates back to the Andrean period and basically keeps tabs all over the place so if some general or high born starts talking about overthrowing the emperor their death will follow shortley. There's a whole bunch of other stuff that shows how stable the modern Rhomanian state is but that was just a few factors that came to mind
There also seems to have been a drift over the past few centuries toward it being a greater norm that there's a Ruling Dynasty, kiiiind of converging with western Europe. It's not airtight (as the Time of Troubles show) but having some sort of family claim to the throne counts for far more than it would have 500 years prior.
That and the army is being entirely paid in cash directly from the central government so their pay is directly dependent on whoever rules Constantinople.
That and the army is being entirely paid in cash directly from the central government so their pay is directly dependent on whoever rules Constantinople.
That's the biggest one I suspect. All those factors are important, but the central government having the army firmly in its pocket will nip just about any coup attempt in the bud.
Cryostorm
Monthly Donor
Yep, even today with things being easier for the citizenry to overthrow a government you still need the army to buy in for it to have a good shot at succeeding.
Trailer: What if Rome didn't fall? Cue Thunder striking an eagle which is set alight before a phoenix rises from the ashes.
I agree, it's near impossible to accurately portray all the details but I think the premise itself is sufficiently engaging. Now, all we need is lots of cash and a skilled team. Say, anybody out here happen to be a HBO producer?
Boanergés (vo.a.nerˈʝes in Constantinopolitan IPA pronunciation)
Ok so this is based on what I remember from this timeline.
1.) The crime of the 4th crusade basically wiped out the majority of the nobility class. Those who were left from the aftermath of 1204 was the strongest of the noblity in power and these are the Doukas, Komnenos, and Laskaris.
2.) Theodoros II Laskaris is born and does not die in his disease. In otl he favored the middle and lower classes and because he did not die this would drastically change the inefficiency of the empire on the days of the Angeloi from relying on the nobility, back to the highly meritocracy form of government that have since been practiced only to be lost due to the reformation by Alexios I Komnenos who had no choice but to do it in order for the empire to survive.
3.) Theodoros II Laskaris won the battle against Michael (I think it was Paleo) who was in favor of the nobility. This allows him to reform the Nicean (Roman) empire from a fledgling state into a regional power that would make them dominate all the other states around them.
(Kinda like Qin state of china)
4.) Fast forward after the death of Andreas I Komnenos his success would both doom and save the empire. The empire vastly stronger than its european and asian counterparts would soon be plague by constant wars both internal and external. This is the time were people call it the Time of Troubles. And yes, as you guess it Emperors come and go during this time period. The ToT would only end on the ascencion of the triumvirate.
5.) The triumvirate would slowly rebuild the empire's population, economy, military and the rule of law on the topic of succession. For the most part they were very successful, however the excessive marriage alliance on the latin west has only made the empire a target for the greedy west.
6.) Andreas the horny the last of the drakid dynasty who was married to Elizabeth. Who was also a cousin of the drakids but a german princess had a claim on throne of Ceasar's. Andreas Drakid died prematurely causing a succession issue since he didn't bed Elizabeth there's no child. Of course the Romans were not gonna allow her or her brother to take the throne. So during the night of Tocsin Demetrios Sideros rose up and took the throne as he was a roman 1st in line and administrator to boot.
7.) Then the Great Latin war happened and Demetrios alongside with his son Odysseus would make the prestige of the Sideros dynasty blossom. Their dynasty is very much supported both by the civil and military factions. Demetrios being an administrative genius, have laid the foundations for the modern Roman state. And Odysseus come his age as the emperor would bring the wrath of the Romans to their enemies. Which pretty much means their dynasty is solidly attached, and that removing them would equal to a civil war.
Only now just realized that I forgot to threadmark the update on the 5th (hope that explains the relatively low number of likes). Sorry about that. It is threadmarked now.
Yes, thank you.
As a Patreon member that has considered this a superlative work of fiction for years - planning for an adaptation is like planning for a trip to Mars.
Eparkhos
Banned
@Basileus444 I just caught up and I'd like to say this is an excellent timeline. Will the finished timelines page be updated anytime soon?
Yeah, once I read those arguments and was convinced I didn’t see any reason to have turtle ships, unless I wanted to include them just for some heavy war junks to blow them out of the water. And that just seemed mean.
In their defense, I don’t think the Chinese had any reason to expect the violent reaction on the part of the Korean yangban and peasantry. When I started reading about the OTL Imjin War I was really surprised by the number of Righteous Armies that rose up to harass the Japanese invaders.
Thanks for the suggestion.
The initial goal was Liaodong and Chinese supremacy over the Jurchen, but with the seizure of Pyongyang the Chinese have gotten more ambitious and seek to annex Korea. Plus there’s the Han and Tang precedent.
True. But I’m oddly a lot pickier about fiction than nonfiction books. Most new series I’ve discovered over the past few years have been by browsing the shelves at my local library, not an option right now.
I’ve been delving more into astronomy lately as a change from my usual history fare, and just finished a book about the Cambrian period which is new for me.
There are some, but at this point there still aren’t that many Japanese going to Constantinople. It’s a really long haul from Osaka to Constantinople. So the numbers are in the dozens, not the hundreds.
Cavalry: The cavalry aspect will become somewhat prominent in the next update, but Korea really isn’t good cavalry country. I believe there’s a Korean saying that if Korea was flat, it’d be the size of China. Plus this is the era where firearm-equipped infantry are really become the rulers of the battlefield, so the cavalry issue, while prominent, isn’t a game-changer by itself.
As for Japanese cavalry, given the difficulties of shipping, their army is almost all infantry. (I believe this matches the OTL Imjin War; I’m having a really hard time remembering any mentions of Japanese cavalry, although plenty of Korean and Chinese ones.) And their military trajectory is similar to OTL, as the geography and the political venue of the Sengoku Jidai era is still really similar to OTL, so not much has changed.
While I’m flattered that some people imagine this turning into an HBO show, the above matches my opinion pretty well. Having the story as-is I just don’t see working. All historical fantasy of which I’m familiar is still fairly well rooted in actual history. The viewpoint character(s) may be fictional, but they’re watching events that actually happened.
If I were to convert young Andreas I’s story into a book, I would convert the setting into a fantasy world while keeping the plot and characters. It’d be much easier to explain and sell that way, rather than “it’s an alternate history set late enough that it’s completely divorced from real events”, which wouldn’t sell to anyone not interested in a niche alternate history already.
Oooo, pretty.
Personally, I think the ‘incredibly unstable political system’ is a bit exaggerated. If you compare Byzantium to its contemporaries, the political strife seems consistent with other medieval states, be they England or the Abbasid Caliphate. Byzantium’s issue was that the political strife would often be combined with foreign pressure, and the double jeopardy is a killer.
That said, Excubitore covered most of it. One thing I’m going to be emphasizing in Not the End is the Laskarids working to break the nobility and convert them into a service nobility (which seems to have been a goal of Theodoros II IOTL). When you add university education being required for government service and regular pay in cash for the army, you have a structure where the nobility are incentivized to work with the state to get ahead, while those who won’t play ball are too weak to cause much trouble.
But, but I want a trip to Mars…
(Actually Enceladus or Europa probably should be more of a priority than Mars.)
Thank you.
I’d completely forgotten about those. I don’t have any plans for updating on those. The initial posts are from before the forum had the ability to threadmark posts. With the ability to threadmark the update posts allowing readers to just jump to the next update rather than fishing for it, I don’t see the purpose of the Finished TL page.
If you don't mind my asking, which book was that? I'm fascinated by the early Paleozoic and would love a recommendation to check out.
Cryostorm
Monthly Donor
Just change the Rhomanians to elves facing against upstart races on all sides but coming out ahead.
Unlike this Andreas the 1st one was sensible and responsible enough to do his 'duty' as a married man. If anything this Andreas would be another powder keg that can lead to another ToT. At first I was sad at his death but comparing him to various real life examples, I find that it was best if he died earlier and should have chosen Odysseus as his apparent heir in case of death.
Odysseus can act as the emperor until one of Andreas sons come of age, just like Basil II many step-father emperors.
But considering they're bastards they have issues with legitimacy and since the Sideros have a claim to the throne they can peacefully usurp the throne without any German invasion.
I’m gonna drop the patreon link again bc B444 isn’t big on shilling https://www.patreon.com/Basileus444