An Age of Miracles Continues: The Empire of Rhomania

Ooh. I sense a great deal of foreshadowing in this chapter. Though to be honest I kinda hope Nostradamus is full of it. I've never cared for "fortune tellers" or "fate" in stories, especially not ones that are otherwise fairly grounded in realism.

Either way, good chapter. I do sincerely hope that the Romans get a decisive win for once though.
 

Cryostorm

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I picture the modern Roman Empire being in the great power category. Whilst not having the population or material resources of some of the really big powers (think alt USA or Russia) they would have a lead in administration, organization and technical efficiency. A good example might be a nation with France or Austria-Hungary level of population and material resources, but with Germany’s organization and Britain’s financial acumen.

That seems about right, going by the 1625 map even the portions directly controlled by Constantinople would give them a modern population of ~150 million just by today's numbers and they can likely get much higher, probably between 180 - 200 million. If they can incorporate all the vassals you are looking at an easy 250 million people with just the core Mediterranean areas. Depending on what portions of the colonial territories enter the core empire you could likely have a population that is in the top five even today as shown below.

Resources is where it gets tricky but they are not exactly poor, not like Japan or Germany, and since there is unlikely to be an ATL USA that takes over North America that leaves whatever Russia forms and China as the resource giants but good relations with the Americas and Africa could go a long way to ameliorate that issue which would put the Roman empire at the top of the great power spectrum but well short of super power, at the moment only China has that potential in the TL.


World Population 2018
1 China 1,415,045,928
2 India 1,354,051,854
Roman Empire with vassals and colonies incorporated ~300,000,000 - 500,000,000: this one really depends on how much of the south east Asia, especially the OTL Philippines, they get/keep.
3 U.S. 326,766,748
4 Indonesia 266,794,980
Roman Empire with all vassals, especially Egypt, incorporated ~250,000,000
5 Brazil 210,867,954
6 Pakistan 200,813,818
7 Nigeria 195,875,237
8 Bangladesh 166,368,149
Roman Empire with current borders ~150,000,000
9 Russia 143,964,709
10 Mexico 130,759,074
 
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Well prophecy is likely just a red herring but it's always fun to speculate. So let's see...

"And the Lord of the West shall gather up a great host,
And the Lord of the East shall assemble a vast army,
And they shall battle with each other till all Europe trembles."


Check.


"The Great Turk shall usher into the fray,"


Check.


"Jerusalem shall come under his sway."

Not yet, but it's not far from Syria.

"And the Lord of the West shall be exalted,
And win glory on the fields of Philip.
The city of Constantine will hear the sound of thunder
And the Lord of the West will gain his prize."

Fields of Philip likely means Macedonia, where the next round of fighting will take place.

"As for the Lord of the East,
No one shall know where he sleeps.
But his seed shall journey west,
Where there shall be Antichrist."

So Demetrios will lie in an unmarked grave, while Odysseus flees to the west? Or maybe leads an expedition to Arles like the one discussed in this update? No idea who the Antichrist is. The Triune King seems most likely from context, but Nostradamus is court astrologer there so that seems quite risky if contemporary people came to the same conclusion.

"And his seed shall battle Antichrist,
The West will shudder with the noise of their battle,
Till Antichrist shall drive them out,
And they return unto the east.

Yet Antichrist shall follow them,
Till his hand reaches the city where the wise sleep.
And he shall sing in his heart,
That the world shall soon be his."

So Odysseus fights the Triune King but is forced to go home. "City where the wise sleep" might be Athens?

"But the sons of Leonidas shall sally forth,
With the sons of Xerxes at their side,
And the children of Solomon with them.
And even Antichrist shall quake at their might."

Not sure of sons of Leonidas refers specifically to Spartans/Peleponnesians specifically (would make sense if it's specifically about Athens, but there's probably not too many soldiers to mobilize there) or all Greeks in general. Children of Solomon are obviously the Ethiopians, while sons of Xerxes must be the Persians. I don't see the Ottomans throwing in with the Romans in any scenario, so maybe there's a split between Turkish Mesopotamia and the Persians in the Empire?

"But even such great power shall not be enough,
Till Russia shall march forth,
With a host no man can number.
And not even Antichrist shall be able to stand."

And in the last part the Russians join them as well, and they win! Seems way too straightforward to me. I suspect Basileus is tricking us and something completely different happens in the end :p

And the part about burning his enemies images strongly reminds me of Game of Thrones. It's not the first reference in this timeline, and it worked out perfectly in the show and book, so who knows? Maybe Casimir gets killed by a camp follower, Theodor falls on his head and Ibrahim gets killed by his Harem. One can hope...

 
Another update so soon!

So it's the worse case scenario for the Romans. Enemies on all sides. Persians and Georgians to the East. Germans, Poles, Lombards and Triunes to the West. No allies save for Scythia. Those are some steep odds, in there was a civil war it would be way worse than the ToT.

The Ethiopians, Khazaria and the Indians are still unaccounted for, but they're the most likely candidates to pitch into the Ottomans whilst they're distracted west.

I suspect in the short term, there won't be any major battles on the Balkan Front. The Romans no longer have the numbers and will resort to chipping away at the Allies as they starve, all the way until Constantinople which will be the new anvil. Theodor in his haste to secure the grand prize will neglect Greece, where the main thrust of the Roman counter-attack will come from.
 
A good example might be a nation with France or Austria-Hungary level of population and material resources, but with Germany’s organization and Britain’s financial acumen.
That's honestly an extremely powerful combination, with the addition of a vast colonial Empire too.

Henri is probably beside himself with ecstasy, this war is everything he wanted and more. With everything committed he can take his pick of pushing right up to the Rhine or taking Arles, his choice.

But as bleak as things look for the Romans there's still hope. A Georgian usurper, no matter how hellbent he is on the throne must realise that the Ottomans seizing the Levant is a death sentence. Ibrahim isn't his father, and recent events must have made him extremely over-confident in his chances.

The further the Allies push into Roman Territory the more stretched their supply lines are. The Roman army whilst depleted is still very much a threat, and Theodor has already shown that he will force his generals into disadvantageous strategic moves.

The Lombards may have made a huge mistake, yes they outmatch Sicily, but they have essentially turned their entire coastline into a Roman Naval shooting range, the economic damage will be huge.
 
One of the big grievances the Turks have is that since the conquest of Persia the Shahs have been becoming more and more Persian. So there’s a lot of ethnic tension between the Turks, who look down on the Persians as the guys they’ve conquered, and the Persians who view themselves as heirs to thousands of years of civilization and do make up the majority of the population of the empire as a whole. Some of the Turks are getting Persianized, but a lot are deliberately resisting that. The fact that most Turks live in Mesopotamia means that most receive little Persian influence.

On this subject what about the Azeris? Are they considered different from the Mesopotamian Turks by the government of the Ottoman Empire?
 
They all had pencil sketches of a male face, each one different. He was no artist like his son, but they were passable likenesses. He held up the first. “Casimir of Poland, noble warrior of God,” he sneered. “May a woman slay you.”

He held up the second. “Theodor of Bavaria, you who would gain the whole world. May you forfeit your mind instead.”

He held up the third. “Ibrahim of Persia, also so-called noble warrior of god. May a wo…no, should be different…hmm…eh…may a pair of women slay you.”

And he tossed the images into the flames.
"Say the name" ordered Melisandre
The leech agitated in the king's grip, trying to attack to one of his fingers "The usurper", said Stannis, "Joffrey Baratheon" He threw the leech in the fire, where she burnt.
Stannis took the second "The usurper" declared, this time at an higher voice "Balon Greyjoy". He threw the leech in the fire. The blood erupted, smoking by the heat.
The last of the three leeches was in the king's hand. And this last one, Stannis examined for a long moment while she moved in his fingers "The usurper" sentenced at the end "Robb Stark".
He threw her in the flames.
 
Another update so soon!

So it's the worse case scenario for the Romans. Enemies on all sides. Persians and Georgians to the East. Germans, Poles, Lombards and Triunes to the West. No allies save for Scythia. Those are some steep odds, in there was a civil war it would be way worse than the ToT.

The Ethiopians, Khazaria and the Indians are still unaccounted for, but they're the most likely candidates to pitch into the Ottomans whilst they're distracted west.

I suspect in the short term, there won't be any major battles on the Balkan Front. The Romans no longer have the numbers and will resort to chipping away at the Allies as they starve, all the way until Constantinople which will be the new anvil. Theodor in his haste to secure the grand prize will neglect Greece, where the main thrust of the Roman counter-attack will come from.

That the Ottomans would jump in was to be expected really. Too good an opportunity to let go.
 
Hum... Is that all? Given the norm previously established things are going too well for Rhomania so there is still more to come. Really it is the problem of setting up readers to expect to them fail in everything, you need things to go deep in shit to make them worry, and anything but losing on all fronts is a major success.
 
I think what would be make most interesting is if that the Russian unite and attack the Romans and the one who save them are the Ethiopian from the south and have them establish a huge kingdom
 
So just so I have this clear right now it’s the Roman Empire+despotates, Vlachia and Scythia against the HRE, Triunes, Lombards, Poland, Hungary with a concurrent war against the Ottoman Empire AND an intervention happening with Georgia.

I guess the good news is the Spanish are beating up on the Marinids so at least the corsairs will be temporarily less of a problem.

I see Demetrios bringing about massive tax reform including a graduated income tax “for the duration of the present crisis” and using the large increase in revenues to bring back the levee en masse on an empire wide scale. Let’s see how Rhomanias enemies like it when the Roman Empire has 500k men under arms and outnumbers the HRE and Ottomans combined.

I also have a gut feeling that the Ottomans have to be headed for their own version of the TOT. An empire as polyglot as the Ottomans are right now is primed for a good old multi sided civil war. If this invasion doesn’t go well and a proto-military industrial Roman army rampages through Mesopotamia AGAIN I can see the Turks and Arabs trying to throw off the Persian yoke.

One of my favourite timelines on the site and I always look forward to another update.
 

Deleted member 67076

The Spanish are still at war with the Andalusi? A pity, I'd had hoped Al Andalus could survive politically, but its likely the ethnic group will still be around today.
 
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