Sports What Ifs.

[AltSptHst]

Have any of you seen these videos?

http://www.nfl.com/videos/n-if-l/0ap...ed-to-New-York

This is one installment in a series that Dave Dameshek has been doing. It deals with Eli not being traded to the Giants.

Dameshek thinks that Rivers would have won the same SB's that Big Ben won in Pittsburgh, but I disagree. The Steelers wouldn't have done as well the last several years without Roethlisberger.

And What about what if the World Football League Gets Merged by the National Football League in 1975 could we see a super bowl between the Birmingham Vulcans vs. Dallas Cowboys?

WFL Merger? Interesting. I don't think that we see those teams playing in a SB for a while, though.

As for the above N "if" L scenario, here's what I see happening: I think that Eli Manning doesn't hold out, and competes for the job with a motivated Drew Brees and loses. I also see Warner playing for a half of the season before seeing Big Ben take over, and Rivers still comes in for Maddox in OTL.

At the end of the 04 season, though, the Steelers win the division, but only win 10 games as opposed to 15 with Big Ben. The Chargers still win the West as in OTL, and the Giants miss the playoffs. The Pats have home field with a 15-1 record, the Colts are the 2 seed, SD the three, and Pitt the four. Denver goes to SD and knocks them off, sending them to Foxboro, and the Jets upset the Steelers.

Denver loses in the snow, and the Jets lose to the Colts, setting up another Brady-Manning AFC Title Game. Unlike the week before, though, it isn't as snowy out, but the Pats still find a way to win and take the Super Bowl two weeks later.

The next year, though, Big Ben leads the Giants to the SB against the Colts, who pull it out with a late TD pass. As for Eli in SD, after sitting on the bench behind Brees for another season, he is in against the Broncos in Week 17, and tears his rotator cuff. So, the team re-signs Brees to a 4 year extension, and he takes them to the Super Bowl in 06, beating the Bears.

Manning recovers, and the Chargers decide to trade him in the preseason of 07 to the Falcons, who just lost Michael Vick due to dog fighting.

 

[The Dude Bro]

Here's something I've been thinking about,

-Before WWII, hockey was relatively popular in Britain. How would it be possible for the game to remain popular (and be a strong fourth sport) on a nationwide level? The sport seems to do well in smaller towns and cities, but when it comes to the bigger ones (outside of Nottingham, Sheffield, Coventry, and counting Northern Ireland, Belfast), it doesn't seem to do as well.

Perhaps have Coventry avoid getting firebombed during the Blitz. After the war, it becomes a sort of Mecca for hockey, and eventually forms a major hockey league with the other three towns mentioned above and the largest of the smaller cities. Eventually, hockey hits it big as a winter alternative to hockey, especially in northern England and Scotland.

 

[The Dude Bro]

As a bit of a fun game, let's face-off the runners up in both the AFC and NFC championships (and before the merger, the AFL and NFL championships) in the Super Bowl:

Super Bowl I (1966): Buffalo Bills (I) vs. Dallas Cowboys (I)

Super Bowl II (1967): Houston Oilers (I) vs. Dallas Cowboys (II)

Super Bowl III (1968): Oakland Raiders (I) vs. Cleveland Browns (I)

Super Bowl IV (1969): Oakland Raiders (II) vs. Cleveland Browns (II)

Super Bowl V (1970): Oakland Raiders (III) vs. San Francisco 49ers (I)

Super Bowl VI (1971): Baltimore Colts (I) vs. San Francisco 49ers (II)

Super Bowl VII (1972): Pittsburgh Steelers (I) vs. Dallas Cowboys (III)

Super Bowl VIII (1973): Oakland Raiders (IV) vs. Dallas Cowboys (IV)

Super Bowl IX (1974): Oakland Raiders (V) vs. Los Angeles Rams (I)

Super Bowl X (1975): Oakland Raiders (VI) vs. Los Angeles Rams (II)

Super Bowl XI (1976): Pittsburgh Steelers (II) vs. Los Angeles Rams (III)

Super Bowl XII (1977): Oakland Raiders (VII) vs. Minnesota Vikings (I)

Super Bowl XIII (1978): Houston Oilers (II) vs. Los Angeles Rams (IV)

Super Bowl XIV (1979): Houston Oilers (III) vs. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (I)

Super Bowl XV (1980): San Diego Chargers (I) vs. Dallas Cowboys (V)

Super Bowl XVI (1981): San Diego Chargers (II) vs. Dallas Cowboys (VI)

Super Bowl XVII (1982): New York Jets (I) vs. Dallas Cowboy (VII)

Super Bowl XVIII (1983): Seattle Seahawks (I) vs. San Francisco 49ers (III)

Super Bowl XIX (1984): Pittsburgh Steelers (III) vs. Chicago Bears (I)

Super Bowl XX (1985): Miami Dolphins (I) vs. Los Angeles Rams (V)

Super Bowl XXI (1986): Cleveland Browns (III) vs. Washington Redskins (I)

Super Bowl XXII (1987): Cleveland Browns (IV) vs. Minnesota Vikings (II)

Super Bowl XXIII (1988): Buffalo Bills (II) vs. Chicago Bears (II)

Super Bowl XXIV (1989): Cleveland Browns (V) vs. Los Angeles Rams (VI)

Super Bowl XXV (1990): Los Angeles Raiders (VIII) vs. San Francisco 49ers (IV)

Super Bowl XXVI (1991): Denver Broncos (I) vs. Detroit Lions (I)

Super Bowl XXVII (1992): Miami Dolphins (II) vs. San Francisco 49ers (V)

Super Bowl XXVIII (1993): Kansas City Chiefs (I) vs. San Francisco 49ers (VI)

Super Bowl XXIX (1994): Pittsburgh Steelers (IV) vs. Dallas Cowboys (VIII)

Super Bowl XXX (1995): Indianapolis Colts (II) vs. Green Bay Packers (I)

Super Bowl XXXI (1996): Jacksonville Jaguars (I) vs. Carolina Panthers (I)

Super Bowl XXXII (1997): Pittsburgh Steelers (V) vs. San Francisco 49ers (VII)

Super Bowl XXXIII (1998): New York Jets (II) vs. Minnesota Vikings (III)

Super Bowl XXXIV (1999): Jacksonville Jaguars (II) vs. Tampa Bay Buccaneers (II)

Super Bowl XXXV (2000): Oakland Raiders (IX) vs. Minnesota Vikings (IV)

Super Bowl XXXVI (2001): Pittsburgh Steelers (VI) vs. Philadelphia Eagles (I)

Super Bowl XXXVII (2002): Tennessee Titans (IV) vs. Philadelphia Eagles (II)

Super Bowl XXXVIII (2003): Indianapolis Colts (III) vs. Philadelphia Eagles (III)

Super Bowl XXXIX (2004): Pittsburgh Steelers (VII) vs. Atlanta Falcons (I)

Super Bowl XXXX (2005): Denver Broncos (II) vs. Carolina Panthers (II)

Super Bowl XXXXI (2006): New England Patriots (I) vs. New Orleans Saints (I)

Super Bowl XXXXII (2007): San Diego Chargers (III) vs. Green Bay Packers (II)

Super Bowl XXXXIII (2008): Baltimore Ravens (I) vs. Philadelphia Eagles (IV)

Super Bowl XXXXIV (2009): New York Jets (III) vs. Minnesota Vikings (V)

Super Bowl XXXXV (2010): New York Jets (IV) vs. Chicago Bears (III)

Super Bowl XXXXVI (2011): Baltimore Ravens (II) vs. San Francisco 49ers (VIII)

Super Bowl XXXXVII (2012): New England Patriots (II) vs. Atlanta Falcons (II)

 

[AltSptHst]

What if the San Francisco Giants won the 2002 World Series?

If Dusty stays after the win, he may not have went to Chicago, and the Bartman thing may have been butterflied away.

Also, Kerry Wood and Mark Prior may have had longer careers without playing for Dusty because of how hard Dusty works pitchers. That is one of the major criticisms against him.

 

[dsp19]

Big 4 American Sports

Baseball: Dave Roberts is caught stealing at 2nd base in Game 4 of the ALCS. The Yankees sweep the Red Sox and the Curse of the Bambino lives on, as Boston succumbs to Cleveland in 2007 with the memories of that defeat playing on them psychologically

Ted Williams and Joe DiMaggio are traded for each other...both put up even better stats playing in ballparks that are better suited for their skills, but the Yankees still dominate the Sox

Branca strikes out Bobby Thomson and induces a rookie CF named Willie Mays to pop up to 2nd; Brooklyn wins the pennant and finally beats the Yanks in 7 in 1951

Willie McCovey's line drive is three feet to Bobby Richardson's right in the bottom of the 9th inning in Game 7 of the 1962 WS...the Giants beat the Yankees 2-1 to win the series

Don Denkinger gets the call right at 1st in the STL-KC World Series Game 6; Cardinals win the Series

NFL:

Norwood's kick is good and Buffalo wins SB XXV 22-20 (the most obvious NFL WI)

The Saints draft Lawrence Taylor with the #1 overall pick in 1981. His career is wasted on some bad Saints teams. The Giants pick George Rogers and his career is curtailed by injuries; the Giants futility (at the time, 18 years without a playoff win) continues for at least another 4-5 years, and they do not win a SB under Parcells

Mo Lewis does not KO Drew Bledsoe in a 2001 Jets-Patriots game...Tom Brady does not get off the bench in time to save New England's season, and the Patriots dynasty is delayed or possibly curtailed

49ers draft Aaron Rodgers instead of Alex Smith with the #1 pick in 2005

The Eli Manning trade falls through...Eli is a Charger and Roethlisberger is drafted by the Giants. Eli is beaten out by Drew Brees in SD and is traded to New Orleans, where he leads his dad's team to a SB in 2009. Roethlisberger wins at least one SB in Giants blue, while the Steelers are still searching for a QB

 

[FDW]

49ers draft Aaron Rodgers instead of Alex Smith with the #1 pick in 2005

This has already been covered earlier in the thread. Given that Nolan didn't like Rodgers as much, and that Rodgers wasn't pro-ready at the time of drafting, he would've failed entirely, ensuring that The Niners would be firmly entrenched in the bottom feeders (not even getting the shot to rise to mediocre underachievers that make the playoffs irregularly that Alex Smith gave them) for a few more years until someone competent is hired. Alex Smith is regarded as a much better QB because of this, and Aaron Rodgers is one of the great busts)

 

[athleticsfan2kx]

How About

What if Heisman Trophy Winner, Robert Griffin III gets drafted by The Indianapolis Colts as the 1st Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft?, What will happen to Andrew Luck if he gets the 2nd pick by playing for the Washington Redskins?

Did the Detroit Lions draft Gerald McCoy (DT), Then the Buccaneers draft Trent Williams (OT) making the First 3 Picks who got Selected from the University of Oklahoma.

And What if John Elway got drafted to the Oakland Raiders in 1983 if they had not relocated to Los Angeles in 1982?

 

[dsp19]

How About

What if Heisman Trophy Winner, Robert Griffin III gets drafted by The Indianapolis Colts as the 1st Pick in the 2012 NFL Draft?, What will happen to Andrew Luck if he gets the 2nd pick by playing for the Washington Redskins?

Did the Detroit Lions draft Gerald McCoy (DT), Then the Buccaneers draft Trent Williams (OT) making the First 3 Picks who got Selected from the University of Oklahoma.

And What if John Elway got drafted to the Oakland Raiders in 1983 if they had not relocated to Los Angeles in 1982?

Washington loses the NFC East to the Giants in 2012 (they finish 7-9 while NYG goes 10-6, beating them 2x), but is more properly set to be championship contenders down the line as Luck emerges unscathed physically. WSH spends their 4th round pick on someone not named Kirk Cousins.

McCoy still busts, but that's a pretty good feat for OU; Trent Williams' career is probably similar to OTL

Elway drafted by the Raiders is ASB, they drafted 26th in OTL and would have to give up the house for the #1 pick...they were still a competent organization at the time. A more intriguing scenario is if the Bears traded up with Baltimore (they had the 6th pick in 1983) to get Elway...they would have won multiple SBs barring a serious injury to Elway

 

[High Plains Drifter]

If Dusty stays after the win, he may not have went to Chicago, and the Bartman thing may have been butterflied away.

Also, Kerry Wood and Mark Prior may have had longer careers without playing for Dusty because of how hard Dusty works pitchers. That is one of the major criticisms against him.

Yes!!! Dusty Baker, hater of rookies and destroyer of pitchers. He's like some Hindu God.


Baker is actually a decent manager, and even well above average when given a roster designed to his comfort zone, but without crummy players he's weirdly enamoured with (hello Neifi Perez). Its just that his few faults are so glaring: A) not respecting the walk as a component of offense, B) not willing to give young players a proper shot at earning a starting position, and C) not paying enough attention to pitch counts for young arms, it drives the Sabermetrically inclined CRAZY!!!!

Note: Wood had already had Tommy John surgery long before Baker was on the scene and was probably overused in the 3 years after surgery, but before Baker came on the scene. High rates of strike outs and base on balls issued means he's throwing a ton of pitches almost every start.

 

[Chris Oakley]

Just for a change of pace, let's ponder some future history sports WIs:

--The Detroit Lions go bankrupt.

--India makes a major investment in its national soccer team and turns it into a World Cup contender.

--A major U.S. pro sports franchise suffers a tragedy similar to the 1958 Munich air crash that devastated Manchester United.

 

[AltSptHst]

Spygate

Just for a change of pace, let's ponder some future history sports WIs:

--The Detroit Lions go bankrupt.

--India makes a major investment in its national soccer team and turns it into a World Cup contender.

--A major U.S. pro sports franchise suffers a tragedy similar to the 1958 Munich air crash that devastated Manchester United.

A few more:

--After Shady Brady and Bill Belicheat retire, Matt Walsh and Drew Bledsoe come out with a tell-all book about the 2001 season and the origins of the Spygate situation. Also, Doug Flutie finally talks with Dan LeBatard about the plays coming into the QB's helmet longer than allowed.

--Peyton Manning and the Broncos win the next two Super Bowls. Then, after a two year hiatus, Brock Osweiler leads them to three more SB victories. Broncos are team of 2010's.

--Nick Saban leaves Alabama for USC in 2020.

--Pete Carroll leads Seahawks to Super Bowl in 2015. Two years later, he leaves to go back to the college ranks, this time at Arizona State.

LeBron and Wade only win two more titles together. LeBron never comes close to MJ's six.

 

[FDW]

--Peyton Manning and the Broncos win the next two Super Bowls. Then, after a two year hiatus, Brock Osweiler leads them to three more SB victories. Broncos are team of 2010's.

--Pete Carroll leads Seahawks to Super Bowl in 2015. Two years later, he leaves to go back to the college ranks, this time at Arizona State.

The Broncos dynasty is sheer ASB if the Chargers, Chiefs and Raiders have anything to say about that. However, I consider it relatively likely that The Broncos could make maybe one Super Bowl this decade, though not with Peyton.

As for The Seahawks, that's a possibility, but Carroll might stay if things start looking dynasty in Seattle. (Which is a greater possibility in Seattle than Denver, given how young and talented the team is.)

 

[phx1138]

What if Bill France had never formed NASCAR?

What if Wally Parks hadn't formed NHRA?

What if Big hadn't built rear-engined diggers?

What if Shirley had never gotten her pro licence?

What if Mendy Fry had made it into TF/FC?

What if Erica Enders does make it into TF? (With that reaction time? Watch out!)

 

[AltSptHst]

The Broncos dynasty is sheer ASB if the Chargers, Chiefs and Raiders have anything to say about that. However, I consider it relatively likely that The Broncos could make maybe one Super Bowl this decade, though not with Peyton.

As for The Seahawks, that's a possibility, but Carroll might stay if things start looking dynasty in Seattle. (Which is a greater possibility in Seattle than Denver, given how young and talented the team is.)

I don't think that those teams will stand in the way of the Broncos, at least not the Chiefs and Raiders. SD is building a good D, though, but they need more in the secondary and O-line.

As for Seattle, the NFC will be tough for the next few years. They have less chance of a dynasty than Denver. The Niners, Packers, and Falcons are all strong contenders, and the Bears, Lions, and Saints have potential.

 

[Chris Oakley]

As for Seattle, the NFC will be tough for the next few years. They have less chance of a dynasty than Denver.

Especially if Carroll stays head coach past the 2013 season. The man isn't fit to run an Arena League expansion squad, much less an NFL team.

 

[FDW]

I don't think that those teams will stand in the way of the Broncos, at least not the Chiefs and Raiders. SD is building a good D, though, but they need more in the secondary and O-line.

The Raiders have more pieces in place (especially on Offense) than many people give them credit for, and KC's huge talent pool (They sent six people to the Pro Bowl despite going 2-14) means that they can't really be counted out.

As for Seattle, the NFC will be tough for the next few years. They have less chance of a dynasty than Denver. The Niners, Packers, and Falcons are all strong contenders, and the Bears, Lions, and Saints have potential.

The Niners have some serious aging and salary cap issues coming to a head in the next few years, The Packers and Falcons are overrated, The Bears are a paper tiger, and The Lions and Saints have a lot of question marks surrounding them. The Vikings, Redskins, and Buccaneers are also potential threats, though they each have their own flaws. And there's also Arizona and St. Louis within the division, though the former depends on what QB lands in the desert, and the latter depends on how their young players improve. But Russell Wilson has shown himself to be somebody, and he could end tearing up the NFC over the next several years, especially with their stellar supporting cast.

Especially if Carroll stays head coach past the 2013 season. The man isn't fit to run an Arena League expansion squad, much less an NFL team.

Complete bullshit, he's taken his team to the playoffs twice in his three years there, winning at least once in the post-season both times while developing a shitload of young talent on both sides of the ball.

 

[dilbert719]

--A major U.S. pro sports franchise suffers a tragedy similar to the 1958 Munich air crash that devastated Manchester United.

All four major sports have a plan in place to resolve this kind of situation (by the by, not that it's a major US franchise, but for another example of this, you need only look at the Lokomotiv Yaroslavl plane crash that occurred in September of 2011.)

The plans are, IIRC, not all for public consumption, but they do exist. There was a TL on here by TRoehl, called 1992: MLB's Black Wednesday in Atlanta, wherein the Pittsburgh Pirates suffered just that kind of catastrophic accident. (I went to look the thread up, since it's worth reviewing if you're interested. It's a damn shame that it was never completed; for that matter, it never made it to the disaster draft. There was some great discussion, though.)

When that thread came up, I did a little digging into this, since the plan intrigued me, and while I couldn't get much on MLB's disaster plan, here's what I did get:

MLB's disaster draft kicks in when either 5/6+ players from a team (different sources give different numbers) die or suffer a career ending injury at the same time. Every team submits an unknown number of players to the league that would be protected; the drafting team selects from the unprotected players until they refill their roster. It is not clear, but it seems likely that the rules stipulate that only one player from a given team may be selected by the drafting team, after which all the other players from the team losing a player would come out of the pool.

 

[RySenkari]

The Minneapolis Lakers were in a plane crash in the 1950s, it's said they managed to crash-land in the "perfect cornfield", which allowed the plane to have as soft a crash landing as possible with no injuries or deaths. It's very possible that the plane could have gone the way of Buddy Holly's plane.

 

[dsp19]

Another couple of NFL what ifs

WI Peyton Manning declares for the NFL draft after his junior year? The Jets had the #1 pick in 1996, and rumor was the only reason Peyton stayed a Tennessee Volunteer in 1997 was because he didn't want to play for the Jets. If Peyton goes and the Jets draft him, the Peyton-Brady rivalry is even more fierce than in OTL.

WI the New York Giants force Jim Lee Howell into retirement in 1958 after "the greatest game ever played" and hire either Vince Lombardi (their offensive coordinator) or Tom Landry (their defensive coordinator as HC? Either coach guarantees the Giants a dynasty between 1959-1963 instead of four more NFL championship game losses. Lombardi as Giants HC makes Giants-Cowboys an even bigger rivalry, especially if Landry goes to the expansion Cowboys (like in OTL).

Lastly, WI Joe Gilliam doesn't succumb to his drug addictions, stays healthy, and beats out Terry Bradshaw for the Steelers QB job in the early 1970s? He actually beat out Bradshaw for a short time in 1974

 

[AltSptHst]

WI Peyton Manning declares for the NFL draft after his junior year? The Jets had the #1 pick in 1996, and rumor was the only reason Peyton stayed a Tennessee Volunteer in 1997 was because he didn't want to play for the Jets. If Peyton goes and the Jets draft him, the Peyton-Brady rivalry is even more fierce than in OTL.

WI the New York Giants force Jim Lee Howell into retirement in 1958 after "the greatest game ever played" and hire either Vince Lombardi (their offensive coordinator) or Tom Landry (their defensive coordinator as HC? Either coach guarantees the Giants a dynasty between 1959-1963 instead of four more NFL championship game losses. Lombardi as Giants HC makes Giants-Cowboys an even bigger rivalry, especially if Landry goes to the expansion Cowboys (like in OTL).

Lastly, WI Joe Gilliam doesn't succumb to his drug addictions, stays healthy, and beats out Terry Bradshaw for the Steelers QB job in the early 1970s? He actually beat out Bradshaw for a short time in 1974

For the Manning one, someone has a timeline on this site about that. If the Jets got Peyton, I wonder if Parcells retires after 1999. If he does, maybe Belichick stays instead of going to New England. If Bill stays with the Jets, I wonder if QB coach Dick Rehbein comes with him. If he does, then maybe they draft Brady to be Peyton's backup(that would be wild to think about today, but at the time, not that surprising).

For the Howell one, I think that Lombardi gets the nod to replace him. Then, Landry goes to Dallas as in OTL. As for the Pack, I don't know what becomes of them. Maybe they suck for another decade until they hire Joe Paterno as Coach and GM in 1969.

As for Gilliam, I think that his problem was that he was too pass-happy. Bradshaw got the running game involved more than Gilliam. Al Davis has also taken credit for the Steelers going back to Bradshaw. He said that Terry wanted Al to trade for him. He said he wouldn't, but that he would put in a good word for him.