Supposing the Mormons weren't driven from the Midwest, but instead people responded positively to Joseph Smith's message, and it became the dominant religion in the region. However, the other regions of the United States still resisted converting to Mormonism.
WI Mormonism becomes dominant religion in the Midwest
- Thread starter Galba Otho Vitelius
- Start date
If in Illinois, the Mormons become a very wealthy demographic. In the 1840s, prior to the Mormons being driven out, Nauvoo was about the size of Chicago. So, let's assume the Mormons do not get driven out.
For them not to be driven out, you probably need to either avoid the tensions, or have what happened in Missouri shock the country's conscience (maybe a worse Massacre at Haun's Mill). Historically, 21 people were killed. Make that death toll in the triple digits - or even wipe that settlement out. Once the country's conscience is so shocked, it is likely that Joseph Smith survives 10-15 years longer. He might still be martyred, probably because he held abolitionist beliefs, but by then, who knows what - or who - he may influence.
That makes it a major power in the state. So much so, that I think they end up creating a "Mormon Corridor" through most of Southern Illinois, Iowa, northern Missouri, and they may start to even go further west or north. In fact, a strong Nauvoo opens an interesting possibility. Perhaps Abraham Lincoln becomes the first Mormon president?
For them not to be driven out, you probably need to either avoid the tensions, or have what happened in Missouri shock the country's conscience (maybe a worse Massacre at Haun's Mill). Historically, 21 people were killed. Make that death toll in the triple digits - or even wipe that settlement out. Once the country's conscience is so shocked, it is likely that Joseph Smith survives 10-15 years longer. He might still be martyred, probably because he held abolitionist beliefs, but by then, who knows what - or who - he may influence.
That makes it a major power in the state. So much so, that I think they end up creating a "Mormon Corridor" through most of Southern Illinois, Iowa, northern Missouri, and they may start to even go further west or north. In fact, a strong Nauvoo opens an interesting possibility. Perhaps Abraham Lincoln becomes the first Mormon president?
Alternatively one could change some of their early beliefs and it would probably be tolerated better as well.
I think its an interesting question
I agree on the need for an early POD that pre-dates Smith's death. Once you have that martyrdom the LDS movement as a whole was very much moving towards a "safety by isolation" migration movement. Whilst some groups did stay behind, you'll never get them staying in a majority in the midwest.
However, I don't think a worse massacre would really help. Personally I don't see 1840s society being that shocked by the murder of LDS believers in greater numbers, and if you go high enough to unarguably shock wider society (high hundreds, say) the demographic damage you do to the early faith is too hard to recover easily from.
The real problem, is how do you keep the majority of Mormons in Illinois long enough to form a majority WITHOUT the OTL fears of a theocracy and general hostility to the LDS faith that Mormonism provoked?
Problems
Whether this would be enough to convert a high enough % of people in even Illinois, I don't know, but in the 19th century cities were where the power was.
I agree on the need for an early POD that pre-dates Smith's death. Once you have that martyrdom the LDS movement as a whole was very much moving towards a "safety by isolation" migration movement. Whilst some groups did stay behind, you'll never get them staying in a majority in the midwest.
However, I don't think a worse massacre would really help. Personally I don't see 1840s society being that shocked by the murder of LDS believers in greater numbers, and if you go high enough to unarguably shock wider society (high hundreds, say) the demographic damage you do to the early faith is too hard to recover easily from.
The real problem, is how do you keep the majority of Mormons in Illinois long enough to form a majority WITHOUT the OTL fears of a theocracy and general hostility to the LDS faith that Mormonism provoked?
Problems
- Illinois is rapidly growing in terms of population, with lots of migrants arriving each year.
- Non-LDS feared the overreach of the Mormons - the more powerful they get the more tension they provoke.
- Smith and others could abuse their power, creating more hostility.
- For the average non-Mormon in the 1840s the faith is WEIRD. Seriously WEIRD. And that provokes more hostility. Forget an ATL Lincoln being the first Mormon President - think how hard Kennedy had to fight against anti-Catholic prejudice in the 1960s!
- The British migrants - the LDS mission to Britain is already underway (1839) and in the 1850s will bear huge emigration fruit. OTL these people went to Utah, but ATL they will be a huge influx into Illinois, particularly bolstering Nauvoo.
- Nauvoo itself, as @fb111a noted, is an impressive city. If the LDS can turn it into an industrial powerhouse, they might well rule the roost.
Whether this would be enough to convert a high enough % of people in even Illinois, I don't know, but in the 19th century cities were where the power was.
Why do people keep assuming ASB so quickly? Can we at least go through all the possibilities before arriving up to that point?
The LDS Church can grow to a large degree, but I don't know if they would stay in the Midwst for that to happen.
Yea, if this wasnt part of the original beliefs and perhaps Smith's revelations are presented a bit differently, I think Mormonism could have gotten much larger in the time period. Heck, Polygamy is still a bad reputation spot on the Mormon's
Which is ironic given how Biblical figures such as Abraham practiced it.
MrP
Banned
Avoiding self-segregation might help them get along better with their non-LDS neighbours. One problem, I think, was the ban on both alcoholic and "hot" drinks. If you can't drink liquor, coffee or even tea, what is left in 19th-century America to socialise over with the Gentiles?
More unity with the Mormon Movement would have helped, at least in Missouri. Part of the Reason for the 1838 Mormon war was that the Ohio branch had a schism with Joseph Smith causing him to move the Headquarters to Missouri. This caused a massive movement of people which freaked out the locals starting the violence. If unity had been maintained and the HQ stayed in Ohio, at least for a little longer. Settlement would slow down and the locals could get used to the Mormons before a larger movement happened.