When was the closest point a Plantagenet (of Yorkist descent) could've returned back to the throne after 1485?

[Domz]

There appears to be tons of Plantagenets (of the female line) despite Henry VII and Henry VIII attempting to eradicate them all (or am I wrong). Despite this, all succeeding dynasties after the Plantagenets until Saxe-Coburg and Gotha all seem to have some sort of fertility issue (that and being Catholic in 1700). So when was there a point, or the closest point, where Parliament could've turned to a Plantagenet (Yorkist) descendant when a current English ruling dynasty was running out of eligible members, had there been a few more deaths in the right positions?

Since it seems almost impossible to have a Yorkist to return to the throne after Henry VII's children has kids, lets say that Henry VII fails to have kids or if all of his children were infertile (Margaret, Henry VIII, Mary), who would be his successor? Would it be closest genealogical Yorkist claim or would it be the closest Yorkist claim with court power?

 

[ordinarylittleme]

Elizabeth I died single and childless, so at that point, a Plantagenet could have been found if the Stuarts were suppressed beforehand

 

[material_boy]

The son of George of Clarence was the only male line Plantagenet left. So unless he escapes, weds, and has his own sons, then the dynasty ends no matter what due to the patriarchal nature of Western European families.

 

[Insane Ranter]

The son of George of Clarence was the only male line Plantagenet left. So unless he escapes, weds, and has his own sons, then the dynasty ends no matter what due to the patriarchal nature of Western European families.

What about Edward Plantagenet, 17th Earl of Warwick?

 

[Viking25]

The son of George of Clarence was the only male line Plantagenet left. So unless he escapes, weds, and has his own sons, then the dynasty ends no matter what due to the patriarchal nature of Western European families.

Even then the Tudors were also Plantagenet Descendants. In fact all the English Royal Houses after them have descended from them. So its kind of odd to have this question be asked at all. Like does Henry VIII being the son of the daughter of a Plantagenet King not make him a Plantagenet Descendant?

 

[ordinarylittleme]

What about Edward Plantagenet, 17th Earl of Warwick?

Too distantly removed

 

[Viking25]

Too distantly removed

How was he distant? His Dad was literally the older brother of the Last Plantagenet King(The Yorks were mainline descendants of the Plantagenets and I honestly think the entire reason their considered a seperate house at all is to differentiate them from the Lancasters)! Thats like the opposite of distant. Hell you could even argue the throne should have gone to him instead of Richard.

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

What about Edward Plantagenet, 17th Earl of Warwick?

But he was son of George of Clarence, so you and @material_boy are talking about the same person.

The son of George of Clarence was the only male line Plantagenet left. So unless he escapes, weds, and has his own sons, then the dynasty ends no matter what due to the patriarchal nature of Western European families.

Not necessarily, if we believe Perkin Warbeck to be legit Richard of Shrewsbury, him succeeding would also mean the continuation of Plantagenets.

 

[Grey Wolf]

Obviously, if you are looking at female descended Plantagenets then John de la Pole and the Battle of Stoke in 1487

If you aren't talking female descent, then you have to find a way to get Edward, Earl of Warwick to be something other than Henry VII's prisoner, and not get himself executed to boot.

 

[Tyler96]

I mean, Henry VII slips over, hits his head, and dies an hour after Bosworth, and Edward Plantagenet is made king?

There appears to be tons of Plantagenets despite Henry VII and Henry VIII attempting to eradicate them all. Despite this, all succeeding dynasties after the Plantagenets until Saxe-Coburg and Gotha all seem to have some sort of fertility issue (that and being Catholic in 1700). So when was there a point, or the closest point, where Parliament could've turned to a Plantagenet descendant when a current English ruling dynasty was running out of eligible members, had there been a few more deaths in the right positions?

I mean, that's just... not true? The Plantagenets went extinct in the male line in 1499 with the execution of Edward, Earl of Warwick, and the last living legitimate Plantagenet was his sister who was executed in 1541. Even if you count illegitimate Plantagenets, that only extends to Edward IV's bastard Arthur, who died in 1542, and his daughters.

And if you by Plantagenets you mean ''people with Plantagenet blood'' then... Henry Tudor (as a descendant of John of Gaunt) and every subsequent English monarch (descendants of Henry and Elizabeth of York) would count?

 

[RedKing]

As others have said, a male line Plantagenet restoration is tricky to pull off at this time, since Edward of Warwick is the last one. The easiest way to get him on the throne is for Henry VII to have only daughters, which winds up in him deciding to marry his eldest daughter to Warwick in order to secure his throne and unite the claims. Other than that it is very difficult, since Warwick needs to escape prison, marry, have issue and then topple the Tudors as well as consolidate his power base.

 

[ordinarylittleme]

Even if Henry VII had only daughters he would not pair his daughter off to Warwick who offered little other than his bloodline especially as he can get foreign alliances...Warwick will be shunted into monastery or go the way of his wife's brothers...

 

[pandizzy]

What about Edward Plantagenet, 17th Earl of Warwick?

That's the person they are talking about.

 

[Major Major]

Does Charles Somerset count? Will Bunter Beaufort do today?

 

[material_boy]

Obviously, if you are looking at female descended Plantagenets then John de la Pole and the Battle of Stoke in 1487

But what would be the difference between de la Pole, the Poles (via Margaret of Clarence), the Buckinghams, and a million other families (including the Tudors themselves)? They all come from female lines of Plantagenets.

 

[FouDuRoy]

Does Charles Somerset count? Will Bunter Beaufort do today?

That's precisely the illegitimate branch I was going to talk about.
Let's notice that, over generations, this branch also gained some legitimate Plantagenet ancestry in female line which, I guess, makes its members technically in line for the throne of England.
Of course, there are (and always were) plenty of people with much better claims. Having someone from this branch becoming king of England seems very unlikely, if not impossible.
Maybe a Catholic coup in favor of this guy:

Henry Somerset, 1st Marquess of Worcester - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

(His maternal grandmother was a Pole.)

 

[Jonathan1997]

Elizabeth I of England could have has doughters I believe that the Boleyn line where predisposed to female only Children the line that exist today still has only girls primary.

You could have Edward iV make it so that Elizabeth of York could be the ruling Queen of England my be she becomes co-monarch with Henry Vii and the dynasty's is called Tudor-Plantagenet.

Elizabeth II grandchildren are called mountbatten-windsor.

The male lane of the Plantagenet family dead out with the beheading of Edward Earl of Warwick in 1499.

After 1399 there was no male Plantagenet left so they future dynasty would have had a different name.

You could also have Richard Duke of Gloucester win the Battle of bosworth it was the Franch Pikes that won Henry Vii the battle. Those Pikes where the same ones used that killed Charles the bold of burgundy.

 

[ordinarylittleme]

Elizabeth I of England could have has doughters I believe that the Boleyn line where predisposed to female only Children the line that exist today still has only girls primary.

You could have Edward iV make it so that Elizabeth of York could be the ruling Queen of England my be she becomes co-monarch with Henry Vii and the dynasty's is called Tudor-Plantagenet.

Elizabeth II grandchildren are called mountbatten-windsor.

The male lane of the Plantagenet family dead out with the beheading of Edward Earl of Warwick in 1499.

After 1399 there was no male Plantagenet left so they future dynasty would have had a different name.

You could also have Richard Duke of Gloucester win the Battle of bosworth it was the Franch Pikes that won Henry Vii the battle. Those Pikes where the same ones used that killed Charles the bold of burgundy.

Elizabeth of York was NEVER considered as possible candidate for queen regnant and the only way she would be is if literally all possible male candidates are dead which would be a very genocidal butterfly lol.
Richard III winning Bosworth doesn't actually answer the POD as he wouldn't have returned to the throne, he'd stay king.

 

[Jonathan1997]

Elizabeth of York was NEVER considered as possible candidate for queen regnant and the only way she would be is if literally all possible male candidates are dead which would be a very genocidal butterfly lol.
Richard III winning Bosworth doesn't actually answer the POD as he wouldn't have returned to the throne, he'd stay king.

Edward iV could do what Henry VIII did otl.

Also Richard III staying king would work keeping house Plantagenet on the throne

If you wanted Richard loses the crown you could have him defected at bosworth he moves North to ge another army and Henry Tudor crowns himself Henry Vii. Then you could have Richard III win back his crown

 

[Simreeve]

Edward iV could do what Henry VIII did otl.

Also Richard III staying king would work keeping house Plantagenet on the throne

If you wanted Richard loses the crown you could have him defected at bosworth he moves North to ge another army and Henry Tudor crowns himself Henry Vii. Then you could have Richard III win back his crown

Or have Richard's legitimate son John live for long enough to take the throne at some point after Bosworth.