"The Third World War" by Gen. Sir J. Hackett et al

Fellatio Nelson

Just wondered what the response was to these two books that appeared in the 1980s?

Basic outline: first book written in the early 1980s, set in 1987 and recounting a NATO-SOVIET war in August 1985. It culminates in the USSR nuking Birmingham, England; the UK and USA nuking Kiev; the collapse of the Soviet Union and satellite nations.

Format took the form of a narrative account of opposing forces, events leading up to and during the war, interspersed with hypothetical official documents and brief storylines concerned key points in the campaign.

The second volume examines in greater detail issues referred to in the original - doubtless the publishers wanted to cash-in on previous success - and provides alternative ending of WW3 in which NATO loses.

It was apparently a best-selling work.
 

Nik

Shudder...

Like Herman Khan's 'On Thermonuclear War', it lifted the lid on a can of worms...

All too plausibly, it set out the end of European civilisation as we knew it: a spiral of tac-nuke strike/counter-strike, fallout & collateral damage leaving no winners even *without* an apocalyptic all-out thermo-nuke exchange...

And then Chernobyl in 1986...
 

Dave Howery

I thought most of the two books were rather dry and technical, too much broad sweep of action... Red Storm Rising did it all better. That said, I did rather like the chapter in the second book about the war in Scandinavia....
 

Fellatio Nelson

I quite enjoyed the broad nature of the study, although some of the novelesque fictional interludes - such as letters home and the first submarine vs. submarine engagement between a UK and Soviet craft - were rather cringe-making. However, I did like the little asides like the pressure under which Sweden was placed (in book two).

It was rather dry and in parts badly written - or at least expressed badly. With such books I dip in and out of interesting chapters rather than read from cover to cover.

The original book was almost an appeal for reason from someone concerned with the state of the UK and NATO forces in the very late '70s (when it was written): the US re-introduced the draft; the UK economy picked up with a dynamic female leader - who she?? - and they spent more on the armed forces. Also a lot of vitriol against the Euro peace movements of the 1970s and their unwitting help to USSR strategy.


(I also like RSR by Tom Clancy; especially liked the attack on the US carrier fleet and the bits in Iceland.)

PS - Did hear they are releasing the old BBC programme Threads on DVD. Now that was a good film (although I always find the actual attacks to be anticlimactic).
 

Romulus Augustulus

My personal view on a NATO-Soviet War in the early '80s? Tacnukes! Tacnukes! Tacnukes! NATO would use them on a large scale to destroy Soviet armored spearheads, and the Soviets would also use them. I can see East Germany and also a good part of West Germany being turned into a radioactive battlezone. In the end, it would be a stalemate. Postwar, though, I can see the USSR falling apart due to the stress.
 

Dave Howery

a little off topic but..

In my collection of board wargames is a 4-game set called The Third World War. Each game covers a piece of the war (Germany, Scandinavia, Turkey/Greece, and the middle east). You can join up the maps from each game into one mega-game spanning the war from Norway to Yemen. The mega-game begins with a prelude in the middle east and then onto a massive Europe-wide battle. Fleets, air war, and huge ground forces are involved. There is a nuclear option, IIRC, but that pretty much ends the game. The game would require about 4 cafeteria tables to set up the maps and most of a weekend to play... but what a way to spend a weekend...
 

Tony Williams

I recall reading those books when they first came out, although I didn't keep them. Technically strong, as you would expect from the author, so a realistic account of how the battle might have gone.

When you think about the way in which the Cold War dominated people's lives, it's perhaps odd that more books covering this subject weren't written. Instead the public preferred James Bond escapism...

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website and discussion forum
 
Mr_ Bondoc

Mr_ Bondoc

A Few Books...

I seem to recall that the book Team Yankee by Harold Coyle was based on the events of The Third World War by General John Hackett. As such, you certainly have hte story of the nuclear bombing of Burmingham and Kiev becoming the highlights of hte story.
 

Melvin Loh

Yeah, I always wondered about the links between those 2 texts and how Coyle also selected Birmingham and Kiev as nuclear targets in the same way as Hackett had...
 

Chuck Mandus

I lurk most of the time, hardly post, but when I read Hackett's book, I did find it interesting that the aftermath resembled our world where the USSR did break up and I do remember them mentioning a computer network like the Internet that most people were starting to use. IIRC, the book was looking back from the 1990's. It seems like it described our world today although we never came to blows.
 

JLCook

Need a new story.

Sir John Hackett's book was written, for 1985, in about 1975 and tried to project what forces, available in ten years, would be able to accomplish. In 1985, he wasn't too far off, and from what I can recall of my own service in Europe, ending in that year, it wasn't too implausable.

Today is quite a bit different, and the threat has long since shifted. Technology has advanced enormously and the "enemy" is now, completely different.

I'd like to read a book, written by some Bundeswehr General Major, concerning a future WWIII, to be fought in Europe and the Middle East, in about 15 years time---say around 2020, with conjecture as to what a war with Islam would be like.

Make the story scary enough, and the consequences terrifying enough, and perhaps, like Hackett;s 1985, such a war will NOT occur.

Make the book revolve around an Islamic attack on a Europe that has divorced itself from AMerican support (It's the only way that Europe could be openly attacked). Have the Wahabbis overrun large areas and show the consequences of losing! It couldn't be any worse than Draka stories!
 

zoomar

I owned the first one. Did't know about the second (and was certainly unaware of an alternate "NATO loses" ending). These books also spawned a cottage industry of slapped-together illustrated "The Weapons of World War 3" type books which appears in the bargain sections of chain bookstores.

I liked the Hackett book, Personally, I prefer the scholarly history approach to future/alternate history rather than novelizations. One certainly did get the impression it influenced "Red Storm Rising"
 

Bulldawg85

Seem to remember

I seem to remember some books written by Dean Ing about 15-20 yrs ago which were set in the same TL.
 

Romulus Augustulus

I'd like such a book about a postulated Chinese invasion of Siberia, around the present time. It certainly would be interesting, especially if it went nuclear. I wonder if enough Russian nukes would work to make MAD possible in such a scenario...
 

Bulgaroktonos

Romulus Augustulus said:
I wonder if enough Russian nukes would work to make MAD possible in such a scenario...
Click to expand...

That's what I always say about Russian nukes. You don't have to fear them. 1/4 don't work period, 1/4 won't leave the ground, another 1/4 have such poor guidance systems that they won't hit anything close to what they are trying to hit, and the last fourth aren't even in Russia.....
 
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