The Anglo/American - Nazi War

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CalBear

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Hmmm...


As a one off...


-Mummar Ghadaffi - Cab Driver

-Charles De Gaulle - Disgraced one time leader of Free French who was, perhaps unjustly, blamed for much of what befell France post-war. Died in Tangiers, in self imposed exile.

-Richard Nixon - Served two terms in House of Representative, one term as Governor of California. Secretary of Veteran's Affairs during second Goldwater Administration. Unsuccessfully sought Republican nomination for President in 1976.

-Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. - Navy Chaplin, Died on Green Beach 2 Posthumous Navy Cross.

-Nikita Khrushchev - Died at Stalingrad

-Kim Il-Sung - Died in insane asylum

-Saddam Hussein - Retired Captain, Arab Legion

-Ronald Reagan - Six term President of Screen Actor's Guild.

-Elvis Presley - MIA after loss of B-52 where he was a tail-gunner, declared KIA 1972

-Earl Warren - Three Term Governor of California. Chief Justice USSC.

-George Wallace - Captain, Alabama National Guard. Killed 12 May 1959 near Bremerhaven

-Jim Jones (Morbid Curiosity at work) - Died when struck by Bus, October 1955.

-Nelson Mandela - Killed by South African authorities during 1985 Revolution.

-Clement Atlee - Prime Minister (1947 - 50, 53-55)

-Fidel Castro - 186 game winner for Boston Red Sox

-The Beatles - Who?

-Margaret Thatcher - Senior Research Chemist, DuPont UK

-Golda Meir - Zionist political leader. Returned to her childhood hometown of Milwaukee WI when efforts to establish State of Israel foundered on UN Right of Self Determination sponsored vote. Lt. Governor of Wisconsin (1970-74)

-Augusto Pinochet - Chilean Army officer and politician. Attempted to overthrow democratically elected government of Chile. Served 12 years in prison for failed Coup attempt. Later ran for political office with little success.

-John McCain - Graduated Annapolis 1958. 53 combat missions over Germany in closing months of war. Nominated for Navy Cross, Korean Intervention, awarded Silver Star. Commander MOL 4 June-October 1986, Commander MOL 5 March -July 1986, November 1986 - January 1987. Retired as Rear Admiral (Upper Half), 1992. Member of House of Representatives, Arizona 12th District 1994 -2008. Now retired.




 

Kidblast

Calbear, I've just read this whole thread in two days. I'm amazed. I echo Merry. You MUST put this into book form with some maps and sell it on Amazon. I would definitely buy it in a heartbeat.

Simply amazing. This has made coming back to AH.com after my year absence worthwhile.
 

CalBear

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A number of people have asked about the fates of different countries that were not mentioned in the postscript. Truthfully I have no clue about most of Africa, and only the most general about much of South America. However; here are a few bullet points

  • Belgium - Probably the 2nd best recovered of the seriously damaged Western European nations. 2010 Economy = OTL Peru
  • Chile – Not quite the powerhouse that is Brazil. 2010 Economy = OTL Egypt
  • Czechoslovakia – Torn up by Reich, by food shortages, downwind from all the nastiness spread across Europe. 2010 Economy = OTL Vietnam
  • Denmark - Relatively little damage, recovered fairly quickly despite disease issues related to biolo-weapons. 2010 Economy = OTL Chile
  • The Netherlands – Very severely damaged by war, including mass destruction by SS, some serious bio-weapon “splash damage”. 2010 Economy = OTL Peru
  • Norway – By far best recovered of major combat sites No bio-weapon impact 2010 Economy = OTL Philippines
  • Peru – No big jump to the good, but has benefited from overall improvement across Western Hemisphere.
  • Portugal Came out of war as one of two undamaged economies in Europe 2010 Economy = OTL Poland
  • Poland – Main export is soldiers, and damned good ones. 2010 population has not yet reached 1939 levels. 2010 Economy = OTL Burma (but with 1/3 the population)
  • Spain – Biggest economy on European Continent. Franco was clever enough to see the writing on the wall, and mainly sheathed his claws, although true democracy had to wait for his demise. Has HUGE problems with illegal immigration similar to OTL U.S. and for same reason, 1st World country with a land border to a 3rd world country. Economy = OTL Italy.
  • South Africa – White apartheid government overthrown in 1985 after nearly a decade of unsuccessful A4 efforts to bring about reform. Revolutionaries were surprising well armed with weapons that seemed to be sourced from Western Hemisphere, exact origin undetermined. Post revolution government has very good relations with Australia and has been part of the Commonwealth since 1992. 2010 Economy = OTL Greece
 

Kidblast

Are there any white people left in South Africa? I'm pretty sure IOTL the Apartheid government had plans to evacuate to the Cape province (where the most white people lived) and try to set up a defensive perimeter in the mountains, if worst came to worst. If all the white were killed, that's another 4 million or so people dead. Probably more as I can see the apartheid government encouraging immigration from Europe after the war. However, I imagine it would be more like OTL Algeria, in which the government was handed over and many of the white people left. Where would they go? North America? Commonwealth Countries?

Did South Africa ever develop its nuclear program like in OTL?
 
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RCAF Brat

I've got a few more for "what became of them?"

Pierre Trudeau (OTL the infamous Canadian politician)

Neil Armstrong (OTL the first man on the moon)

James Doohan (OTL 'Scotty' from Star trek)

Karol Wojtlia (OTL Pope John Paul II) (I know fate was probably grim, but...)

Ho Chi Minh (sp?) (OTL Communist dictator of North Vietnam)
 

M. A. Dickens

RCAF Brat said:
I've got a few more for "what became of them?"

Pierre Trudeau (OTL the infamous Canadian politician)

Neil Armstrong (OTL the first man on the moon)

James Doohan (OTL 'Scotty' from Star trek)

Karol Wojtlia (OTL Pope John Paul II) (I know fate was probably grim, but...)

Ho Chi Minh (sp?) (OTL Communist dictator of North Vietnam)
Click to expand...

My guesses...

Trudeau: Canadian Ambassador to [insert backwater country] (OOC: serves him right for gutting the Forces :cool:)

Armstrong: probably fighter pilot during the war; one of USAF's space program's proponent. I imagine he'll get an AFB (it doesn't have to be on Earth ;)) named after him at some point

Doohan: I wouldn't know...

Wojtlia: Polish Resistance hero. KIA by SS troops in the final days of the war

Ho Chi Ming: President of Vietnam. Major US ally

BTW, CalBear, Hong Kong stayed as a British colony, right? And what about Singapore?

Marc A
 

Blue Max

Now, I'm not at all sure about the bus that hits Jim Jones makes a detour through Canada. Just because you and I don't like someone doesn't mean that the world at that time and place agrees.

So, here are my guesses:

Pierre Trudeau: I do not think someone so blatantly against a nation's armed forces in a time of war will have a promising political career. He's still got a wealthy family and political ties; my thought is that he goes into business and makes a fortune by selling goods to destroyed Europe.

Neil Armstrong: Serving one term in the air force doesn't suggest that he's going to really have the draw to be a Air Force Test Pilot when there are many more people who have done more for the air force. He seems to be drawn to academia, and probably has a career teaching Engineering.

James Doohan: It would be nice if Gene Roddenberry survived, but I'm not sure that Roddenberry would leave the Air Force in the days of Warm War. On the other hand, if Doohan never plays Chief Engineer Scott he may well not be typecast and have a more successful acting career.

Karol Wojtya: Dies in German Hands. Given his aim of preserving Poland as a state in spite of the world around him, I'd hope it was a simple execution. The more likely case is that terrible sadists in the SS turn it into a sport.

He would be overshadowed by Bishop Adam Sapieha, the man who mentored him during the German Occupation and was probably likewise murdered.

Ho Chi Minh: Founding Father of the Modern Vietnamese State. I'm not sure that CalBear ever really explicitly named the men building Vietnam, but Ho Chi Minh would be there.


A few others to chew on, while were at it:
-Robert McNamara
-Sam Walton
-Jimmy Carter
-Yasser Arafat
-Stephen Hawking
-Josip Broz "Tito"
-Harold MacMillan
-Juan Peron
-Colin Powell
-George H.W. Bush
 
NCW8

NCW8

CalBear said:
Flag fanatics, long driven to despair by the odd 51 star design, rejoice as things are once again evened out.
Click to expand...

I know that it's an extremely minor point given everything else going on ITTL, but why would 51 stars produce an odd design ? Wouldn't you have six rows of stars, alternating 8 and 9 stars on a row:

200px-US_flag_51_stars.svg.png


That really doesn't look too bad.

Cheers,
Nigel.
 

konigmarke333

Just read though the whole thing over the last couple of weeks or so.

Great work! One of the best pieces of alternate history I've read anywhere.

Looking forward to checking out some of your other work on this site!
 

Astronomo2010

Cal bear please continue this timeline, its fantastic, lets see the world go well into the future,discovery of FTL and colonization of nearby solar systems:)
 

radaron

Great conclusion.

Btw, does this:

A4 powers decree that all future orbital cargoes must be launched using A4 launchers. Decree promises that launch costs will be maintained below current per pound cost of launching of satellites or manned systems by non-A4 countries. Same decree flatly states that any unauthorized launch over 65 miles altitude will be considered direct act of war.
Click to expand...

...put an end to the Indian space missions? I can't imagine they'd be happy with that?
 
Lavanya Six

Lavanya Six

An excellent timeline, CalBear, and one I'm sad to see end. I always looked forward to Saturday updates. While this world did veer into darkness at times under pax A4, like with the UN-Prussian War and the demonstration bombing, it's hard to argue against certain aspects, like the lack of potential nuclear war and of the periodic Third World genocides where everyone looks the other way. What do you think someone ITTL's 2011 would think of our own world/history of 2011?


I'll throw a few more chips onto the "what happened to them?" pile:

* Hergé
* Coco Chanel
* Osamu Tezuka
* Lee Harvey Oswald
* J.R.R. Tolkien
* Stephen Hawking
 
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Geon

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A Good End But...

Calbear

First, applause for an extremely well done timeline:)! It was very entertaining and disturbingly realistic.

The only problem I had was at the very end. The destruction of Stettin to stop Prussian insurgents attacking Polish forces seemed a "trifle" extreme. I take it that the A4 is determined to maintain a "keep the peace or else," attitude for the forseeable future.

Geon
 

lloyd007

Calbear, would it be possible to name the Provisional Govn'ts of former Germany and their relative place and wealth i.e.,

1. E. Prussia
2. Baden - Wurttemberg

and etc.?

also, is Austria back to being its own nation or was it divvied up as 'part of Germany'?
 
Baron Bizarre

Baron Bizarre

imperialaquila said:
The mentions of MLB remind me; what's football like ITTL? American football, that is. Did the NFL form more or less as OTL? Is it just as popular as OTL? Have the Lions won a Super Bowl?
Click to expand...

That's an interesting question. The NFL goes back to 1920, so I'd imagine it was still there in some form or another. On the other hand, the AFL was founded in 1960, so I suppose it's possible they got butterflied away. No Patriots? :( Maybe Boston/New England got an expansion team. Might be worth the trade-off of having no Jets fans around.
 
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