Something Serious Has Happened on Air Force One (a Tl/story by Geon)

[jlckansas]

The problem is the law did not exist where the Feds would have jurisdiction. It was not passed till 1965 making it a federal crime to kill the President or line of succession. This means that the local state laws would be the ones enforced to take care of the killer or killers pre 1965. The Secret Service and other federal agencies would help but not have jurisdiction over it.
There is also no Federal Police force in the US. There are different agencies that have different jurisdictions, but no central overall Federal Force.

 

[NHBL]

I had one thought--especially if the police are believed to have fired the first shot. This might result in modified use of force rules that benefit many people later. Severe federal rules on use of force--perhaps also earlier work on "non-lethal" weapons, which aren't always.

 

[Darth_Kiryan]

RFK in '64 huh?

 

[dmg86]

I doubt he would be ready to run but it's possible.

 

[BigVic]

Watched. The line of succession in action

 

[Geon]

Washington, D.C.: White House Situation Room, 4:30 P.M. [EDT]

It was a very sober and grim group that gathered back in the situation room.

A White House aide came in and reported. “Mr. McCormack, Chief Justice, Earl Warren will be here in 5 minutes to administer the oath. The press is already gathering in the press area.

McCormack numbly nodded acceptance of the message. The aide was about to leave when Robert stopped him. “I want every member of the secret service detail in Dallas on that plane with my brother’s body and Jacky tomorrow morning. As soon as they arrive in DC the body is to be taken to Bethesda Naval Hospital for a second autopsy. every agent is to be thoroughly debriefed. I want to know what happened from the time of the shooting in Dealey Plaza to the scuffle on Air Force One.”

He turned to Hoover. “Mr. Hoover, I want your men all over the Dallas Police Department as of tomorrow. I want them interviewing everyone from the Commissioner right down to the janitor if needed. Take a statement from Dr. Rose and make sure we have copies of all, and I mean all of his notes on the autopsy.”

Bobby drew a deep breath and then said with great intensity. “We are going to get to the bottom of this and if that means we must arrest half of that g-d d—d police department so be it! This country wants answers- I want answers!” The last was said with a loud slam of the flat of his hand on the conference table.

A moment later there was a knock at the door and one of Hoover’s people came in with some papers for him. Hoover looked the first note over and smiled. “Well, we seem to have one piece of good news Mr. President, Mr. Attorney General. Our office in Dallas says the DPD have caught the man they believe responsible for shooting President Kennedy.” McCormack let and Kennedy gave a sigh of satisfaction.

Then Hoover let the other shoe fall. “Unfortunately, it also looks like he has a record with the FBI and according to our New Orleans office the man has the words Soviet or Cuban agent written all over him."

The room became very quiet and cold.

 

[NHBL]

I have a feeling that the assassin will survive this time. The Feds will quickly whip up a charge of treason, espionage, or some such, go get him, and drag him to Washington. Even if there's a "not guilty" later, I think Hoover would do it. If the Dallas police object to strenuously, it will get shooty.

 

[marktaha]

McCormack would be a caretaker.1964 battle for nomination between Humphrey,RFK, Stevenson,Symington,wallace.

 

[RanulfC]

McCormack would be a caretaker.1964 battle for nomination between Humphrey,RFK, Stevenson,Symington,wallace.

Much as it's going to hurt him personally RFK will have to very publicly and very visibly step-aside as AG here, he's too close to the 'problems' to be effective. On the other hand if he keeps his nose clear and doesn't try and run things from the background, (of course McCormack could always appoint him VP) he's likely got 1964 in the bag between sympathy voting and general national desire to revive "Camelot".

Randy

 

[marktaha]

Couldn't appoint new VP then.

 

[Geon]

At 4:36 P.M. [EST] John William McCormack took the oath of office and officially became the 36th President of the United States.

As a somewhat humorous side note it should be noted that to this day, if you ask anyone in Texas, they will insist that John McCormack should actually be considered the 37th President and that actually Lyndon Johnson served as the 36th president from the time that Kennedy was declared dead at 1 p.m. to the time Johnson died on the operating table two hours later. While legally correct, for the most part popular history has chosen to ignore this. A fact that is still liable to provoke barfights in Texas should any out of state visitor bring this up!

Robert Kennedy and members of Kennedy’s cabinet that were in Washington at the time witnessed the event. However, J. Edgar Hoover had chosen to remain in the conference room. The dossier on Oswald was troubling, to put it mildly.

Oswald had clear communist sympathies and had defected to the U.S.S.R. a few years ago. He had eventually become disenchanted with life there and returned to the U.S. with a Russian wife. Or at least so it appeared.

This is practically screaming “sleeper agent,” thought Hoover. And if this is part of a larger plan what about the ‘accident’ on Air Force One? Were one or more of those DPD officers part of the plan?

After spending a half hour studying the dossier Hoover made a long-distance call to the F.B.I. office in Dallas to speak to the chief of said office. He quickly gave a few orders.

First – Oswald was to be taken into Federal custody and flown out of Dallas to Washington by tomorrow evening at the very latest. Let the Texans roar about that one if they wanted to but Hoover was not about to have some ‘accident’ occur to Oswald as it had to Johnson. A plane would be sent to bring Oswald to Washington where he would be further questioned. Texas could have him back to stand trial for the murder of Officer Tibbets only after the Federal government was done with him.

Second – Files were to be opened on every DPD officer who had been in the plane at the time of the “incident.” F.B.I. agents would interview each one and compare their stories. Agents were also to look for any “questionable” material in their backgrounds including political views, visits to foreign countries, quirks in their backgrounds, etc.

For better or worse Hoover’s actions were going to ensure the present crisis would take turns no one had foreseen.

 

[NHBL]

He should also be re-investigating the Secret Service agents.
The Soviet connection does, IMVHO, give Hoover justification for arresting Oswald on federal charges of treason or espionage. (Yes, I'm actually speaking up for Hoover, believe it or not.)
Now you can play with whichever theory you want to about the reason for Kennedy's death, was there a second shooter, etc. If Jack Ruby was a hired hit man, what does he do now?
And--now is a good time for a local criminal element to delete one or more Dallas cops, and plant the gun somewhere. Or cut a random cop's brake line, or...
The local criminal element could easily see a chance to gut the PD's effectiveness...

 

[altwere]

this has been a good start. Please keep it going.

 

[NHBL]

this has been a good start. Please keep it going.

Seconded!!!!!

 

[Geon]

Dallas, 6:00 p.m., Dallas Police Department:

Jerry Curry, Chief of Police for the Dallas Police Department had just finished briefing the press on the apprehension of Lee Harvey Oswald following the shooting of Officer Tibbets and how subsequent investigation seemed to implicate Oswald as the person responsible for the shooting of President Kennedy and Governor Connelly.

Curry now moved on to describe the incident that had occurred aboard Air Force One.

Dr. Earl Rose, coroner for the Dallas Police Department had asked and then demanded that the body of President Kennedy be turned over to the Coroner’s Department at Parkland Memorial Hospital. He was refused by Kenneth O’Donnell, chief of staff for the President.

Approximately 30 minutes later Dr. Rose boarded Air Force One with a court order that required the body be turned over to the Coroner’s Office for autopsy. He presented the document to Mr. O’Donnell who again refused to release the body into Dr. Rose's custody.

Dr. Rose attempted to remove the body from the plane and was blocked by O’Donnell and several of the secret service agents. The situation on the plane became increasingly volatile and at one point several of the agents drew weapons. The DPD officers likewise did the same.

Vice President Johnson attempted to diffuse the situation interposing himself between the two factions.

As Johnson was attempting to negotiate with Dr. Rose apparently one of the Secret Service agents’ guns accidentally discharged. An agent attempted to push Johnson out of the range of fire as several of the officers fearful they were under fire returned fire in the agent’s direction. Two of the shots in the exchange that followed hit Vice-President Johnson who later died of said injuries. Judge Sarah T. Hughes was hit in the wrist and her condition is said to be good. Kenneth O’Donnell was caught in a crossfire and died at the scene. Two secret service agents and one Dallas police officer were also wounded. They are all in fair condition.

At this time, we have no reason to believe this was anything more than a regrettable accident and overreaction by the Secret Service…

 

[r1ncewind]

talk about a burn! also, how can he be sure the SS shot first?

 

[FinnishFury]

talk about a burn! also, how can he be sure the SS shot first?

He likely isn't sure at all about the Secret Service shooting first, but he is more than willing to try to push all blame on the Secret Service in the first moments after the event.
It's easier to say that "the other guys fucked up" rather than tell the people that "our (possible) negligence caused the death of two people, including the Vice President".

 

[NHBL]

He can't be. But who cares about evidence here--the spin is all that matters.

talk about a burn! also, how can he be sure the SS shot first?

Put your version out first, regardless of evidence, to spin the narrative. If there's suspicion that the Dallas PD did it, who will ever trust them.

It would be GREAT if the press conference is broken into to say that the FBI was demanding Oswald be turned over to them, and the Dallas PD refused.
I would say that the Feds will be very jumpy; local police have already gunned down several federal officials, including the President. (They won't believe that pros like the Secret Service were responsible.)
Oswald killed in the mess, while Uncle Sam is attempting to arrest him for treason and espionage, would make OTL's conspiracy theories look minor--especially if one or more Dallas cops were killed. "What a coincidence! The Dallas cop that murdered a suspect in cold blood is now conveniently DEAD!"

He likely isn't sure at all about the Secret Service shooting first, but he is more than willing to try to push all blame on the Secret Service in the first moments after the event.
It's easier to say that "the other guys fucked up" rather than tell the people that "our (possible) negligence caused the death of two people, including the Vice President".

Exactly. For that matter, the Secret Service is likely FAR better trained than a few cops sent to serve papers. I'd guess that the Dallas cops are at least partly responsible. If they pulled guns on Air Force One, the Secret Service would be derilect in their duty if they didn't AT LEAST pull theirs, and if the President (no longer VP) was there and someone pulls a gun, they probably get shot right then.

(I'll admit that my distrust of big city police is coloring my thoughts, since I don't know what Dallas PD is like.)

 

[ric350]

Considering the situation, would the SS even allow armed people on board AF1, regardless if they were police or not?

Isn’t AF1 considered federal property/jurisdiction? Would armed police be allowed to enter the White House “uninvited”?

ric350

 

[NHBL]

Making things worse, the state will probably try to have a "state inquest," meaning whitewash.
I know that airports are federal jurisdiction now. One thing that illustrates that is that state "no mask required" mandates DID NOT APPLY in airports while the federal one was in place.
Those cops, be they Dallas or State, were out of their jurisdiction, though that doesn't mean that they cared. After all, if the police do it, it's not illegal in some places.
No matter who fired first, I think every one of the cops present can be tried for anything from accessory to murder IN A PLACE SUBJECT TO FEDERAL JURISDICTION, meaning that it's a federal case. I doubt that the Nuremberg defense will work, especially since I suspect that a lot of papers and logs are being "lost" with impressive speed.

For that matter, people who gave whatever orders were given could possibly be arrested as accessories.

Once again, I'm surprising myself by thinking Hoover isn't acting decisively enough. Getting federal search warrants from a "tame" judge shouldn't be too hard, and then seize every bit of documentation related to the case. If I understand things correctly, every state or city official on Air Force One could be in federal custody. Since there is possible evidence of treason or espionage, if he wanted to over reach, Hoover might even seek out a warrant to seize EVERYTHING related to the assassination. (Or would it be overreach? Once again, I'm shocking myself by saying that Hoover isn't acting aggressively enough.)

Worst (and super extreme) case is that the warrants are resisted, and more gunfire ensues. If that happens, it becomes a case of whe declares martial law first: The president or the acting governor of Texas.
The government of Texas is effectively paralyzed due to the governor being in surgery and recovery. Lieutenant Governor Preston Smith should be involved right away ; this is bigger than a city. Among other things, he should, IMVHO, be telling the cops to shut the heck up.

The amount of biological waste product that has become colocated with the rotary air impeller is sufficient to cover EVERYONE!

One possible source of evidence, if police radio recordings either weren't made, or "failed to record due to technical issues," would be people listening to police scanners, be they ordinary people or reporters. (I don't know how popular police scanners were then, but in the late 70's, they were quite popular. Hear a siren, turn on the scanner. In some households, including ours, it was usually on. You could tell instantly when something was major instead of routine.

The "technical issue" involved, of course, being a series of very strong magnets applied to the tapes in question.