Redshank Galloglass
Banned
I thought you said that the golden road ran through Japan?
Aw, fuck it. I'm bad at world building shit that isn't my own.
I say we just stop the bullshit and leave the world building to the authors.
FTS I'm out.
Reds fanfic
- Thread starter E. Burke
- Start date
Aw, fuck it. I'm bad at world building shit that isn't my own.
I say we just stop the bullshit and leave the world building to the authors.
FTS I'm out.
AH Polchat Thread: Opinion of UASR and FBU foreign policy?
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Name: A Good Boy
Age: 22
Gender: Male
Sexuality: Straight, though not sexually active or looking for a relationship
Nationality: British
Religion: Atheist, originally Jewish
Location: Manchester
Political affiliation: World Socialist Movement - SPGB*
Occupation: Student (Philosophy and Politics)
Favorite AH Work: A more perfect Union, Girl Genius, the Marx and Engels in an Adventure With series (a very cheesy and pulpy alternate history series which feature the adventures of heavily fictionalised depictions of Marx and Engles and their battle against the forces of capitalism and reaction. Contains a lot of deliberately cheesy and over-the-top writing and steampunk up the wazoo)
Other hobbies: video games (particularly Paradox Interactive games), baking, amateur dramatics, debating, collecting novelty stamps, feeling smug and self-righteous
Likes: Having strong principles, taking an unpopular stance as a matter of principle, letting other people know that he is taking an unpopular stance as a matter of principle, Gilbert and Sullivan, debating (particularly on matters of principle), ridiculous Space Opera, skiing, The Quarrymen**
Dislikes: Imperialism (both bourgeois and social), reformism, nationalism, dictators, state capitalism, social state capitalism, regular capitalism, apologists for capitalism of any kind, the so-called Communist International, upsetting people***
Favorite quote: "Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." - John Quincey Adams
Demeanor- polite, if a bit condescending, and often holier-than-thou. Somewhat naive and awkward.
AH Works: The Impossible Revolution. A multi-PoD timeline which is a massive wank of the World Socialist Movement and their vision of what real socialism is and how it should be brought about. Most of the minor PoDs involve strengthening and unifying the World Socialist Movement but the main one involves a series of blunders that critically weakens the US Democratic Party, which opens up political space for the socialist movement to expand, particularly in the South, which also leads to greater civil rights for Africans. Come 1932 the Workers Party, more heavily dominated by the left-wing than OTL, are able to win a supermajority of the votes. As a result the fascist coup is never attempted in the face of such overwhelming support, and a peaceful transition to socialism occurs in line with Deleon's vision whereby workers set up their own councils to manage the means of production whilst a constitutional convention transfers political control to them. After the USSR is expelled from the Comintern (earlier than OTL), the Comintern is integrated into the World Socialist Movement, along with a large section of the 2nd International who have now seen the possibility of revolution through the ballot box and its superiority to reformism. The re-branded Socialist Workers International soon becomes the leading light of the left, with the remnants of the reformist movements and Stalin's attempted 4th International soon withering away to nothing. Eschewing bourgeois nationalism the US restructures itself as the World Socialist State (WSS), peacefully integrating Cuba, Puerto Rico, the Philippines, and Mexico, followed by much of Latin America as socialism spreads south. With the USSR isolated and the peaceful nature of the American revolution, Britain and France feel less threatened by the rise of socialism and thus aren't as willing to give the Fascists free reign resulting in a much weaker Fascist bloc. In addition, the success of socialism meant that the working class in Brazil and Venezuela overwhelmingly opposed Fascism, keeping Fascism completely out of the Americas. Elections soon bring about revolutionary governments in France, Britain, Spain, Ireland, the Low Countries, and Scandinavia, all of whom integrate their states into the WSS. The Fascist Bloc, desperate for resources in the face of international isolation, launch a desperate invasion of the USSR, but is beaten back after three years and are forced to sign a peace treaty with them. In the aftermath of their failure, the countries of the Fascist Bloc undergo democratic and socialist revolutions, with most of them integrating into the WSS, with the USSR following soon after. By 1950 the world is unified into a Global Socialist Community, which has abolished property, money, and the state. Considered by many to be an escapist fantasy that should be moved to the ASB section.
*First rule of socialism: there is always a group out there that's to the left of you and who will denounce you for betraying the workers. Given how cliquey and purist the SPGB are OTL (you have to pass an entrance exam to join them) they are this to the USAR.
**Alt-version of The Beatles, makes sense if you've ever been on the SPGB's website.
***Which does make things awkward given how politically opinionated he is
Age: 22
Gender: Male
Sexuality: Straight, though not sexually active or looking for a relationship
Nationality: British
Religion: Atheist, originally Jewish
Location: Manchester
Political affiliation: World Socialist Movement - SPGB*
Occupation: Student (Philosophy and Politics)
Favorite AH Work: A more perfect Union, Girl Genius, the Marx and Engels in an Adventure With series (a very cheesy and pulpy alternate history series which feature the adventures of heavily fictionalised depictions of Marx and Engles and their battle against the forces of capitalism and reaction. Contains a lot of deliberately cheesy and over-the-top writing and steampunk up the wazoo)
Other hobbies: video games (particularly Paradox Interactive games), baking, amateur dramatics, debating, collecting novelty stamps, feeling smug and self-righteous
Likes: Having strong principles, taking an unpopular stance as a matter of principle, letting other people know that he is taking an unpopular stance as a matter of principle, Gilbert and Sullivan, debating (particularly on matters of principle), ridiculous Space Opera, skiing, The Quarrymen**
Dislikes: Imperialism (both bourgeois and social), reformism, nationalism, dictators, state capitalism, social state capitalism, regular capitalism, apologists for capitalism of any kind, the so-called Communist International, upsetting people***
Favorite quote: "Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." - John Quincey Adams
Demeanor- polite, if a bit condescending, and often holier-than-thou. Somewhat naive and awkward.
AH Works: The Impossible Revolution. A multi-PoD timeline which is a massive wank of the World Socialist Movement and their vision of what real socialism is and how it should be brought about. Most of the minor PoDs involve strengthening and unifying the World Socialist Movement but the main one involves a series of blunders that critically weakens the US Democratic Party, which opens up political space for the socialist movement to expand, particularly in the South, which also leads to greater civil rights for Africans. Come 1932 the Workers Party, more heavily dominated by the left-wing than OTL, are able to win a supermajority of the votes. As a result the fascist coup is never attempted in the face of such overwhelming support, and a peaceful transition to socialism occurs in line with Deleon's vision whereby workers set up their own councils to manage the means of production whilst a constitutional convention transfers political control to them. After the USSR is expelled from the Comintern (earlier than OTL), the Comintern is integrated into the World Socialist Movement, along with a large section of the 2nd International who have now seen the possibility of revolution through the ballot box and its superiority to reformism. The re-branded Socialist Workers International soon becomes the leading light of the left, with the remnants of the reformist movements and Stalin's attempted 4th International soon withering away to nothing. Eschewing bourgeois nationalism the US restructures itself as the World Socialist State (WSS), peacefully integrating Cuba, Puerto Rico, the Philippines, and Mexico, followed by much of Latin America as socialism spreads south. With the USSR isolated and the peaceful nature of the American revolution, Britain and France feel less threatened by the rise of socialism and thus aren't as willing to give the Fascists free reign resulting in a much weaker Fascist bloc. In addition, the success of socialism meant that the working class in Brazil and Venezuela overwhelmingly opposed Fascism, keeping Fascism completely out of the Americas. Elections soon bring about revolutionary governments in France, Britain, Spain, Ireland, the Low Countries, and Scandinavia, all of whom integrate their states into the WSS. The Fascist Bloc, desperate for resources in the face of international isolation, launch a desperate invasion of the USSR, but is beaten back after three years and are forced to sign a peace treaty with them. In the aftermath of their failure, the countries of the Fascist Bloc undergo democratic and socialist revolutions, with most of them integrating into the WSS, with the USSR following soon after. By 1950 the world is unified into a Global Socialist Community, which has abolished property, money, and the state. Considered by many to be an escapist fantasy that should be moved to the ASB section.
*First rule of socialism: there is always a group out there that's to the left of you and who will denounce you for betraying the workers. Given how cliquey and purist the SPGB are OTL (you have to pass an entrance exam to join them) they are this to the USAR.
**Alt-version of The Beatles, makes sense if you've ever been on the SPGB's website.
***Which does make things awkward given how politically opinionated he is
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bookmark95
Banned
What is it like to read a newspaper in the UASR? In the OTL Soviet Union and and present day North Korea, newspapers are usually full of Marxist jargon with dogmatic references to the corrupt imperialists.
I imagine newspapers under very left-wing organizations would be like that, but would a New York Times-level newspaper read like OTL pravda?
I imagine newspapers under very left-wing organizations would be like that, but would a New York Times-level newspaper read like OTL pravda?
Oh, that was Mr.C. I know, it's confusing.
Anyway, I feel guilty, because I did participate in the discussion, and I did allow it to happen. On my part, I apologize for letting it get this far. As the sort of unofficial surveyor of this thread, I feel I should put some rules and guidelines to prevent something like this from happening again.
- If you create a thread which others could add to, please make it apolitical. You can add some politics into the discussion posts themselves, (like if a character is meant as a political caricature) but the topics themselves should be related to culture, pop culture, or local politics for places that are definitely canon (i.e. the UASR, USSR, FBU, GIC, China, Brazil, Rhodesia), as opposed to larger geopolitical ideas
- Remember that you can edit posts. So, even after you post something, please check the other posts to make sure it's consistent with those posts, and try to edit your post accordingly.
- You are completely free to discuss local politics (i.e. the domestic policies, problems, political parties) and culture post-World War II. However, as with the main thread, the post-WWII geopolitical Cold War discussions are discouraged.
- Try not to overdo it with the world building, especially if it doesn't make sense in canon.
- This is more of a guideline, but when you make your own users, try to first use them in a couple posts to get a sense of the character. Not just for the reader, but for yourself. Try to see where you want the character to go with each post you make with him/her, and what purpose he/she serves in the discussion, before you write a profile.
And for future people wanting to write a fake AH thread, you have my permission to all my users, except for NestorMakhno, Kalki, Skaelingking, and TheThirdMan, in the discussion.
Now with that out of the way, I will continue speculating on a film where Chevy Chase stars as a 30's Superhero waking up in the 80's, and fighting a Nazi villain played by Arnold Schwarenegger.
Bulldoggus
Banned
I, a bourgeois, elitist, reformist Social Democrat, know those guys! They're the ones whose official party Twitter is always trolling Bernie! LOLOLOL. They seriously have an ENTRY EXAM? And they're supposed to be a working class vanguard? Good luck with that. I bet, unlike the other splinter trots, they don't even bother infiltrating other orgs. Don't tell me you're a member! And what is on their website?
His favorite quote is from a rich capitalist who was part of a political dynasty?
They oppose vanguardism and are belligerently anti-Leninist (it has been jokingly said that they denounced the Bolshevik Revolution as State Capitalist within hours of hearing about it). Instead they believe in educating the working class on the merits of socialism and the limits of reformism, and eventually the majority will vote to overthrow capitalism. They are Impossibilists who oppose parliamentary reformism, whilst also holding that the only way to bring about socialism is through a revolution through the ballot box. They regard anarchists as too reformist. They reject any form of transitional socialism and believe that once the working class have taken power they will immediately dismantle the state, abolish money, and institute central planning based on calculation-in-kind. They are absolute anti-nationalists, even opposing anti-colonial struggles. They also didn't regard Fascism as that big of a threat and that rather than take a stand against Fascism their solution was to just support Socialism as the genuine alternative (which is literally their answer for everything).
I am not, nor have I ever been, a member of the Socialist Party of Great Britain, but in my university days, on my path from disillusioned Liberal to raving Bolshevist to Labour Party Entryist, I came across them and was rather taken with their principled stances. Because let's face it, it does feel nice to self-righteously think of yourself as taking a bold stance on issues that are unlikely to affect you and criticise all other sides from the comfort of one's armchair.
Ultimately decided not to tie my colours to their masts, largely because I actually believe reformism has merits and I actually want to achieve some form of political change in my lifetime, but also I don't believe in absolute central planning. Whilst their anti-nationalism did appeal to me at the time, I've since come round to seeing that abstract opposition to nationalism without any context to national oppression doesn't achieve anything beyond making you look like an edgy wanker, especially to people who are from oppressed nations.
He is based more than a bit on what I was like in university, i.e. not as smart as he thinks he is and trying too hard to be edgy, but ultimately his heart is in the right place.
As for what's on their website. Well let's just say I get the impression that someone there likes the Beatles, as they had several articles praising them last time I checked (around 2012ish).
Bulldoggus
Banned
Communist and anti-Leninist? Good start.
Sounds contradictory. How are they gonna get voters if they have entry-tests?
What? LOL.
Well, that sounds... optimistic.
WOW.
I understand. And agree with you to some extent.
And these guys sound like every stereotype of communist 3rd parties.
Currently I'm on a long-distance train ride, so I'll contribute with a piece about transportation infrastructure:
The Second Avenue Subway: A Train for The Workers
By the early to mid-1920s, New York City's subway had emerged as the nation's most expansive urban transit system. Together with Penn Station and Grand Central of the late PRR and NY Central railroads, the Big Apple was a city that lived and breathed on trains. Only Chicago's elevated system and Los Angeles' Pacific Electric Railway had comparable coverage. And this amalgamation of tracks and trains continued to expand under the city government of Morris Hillquit, whose victory was was made possible in part by the striking transit workers in the First NYC Commune.
One key legacy of Hillquit's leadership was the planning of what eventually became the first completed subway line in post-Revolution Metropolis. Running from Wall St all the way up along Manhattan's East Side, the 2nd Avenue Subway initially started out as any other line. But thanks to changes in city and state government in the mid to late 20s, and the Great Depression, it was placed on indefinite hold.
Following the Revolution, 2nd-Avenue plans were brought back to life - only this time with a whole new look. Fresh off the boat from the USSR came a collective of Constructivist artists and architects, looking for a fresh new place to leave their designs after falling out of favor back in the Motherland. In contrast to the Moscow Metro's Neo-Classical aesthetics, New York's newest subway lines "embraced the future" with a blend of post-Red May Art Deco and Constructivist designs. Some stations even had artwork from Diego Rivera and Frida Kahlo included.
Thanks to delays in construction during WWII, 2nd Ave station designs were given a chance for further change in the post-war urban landscape. The exiled Brazilian architect Oscar Niemeyer, already working with contemporaries on the designs for UN and Comintern headquarters, was approached by Metropolis councilmember Benjamin Davis for input on the 2nd Ave's Harlem segment. As work on the 2nd Ave and other lines picked up again in the 1950s, station designs took on a more concrete (in a literal sense) approach stemming from Niemeyer's involvement. Contrast between the 2nd Ave's Lower Manhattan-to-Midtown segment and the Upper East Side-Harlem segment is clearly visible even to daily riders otherwise uninterested in architecture.
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I'm also planning on writing up a segment about Reds!Robert Moses or some other notable midcentury urban planner, assuming they'd stick around in the UASR.
The Second Avenue Subway: A Train for The Workers
By the early to mid-1920s, New York City's subway had emerged as the nation's most expansive urban transit system. Together with Penn Station and Grand Central of the late PRR and NY Central railroads, the Big Apple was a city that lived and breathed on trains. Only Chicago's elevated system and Los Angeles' Pacific Electric Railway had comparable coverage. And this amalgamation of tracks and trains continued to expand under the city government of Morris Hillquit, whose victory was was made possible in part by the striking transit workers in the First NYC Commune.
One key legacy of Hillquit's leadership was the planning of what eventually became the first completed subway line in post-Revolution Metropolis. Running from Wall St all the way up along Manhattan's East Side, the 2nd Avenue Subway initially started out as any other line. But thanks to changes in city and state government in the mid to late 20s, and the Great Depression, it was placed on indefinite hold.
Following the Revolution, 2nd-Avenue plans were brought back to life - only this time with a whole new look. Fresh off the boat from the USSR came a collective of Constructivist artists and architects, looking for a fresh new place to leave their designs after falling out of favor back in the Motherland. In contrast to the Moscow Metro's Neo-Classical aesthetics, New York's newest subway lines "embraced the future" with a blend of post-Red May Art Deco and Constructivist designs. Some stations even had artwork from Diego Rivera and Frida Kahlo included.
Thanks to delays in construction during WWII, 2nd Ave station designs were given a chance for further change in the post-war urban landscape. The exiled Brazilian architect Oscar Niemeyer, already working with contemporaries on the designs for UN and Comintern headquarters, was approached by Metropolis councilmember Benjamin Davis for input on the 2nd Ave's Harlem segment. As work on the 2nd Ave and other lines picked up again in the 1950s, station designs took on a more concrete (in a literal sense) approach stemming from Niemeyer's involvement. Contrast between the 2nd Ave's Lower Manhattan-to-Midtown segment and the Upper East Side-Harlem segment is clearly visible even to daily riders otherwise uninterested in architecture.
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I'm also planning on writing up a segment about Reds!Robert Moses or some other notable midcentury urban planner, assuming they'd stick around in the UASR.
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Well, shit, I certainly created a monster. I just wanted to make plausible bad guys for action movies. Sorry 'bout that.
That reminds me: what happens to the Wall Street and the Manhattan Financial District after the revolution? Does it all become collective housing? The NYSE could probably become some kind of "Museum of the Revolution", like what happened to the Cuban Presidential Palace. If it still exists, of course.
That reminds me: what happens to the Wall Street and the Manhattan Financial District after the revolution? Does it all become collective housing? The NYSE could probably become some kind of "Museum of the Revolution", like what happened to the Cuban Presidential Palace. If it still exists, of course.
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Probably still a major flaming asshole and potentially a shill for the right of the people's alliance. Fuck Dawkins man.
Hahahaha.
I've been looking at the recent world-building and feminism and foreign policy chat thing...and honestly, I got so annoyed that I almost do not want to read this thread anymore. There are many things that sounded so off. It's probably my bias of seeing such Eurocentrism that is getting to me.
I've already mentioned an example of such a weird world and that's Jonathan Edelstein's Male Rising and that's a world that is only slightly richer ITTL in general and but it's way less Third Worldish and it created such weirdness...plus with ideological worldviews that are clearly left-socialist and left-liberal in many places. What more about Reds despite most of it coming only in the later 20th century? We even have the Green Revolution? What more about that? Do you guys know enough about cybernetics, parecon, libertarian municipalism, mutualism, etc. Those things?
It's even hard to make people understand certain simple things like Marxism and religion.... as well as polyamory, sexuality, free love...family issues.
It's true, we are just coloring things Red in bringing things that are clearly so OTL. Even the focus on popular culture like the Trilateral Commission and the Grand Area is still ruling the Reds universe. What I mean by that is the Western European-North America-Japan hegemony.
What happened to China and Russia? They are our Britain and France now. Mexico? It's our Canada now. Communist Ethiopia and Iran? Central Asian culture? Soviet Union is not going to look exactly like OTL right?
It's simply hard to look at all of it...but thanks for trying. But it doesn't work. It's just so bad. The United States culture in Male Rising looks more Reddish than your attempts and that's a US that only looks more Germany-Sweden economically IOTL.
Read about socialist Russia in Male Rising. That's the weirdness I am talking. Sure, that's Russia. But it doesn't look like Russia at all....You know what I am saying?
I know I am maybe setting the bar too high, but I can't help it. I'm sorry for saying all of this if it may offend some people.
It's even more annoying that we have non-socialists participating that for all of their enthusiasm in participating and effort in making things happen....It just doesn't click. You guys may have not noticed it but you are all bringing your own prejudices in your world-building and character-making. Ideological biases, as well. Even if you guys try to lessen it and be more non-partisan and put things in the context of Reds! as you understand it.
It's just doesn't work unfortunately.
I've seen the characters...and I've already mentioned one example that did not look a fit at all and explained what I mean. But I am too tired to point out things about the others...because it just built up to almost everyone in terms of incompatibilities.
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Dawkins is an actually awful fucking human being. His twitter feed is pure garbage.
He's a racist, sexist Islamophobic pile of hateful trash and is just the sort of smug pseudointellectual that turns many people off of atheism entirely.
New Atheism is pure garbage that even honest to goodness atheists cringe at the entire thing.
They are nothing compared to the real materialists, humanists and atheists...especially Enlightenment and 19th century philosophers and thinkers like Marx, etc. Even those in the 20th century.
It's just...this recent thing.
It's crap. I don't see this in the Comintern at all.
I think part of the conditions of the rise of New Atheism include the conditions created by the 1960's culture wars IOTL that I just don't see happening in Reds! America. We also have the conservative backlash of the 1980s and the entire frustration of the scientific community on many blockages in efforts against climate change, etc.
It's even worse...the entire thing is so post 9-11. The movement reeks of Western Islamophobia.
They are nothing compared to the real materialists, humanists and atheists...especially Enlightenment and 19th century philosophers and thinkers like Marx, etc. Even those in the 20th century.
It's just...this recent thing.
It's crap. I don't see this in the Comintern at all.
I think part of the conditions of the rise of New Atheism include the conditions created by the 1960's culture wars IOTL that I just don't see happening in Reds! America. We also have the conservative backlash of the 1980s and the entire frustration of the scientific community on many blockages in efforts against climate change, etc.
It's even worse...the entire thing is so post 9-11. The movement reeks of Western Islamophobia.
So bullshit...so arrogant.
New Atheism is a fundamentalist religion by itself. It's a cult. It's nothing different from fundamentalist Christianity.
It's scientism. It's garbage.
It's actually problematic in creating a bigger divide between progressive and reactionary America. They are creators of Trump as well.
And these "New Atheists" just happen to have a platform and visible but they do not represent the majority of the irreligious, at all. Trust me.
New Atheism is a fundamentalist religion by itself. It's a cult. It's nothing different from fundamentalist Christianity.
It's scientism. It's garbage.
It's actually problematic in creating a bigger divide between progressive and reactionary America. They are creators of Trump as well.
And these "New Atheists" just happen to have a platform and visible but they do not represent the majority of the irreligious, at all. Trust me.