Professional Sports in the CSA

Very doubtful. If they won, a long shot, the UK and France would likely need to have recognized them, and the CS President Davis was reportedly considering emancipation late in the war to bolster manpower. If they emancipated some slaves to join the army, they'd have to emancipate them all eventually.
that said, it's not too out-there that they'd use de facto slave labor to build them--even after slavery was abolished, the South basically kept it and just started calling it "sharecropping" instead
I never even knew such a thing existed! Crazy. If the CSA continued to exist, it'd be interesting to see how civil rights and desegregation goes in that country. I tend to think of those as inevitable in the Americas.
what civil rights? :p i'm pretty sure that's not in the Confederate dictionary
 
Can we please stop going off on tangents and address the question that the OP stated:

How would sports develop in the CSA?

So, in the spirit of that question, let me posit:

Baseball would roughly stay the same, but I suspect that the CSA would maintain it's own league. There might be some good will games between the CSA and USA, but the leagues will remain apart into at least the early 20th century.

As for football, I'm really interested in how it may develop differently. I suspect that, much like it's northern counterpart, it will develop from the game played at elite schools.

I think that the game will be heavily influenced by the rules that develop in the US (assuming we still get a development of the gridiron game and downs) but will seek to differentiate itself from it's Yankee counterpart. Possibly an earlier adoption of the forward pass? Or maybe we will see something totally different, such as a forward kick being allowed, but no pass (influence of rugby?)

I suspect Basketball may not catch on, due to it's early associations with New England. Hockey may come about, but that will be a much later development

Does anyone think that the CSA may develop it's own 'national game' of some sort? Or would it modify an existing sport to fill that roll - much as their are Aussie and Irish rules Football?
 
I wonder if soccer might be more popular in the CSA than in the USA? Not to the degree of being the most popular sport, but it could still end up being decently popular.

Baseball would roughly stay the same, but I suspect that the CSA would maintain it's own league. There might be some good will games between the CSA and USA, but the leagues will remain apart into at least the early 20th century.

As for football, I'm really interested in how it may develop differently. I suspect that, much like it's northern counterpart, it will develop from the game played at elite schools.

I think that the game will be heavily influenced by the rules that develop in the US (assuming we still get a development of the gridiron game and downs) but will seek to differentiate itself from it's Yankee counterpart. Possibly an earlier adoption of the forward pass? Or maybe we will see something totally different, such as a forward kick being allowed, but no pass (influence of rugby?)

Does anyone think that the CSA may develop it's own 'national game' of some sort? Or would it modify an existing sport to fill that roll - much as their are Aussie and Irish rules Football?

There would be some baseball leagues with CSA-only teams, but there'd be plenty of cross-border play. This would definitely influence the development of the major leagues. Would the best of the CSA teams be able to compete with the best of USA teams?

If it had a "national game", it would likely be some version of gridiron football which develops differently than in the North.
 

JJohnson

Banned
In which elite schools in the CSA could football develop from rugby? UVA, Transylvania University, Auburn? I'm not familiar with the elite colleges back in the 19th.
 
In which elite schools in the CSA could football develop from rugby? UVA, Transylvania University, Auburn? I'm not familiar with the elite colleges back in the 19th.

Actually, for some reason, I was thinking military academies might be a good choice as well.
 
AFL (1934)
Charlotte Bantams
Dallas Rams; Dallas Cowboys (1960)
Louisville Bourbons
Memphis Tigers; Memphis Southmen (1974); Memphis Grizzlies (1975); Memphis Showboats (1984–1985)
St. Louis Blues
Tulsa Oilers; Houston Oilers (1960); Tennessee Oilers (1997); Tennessee Titans (1999)
Oklahoma City Chiefs; Oklahoma Outlaws (1984)
Miami Seahawks (1946) Miami Dolphins (1966)
Orlando Panther (1958)
Alabama Hawks (1963)
Richmond Rebels (1964)
Atlanta Falcons (1965)
Miami Dolphin (1965)
New Orleans Saints (1966)
Birmingham Americans (1974); Birmingham Vulcans (1975); Birmingham Stallions (1983)
Tampa Bay Buccaneers (1974); Tampa Bay Bandits (1983)
Florida Blazers (1974); San Antonio Wings (1975)
The Hawaiians (1974)
Houston Texans/Shreveport Steamer (1974); Shreveport Steamer (1975)
Jacksonville Sharks (1974): Jacksonville Express (1975); Jacksonville Bulls (1984); Jacksonville Jaguar (1993)
Arizona Wranglers (1983, 1984); Arizona Outlaws (1985; result of Arizona/Oklahoma merger)
Houston Gamblers (1984); Houston Texans (1999)
San Antonio Gunslingers (1984)
Carolina Panthers (1993)
 
Minor-league teams perhaps? I don't know how far back minor league hockey goes in the South.


I could see that. In the mid 90's, when I was a teenager, a string of minor-league ECHL (East Coast Hockey League) teams sprung up here in Louisiana (and all across the South). Lafayette, Baton Rouge, New Orleans, Alexandria, and Shreveport all had teams. There's actually a book about it called Hockey Night In Dixie, that I've been meaning to read.
 
I honestly think the biggest change might be totally outside the CSA's control: the invention of basketball.

Baseball and football with a smattering of rugby probably rules the day. There's likely slave leagues that become Negro leagues in the latter 19th century. Sooner or later in the 20th century someone will break the colour barrier, be it through legislation, cultural pressure from the Union, or a desire to capitalize on an underutilized talent pool.

If hockey does develop it will be much later in history. Probably the 1960s onward.
 
the territorial wrestling scene might have survived or at least wouldn't have been took over by a company from the USA.
 
Leaving asside the whole issue of having the CSA survive until the latter half of the 20th century, a dicey proposition at best, I just don't see Hockey making it in the south in any meaningfull way.

OTL the presence of teams and the existence of a, unfortunately still quite small, base of fans and players in the area was due to two facts:

I) The enthusiasm and renewed interest for Hockey in the US following the Miracle on Ice at Lake Placid in 1980.
II) The desire of building up the NHL for a solid television contract in the US and the assumption that some kind of solid overall geographic representation of most US regions to do so.

Since the Miracle on Ice was mainly won by players from the northernmost states in the US, who came from a longer tradition of Hockey made possible by the climates of the aforementionned states, I simply don't see the CSA being able to put a time together who might be able to make an ITTL version of it. If they're is some kind of Miracle on Ice equivalent it will be won by players from those same regions, which will be an american (as in ITTL-US) victory, not a confederate one. The spark of enthusiasm born of national pride that will came of it will simply not cross the border with the CSA.

Similarly, the tv networks of ITTL US are simply unlikely to care wheter the NHL, or its ITTL equivalent, has teams in the confederacy, leaving far less incentive for a risky expansion to the south.

Add that to the fact that the South is overwhelmingly likely to be considerably poorer then OTL, as well as that, to be frank, Hockey isn't doing all that well in the south as it is either and I just don't see an expansion of Hockey in the south.
 
In apartheid South Africa, football (soccer) became the de facto "black sport" while rugby was the "white sport". To a degree this is still true.

I could see basketball becoming very popular among the CSA's African American population while the white population avoids it. This could have interesting effects as US basketball teams might end up recruiting players from the CSA.
 
With a strong English influence in the CSA I can the 1934 AFL being full of Football (Soccer) Clubs. Also both rugby and cricket could become popular too.
 
I could see basketball becoming very popular among the CSA's African American population while the white population avoids it. This could have interesting effects as US basketball teams might end up recruiting players from the CSA.

Basketball might be stillborn as a sport, it wasn't invented until decades after the POD.

With a strong English influence in the CSA I can the 1934 AFL being full of Football (Soccer) Clubs. Also both rugby and cricket could become popular too.

If we use Canada as an example, a literal British colony, soccer and rugby never really took off. Rugby morphed into football and baseball was immensely popular, but soccer languished on the sidelines for decades afterwards. I don't really see why this would change in the CSA.
 
Could Mantracking become a southern sport ITTL with a proper league and rules?

It may be frowned upon, but I can imagine a sport emerging from slave catching, something similar to OTL animal hunting, but without killing anybody. I remember two TV reality shows :

- a Canadian one : Mantracker, in which contestants were pitted in a race to the finish against an expert wilderness tracker.
- a United States one : Hunted, a series that centered on nine teams of two as they are fugitives on the run from highly skilled investigators.

Those two reality shows focused on the "hunted" part of the competition. I think that a game focusing on the "hunter" part could be created in CSA. The preys are given from 36 hours to three days to reach the ending location by any means, and by any route necessary. The "Mantrackers" teams will then attempt to capture the preys while on horseback before they reach the finish line using various expert tracking skills. The "Mantrackers" who capture the higher number of preys win the game.

This game will later be adapted in order to be more politically correct with bounty hunters, instead of Mantrackers, and real criminals whose jail terms will be diminished, if they can escape to the bounty hunters.
 
Last edited:
National Association (CSA Baseball)
East
Atlanta Colts
Miami Marlins
Tampa Bay Rays
Havana Scorpions
Central
Memphis Giants
Nashville Seraphs
New Orleans Pelicans
West
Dallas Steers
Arizona Diamondbacks
Santa Fe Fuego

MLB ("Union" Baseball)
National League
East
Montreal Expos
New York Mets
Philadelphia Phillies
Washington Senators
Brooklyn Dodgers
Central
Chicago Cubs
Cincinnati Reds
Milwaukee Braves
Pittsburgh Pirates
St. Louis Cardinals
West
Colorado Rockies
Los Angeles Angels
San Diego Padres
San Francisco Giants

American League
East
Baltimore Orioles
Boston Red Sox
New Jersey Stallions
New York Yankees
Toronto Blue Jays
Central
Chicago White Sox
Cleveland Indians
Detroit Tigers
Kansas City Royals
Minnesota Twins
West
Houston Astros
Hollywood Stars
Oakland Athletics
Seattle Mariners
 
the territorial wrestling scene might have survived or at least wouldn't have been took over by a company from the USA.

Butterflies make that all pretty hard to figure but consolidation by one or several national giants probably isn't unlikey in the long-term.

Wrasslin' however would be a very big part of CSA culture. Due to the nature of pro wrestling I think a North American Wrestling Alliance across borders is likely in some form. Given most Confederate TLs involve annexing Caribbean territory and likewise in Mexico, the influences and connection of lucha libre would be interesting. Although I don't think you can kill wrestling in the Union, an expose like The Fall Guys that was published in the 1930s could do extra damage than IOTL. The expose was by a New York Times sports reporter, the first real lifting the lid on pro wrestling's staged nature. It had a short-term impact across North American wrestling but it also turned the sport into a laughing stock in New York and New England where the promoters caught out operated. Wrestling in the region didn't rebound until the 1950s and didn't really stabilise until the 1970s. If Pro Wrestling is linked with the hated Rebs, a little jingoism mixed into the controversy could lead to even bigger repurcussion, perhaps even being banned as a fraudulent enterprise (something raised and even enacted on a local scale in several places) in certain parts of the Union, or simply losing popularity due to the extra tarnish.
 
Top