What is the status of Buffalo (NY)?
I'll quote jm from last year:Better yet, have we agreed on anything for the Great Lakes Region?
This is the East Map. Detroit and Buffalo appear to be the two largest cities and capitals of kingdoms. Toronto appears to be a kind of ecclesiastical state, and Rochester a lesser kingdom. The rest of the Lakes region looks like either small states, or peripheral parts of larger empires. There is plenty of room to develop smaller local powers and a unique "Lakes" culture.What we do know about New York State is such - it is feudal, has around 2,000,000 people, uses lancers (knights) as the primary soldier, is Non-Denominational, and exports wine, timber, and textiles.
White appareantly planned to break NY up pretty badly - we have New York proper based around Syracuse, a US-controlled NYC, and Gennesee County, based around Buffalo (which seems to resemble Hamburg), plus Albany County and what I can only presume are Ulster and Columbia Counties as mini-kingdoms. However, unlike the West Map, the East Map should only be a guideline to show us who the main players are, so you can feel free to ignore those borders when the time comes.
Isn't cotton a very wasteful crop? Even Today it is notorious for depleting soil and water resources The Aral Sea disaster is an extreme example... not a good idea for an Irrigator society concerned with saving every drop. I have seen flax mentioned as an alternative fiber, and I suggested that California relies on hemp. Either way, when I wrote about Californian farming I imagined that the peasants wear something very similar to traditional Mexican peasant costume... something like in this mural, but not in a plantation context.Irrigation
Wool and Cotton are the main textiles, and the single most universal piece of clothing is the wool poncho. A man's poncho is his most important possession, and will often be decorated with symbols representing his family. Women will wear a similar garment, the serape. The more ornate a poncho or serape, the more powerful the wearer likely is. Under these garments, a person will often wear a simple loincloth or skirt, breeches being too restrictive in the hot sun. Sandals serve as footwear, and only the most destitute beggars won't wear makeup to protect their eyes. Men will wear a wide-brim straw hat, while women will wear a simple veil.
I'll add that like everything else, housing follows a north-south gradient in the California Republic. Building in the far north is almost entirely of wood, and in the far south most buildings are adobe. In the middle-south, half-timbered frame houses are most common, with the space between the timbers filled up with adobe.Housing:
Houses are built from mudbrick, mixed with straw to strengthen it. Such houses prove to be durable in the arid climes, and keep the bright sun out. Only the wealthy build houses out of stone, and they build them for ostentatious reasons. Only in California is wood-based housing common, and even then they leave the Sacred Redwoods alone.
An important addition: Californian luxury goods are key drivers of the salt trade. Without Californian wine and craft goods, Deseret would have nothing to buy with the gold and silver gained from eastern salt buyers. It is demand for Californian luxuries that keeps Utahn salt makers working hard.Trade:
Salt. The entire trade economy of the Southwest runs on salt. It is the most valuable commodity on the continent, and most of it comes from Deseret and New Mexico. The great salt mines produce that which is more valuable than gold to send it to the somewhat salt-deprived Feudal Core in the east.
I need to do more with the Great Basin tribes. Their basic culture is like other Herdsmen, but their location between empires of different religions has affected their own belief structure very much. I mentioned that the ones called "Nevadans" (by the Californians) practice a variant form of Scientology, live in matrilineal clans but have male chiefs, and carry much of the trade goods between California and Utah. I think we need to do a little more exploring to find out what it means to live in a tribal region surrounded by empires that practice such different religions. Probably a lot of syncretism despite what California's officials would like to think... many Basin herdsmen probably change their religious practice from day to day.Society:
The scarcity of water means that Irrigation politics is much more simple than others. In contrast to the heavily structured and layered nature of the East's feudalism, Westerm society has only two real groups - those who have, and those who have not. It is this nature that allows the Hydraulic Empires to exist. The main dividing lines are those of religion - the Mormons of Deseret, the New Agers of New Mexico, the Scientologists of the Californias, the Nevadan Heretics. Religion determines the differences amongst the empires - Mormonism, for example, does not endorse using eunuchs (officially), while New Agers believe women have innate healing properties and teach their womenfolk herbology. However, from the Tabernacle in Salt Lake City to Roswell, where the World of Man and the World of Elsewhere meet, to the Heretics' infamous City of Sin, one rule remains constant: He who rules the water, rules the people.
I really hate the name, so I need to change that. I can't think of anything better, though. League of Three Lakes. The Trilakes League. Nothing sounds good.Is there a map of this lake league stuff? Seems like a lot of small states are independent, how can they survive in such a cutthroat environment
That's an awesome name. Laurentian League it is.Ahhh much more sense, I live near St Ignace and that makes sense to me, Love the flag, and you're right the name needs changing, but I have no clue either way. Great Lakes Alliance? or the Laurentian League(Wikipedia list Laurentian Great Lakes as a way to differ it from the Great Lakes in Africa)
More or less what I was thinking. Many members are sworn to various actual states, but are still members in one form or another of the Laurentian League(I like that name by the way).I really hate the name, so I need to change that. I can't think of anything better, though. League of Three Lakes. The Trilakes League. Nothing sounds good.
But the league is centered in the area where Superior, Huron, and Michigan meet. The two lead cities are Soo (Sault Ste. Marie) and St. Ignace. Both are in the border region between Wisconsin and Michigan territory, so I think there is room for them to eke out an independent existence. The basis of their wealth and independence is Soo's control of Lake Superior's fisheries, and St. Ignace's control of the passage through the Mackinac Straits.
Other members are shore cities that might technically belong to one or the other, but are far from the centers of power so they are fairly autonomous; so for them, the municipal governments have joined the league, while still belonging to their respective kingdom.
Most Lake Superior members are not part of any kingdom and are fully independent city-states.
I suppose if we want to be fully Hanseatic about it, it would be the merchant guilds, not the cities themselves, that are members of the league. But there's no reason for this to be an exact copy of the original Hansa. In this case, I think a proper confederation of cities makes some sense. We'll have to explore it further.
Another important thing to remember about the Lake is that, as Jord says, it's not a united power. Each of the three Committees might focus policy in a different direction, while the cities themselves have individual interests, as well. This is mitigated somewhat by the fact that each of the two lead cities is a member of 2 Committees. (St. Ignace belongs to Michigan and Huron, and Soo belongs to Huron and Superior.)
I did make a map. I think the purple spaces might be over-generous, especially in Wisconsin. If Green Bay and not Milwaukee or Madison is Wisconsin's capital, then the purple area definitely should be reduced. But some of it fits with the idea of the Iowan Invasion that weakened the territorial powers; the cities could rise in the resulting power vacuum.
I think we just decided that Wisconsin is based in Green Bay and so controls its coastline. Later today I can fix that purple map.Wisconsin controls it's own Michigan coastline correct? Or the cities are semi-independent?
Yes, or at least most of it. I'd guess that the southern coast-line's almost entirely Wisconsinite in loyalty, but cities nearer the upper peninsula would be Laurentian League members while being sworn to the Governor. Hansa-esque overlap of sovereignity, I guess.Wisconsin controls it's own Michigan coastline correct? Or the cities are semi-independent?
If they bring back trading canoes like the coureurs de bois, they can trade on almost any river, no matter how shallow.On the note of the League, though, how much inland penetration of influence do we think is possible through rivers? I profess not to know much about how navigable those rivers are for trade based in the Lakes. Also, with medieval technology, how useful would the northern Mississippi be in trade networks?
The official term, as far as I understand it, is Papal Nuncio.I'm glad to see that some iteration of this kept going after my long absence from the board. Kudos on managing it better than I did as well, jmberry. Seems like it's going well.
As you've opened up the general world a bit, let me put in something I thought about compared to the old thread and Catholicism:
I think that we did underestimate the tyranny of distance and the effects that that will have on the european Papacy's grasp on power. It may retain power in Quebec due to easier contact, but the more I think about it the more I feel it would lose a lot of power the further south you go, which opens up some interesting possibilities for further conflicts.
Considering there are more Catholics in Latin America than Europe currently and their distance politically and physically from the modern center of Catholicism(Francis notwithstanding), I think there's a real possibility of there being at least one antipope residing in Latin America. So Catholics in the Western Hemisphere may be split between a Mexican Pope, the "Quebecker" Pope, and others that drifted closer into the Nondenominational Church.
Here's how I see this happening: difficulty of contact with Rome, losing many members to the Nondenoms, Scientoligists, New Agers, and closer to home Voudoo-ists(who probably include Santeria movements as well), and a clash of temporal interests may lead to one rising state in the south to declaring their own Pope in the New World. It's also possible that the Roman pope could name a "Patriarch of the New World" to act in his stead who simply grows into his own de facto power.