Discussion in 'Alternate History Discussion: Before 1900' started by Noscoper, Nov 7, 2019 at 5:09 PM.
What the largest territory, the German colonial empire could get post 1821 and pre-1914
No Zanzibar-Heligoland Agreement would mean Germany keeps Zanzibar, Tanaland, and Jubaland.
Germany could feasibly get to Buganda and the other Lake Kingdoms before Britain does.
France offered Germany French Indochina in exchange for being allowed to keep Alsace-Lorraine.
Germany could get the Philippines instead of the United States.
Spain considered selling Rio de Oro to Austria. Germany could buy it instead and ask for Rio Muni while they're at it.
I see no reason why Germany couldn't get Sabah.
Well if Denmark becomes a part of Germany, Iceland, Greenland, (which while it might not have that many people it's huge), and the Virgin islands.
Maybe the buy it from spain in 1870-80'?
Maybe a weaker USA, HRE/PRUSSIA/Germany could reconolize Klein-Venedig/Welserland?
Other could be they get part of Arabian Peninsula from the ottoman in exchange of something?
Incidentally, while this certainly wouldn't quell Germany's ambitions in the west, it would quite their temper and anger about not being able to build a true German Empire.
Might limit world war one.
Germany picks up Denmark to gain Greenland, Danish Virgin Islands, the Faroe Islands, possible Iceland, and the Nicobar Islands. War with France could yield French Indochina and perhaps leading to purchase of Sabah, Philippines, and Formosa. No Heligoland deal means more of Africa, Spain might sell Rio Muni and Rio de Oro as above. Curacao was discussed. Togoland, SW Africa, Tanzania, and Kamerun remain German per OTL but half of Mozambique and over half of Angola might be wrung from Portugal, perhaps with more under the wrong conditions (Cape Verde, the Azores, or Madiera seem possible).
What about Spain ceding Luzon to British and Sabah, Sarawak and the rest of the Philippines go to Germany.
This is about germany not england
An earlier unification of Germany means more time to build up a navy, and more space to potentially colonise. Maybe get Frederick William IV of Prussia to accept the accept the position of German Emperor in 1848/49 ITTL.
Also, they need someone more pro-colonialism than Bismark as chancellor. Any ideas?
Zanzibar was independent, so no Heligoland treaty means its still independent. Germany wouldn't get the Caprivi strip in Southwest Africa either without the treaty. Even the East Africa coastal strip isn't German before 1890 (still Zanzibar technically), although the interior is. The Heligoland treaty cleared that bit up. Plus the treaty means her colonial boundaries are guaranteed by the biggest naval power in the world which is worth something. Not sure that Germany could keep Tanaland, and Jubaland without the treaty in some big confrontation with England. So the treaty ain't all bad.
Yes maybe Germany could have struck a better deal certainly if she would have acted disinterested about Heligoland, made the British up their offer a bit. Maybe she could have got the Volta delta in Togo or something or kept Tanaland.
Without WW1 I think Germany would have taken matters in to her own hands and soon on the Portuguese colonial empire, forcing the split of the colonies with Britain.
Germany can gain Papua New Guinea instead of Britain having them.
I want to say that the Germans don't deserve Luzon as the Americans inherited the difficulty in keeping them IOTL, keeping them to somebody willing to have them separate is better.
Yeah that is other too.
I think if Spain has the Spice Islands instead of Luzon, Germany might get more interested than IOTL.
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