Italy stays neutral

I'm not sure that's enough. Mussolini's foreign policy was essentially opportunistic. He'd join with the side that he thought would turn out to be the winner and/or that he thought would give him more.

So staying on the French-British side, be it in normal diplomatic relationships before the war, and then in outright alliance or in friendly neutrality, is problematic, because a) the French and British have interests in the Med that are opposed to any further Italian expansion, so it's difficult for them to offer more, and b) because by summer 1940, they certainly don't look like they are the winners.

Unless Mussolini's instincts change (or he's replaced), he'll lean for Germany sooner or later.

OTOH the Brits don't want to fight the Italian fleet if they don't have to either so they don't want to risk a war either. Any ship that is fighting the Italian navy is a ship not fighting U-boats.
 
How would a Italian policy of allowing Jewish and Other People fleeing the Nazi Germany Camp, effect the Relatinship with United States, could this increase trade and improve relations with Italian Americans. Could larger number of individual (Jewish and Roma and others) survive the until the end of the War?


Orion
 

sanusoi

Banned
If Italy stays neutral throughout the war, the Jewsih populations within Italy are safe from gas chambers.

Next answer, Italy would have the ability to stay neutral throughout 1941. Look at the wider context, France is down the drain, the UK is fighting a naval war with Germany. Hitler, will attack the Soviet Union.
In simple English, the UK wouldn't want to force Italy into the Axis camp. That would be disaterous. So the Uk will try to bring inticements to the Italians, like land and prehaps more open trade. Don't forget that some countries are prepared to sell
 
Not having to bail out the Italian adventures in Africa and the Balkans will go a long way to bolster German operations against the USSR and the western allies in Europe.
 
OTOH the Brits don't want to fight the Italian fleet if they don't have to either so they don't want to risk a war either. Any ship that is fighting the Italian navy is a ship not fighting U-boats.

In fact. So suppose Mussolini tells them OK, he wants both supplies and some French territory in order to stay quiet. I'm afraid the British will say no, however much they'd desire italy to remain neutral. Which won't go down well at a time when the Germans look like they are the winners. We're back to OTL.
 
Depends on how public this all is. If he doesn't get French territory he might settle for a larger number of British weapons.
 
Depends on how public this all is. If he doesn't get French territory he might settle for a larger number of British weapons.

I doubt that. By 1934, Italian Fascism had reached a dead end, and Mussolini had begun looking for adventures abroad, only secondarily for their intrinsic value, and primarily as a means to renew internal support for the "Fascist revolution". Once things worked out reasonably well in Abyssinia, Spain, and of course Albania, he developed an appetite for that, also fostered by the competition with his colleague Hitler, and came to think of himself as a clever strategist.
Offering him more supplies and weaponry is a paltry compensation, in comparison with the annexation of territories. By October 1940, he even seems to have been more interested in trying to annex wider territories by force than in annexing maybe smaller territories, but in safety and without bloodshed.
Supplies also highlight the fact that Italy, notwithstanding his post-sanctions Autarchia policies, remains dependent on outer sources, while foreign-supplied weaponry seems to imply the Italian weaponry aren't as good and/or Italian industries are not up to the competition. He'd feel as if he had been bought; as if the shop-owners' nations had managed to dull his steel's edge with their gold.
With Mussolini one always has to keep in mind the internal propaganda angle and his high opinion of himself.
 
Could some sort of Italian crisis at the time of the invasion of France work? Mussolini would be too busy dealing with the crisis to help the Germans in France. The French get defeated as OTL and Vichi France is created. When the crisis is dealt with there is nothing to gain for Mussolini if he joins the Germans, so he decides to stay neutral?
 
Could some sort of Italian crisis at the time of the invasion of France work? Mussolini would be too busy dealing with the crisis to help the Germans in France. The French get defeated as OTL and Vichi France is created. When the crisis is dealt with there is nothing to gain for Mussolini if he joins the Germans, so he decides to stay neutral?

Yes, that could be arranged - but it would deal with French territories only. Admittedly, Mussolini was more interested in Tunis, Corse and bits of the border; there were even historical Italian minorities to tout there.
But if Britain remains in the fray, he'll be tempted by a chunk of Egypt (or even more than just a chunk), British Somaliland (which he took in OTL), other British bits on the borders of Eastern Italian Africa, and of course Malta (some historical Italian presence there).
 
I doubt that. By 1934, Italian Fascism had reached a dead end, and Mussolini had begun looking for adventures abroad, only secondarily for their intrinsic value, and primarily as a means to renew internal support for the "Fascist revolution". Once things worked out reasonably well in Abyssinia, Spain, and of course Albania, he developed an appetite for that, also fostered by the competition with his colleague Hitler, and came to think of himself as a clever strategist.
Offering him more supplies and weaponry is a paltry compensation, in comparison with the annexation of territories. By October 1940, he even seems to have been more interested in trying to annex wider territories by force than in annexing maybe smaller territories, but in safety and without bloodshed.
Supplies also highlight the fact that Italy, notwithstanding his post-sanctions Autarchia policies, remains dependent on outer sources, while foreign-supplied weaponry seems to imply the Italian weaponry aren't as good and/or Italian industries are not up to the competition. He'd feel as if he had been bought; as if the shop-owners' nations had managed to dull his steel's edge with their gold.
With Mussolini one always has to keep in mind the internal propaganda angle and his high opinion of himself.

Almost by definition this TL assumes Mussolini is more cautious then OTL.
 
Who said Britain made peace?

Who says they did? Where is Britain going to invade? Where can they be assured success? Bombing Germany won't accomplish anything as they don't have the numbers or correct doctrine.

They are rendered irrelevant.
 
Yes, that could be arranged - but it would deal with French territories only. Admittedly, Mussolini was more interested in Tunis, Corse and bits of the border; there were even historical Italian minorities to tout there.
But if Britain remains in the fray, he'll be tempted by a chunk of Egypt (or even more than just a chunk), British Somaliland (which he took in OTL), other British bits on the borders of Eastern Italian Africa, and of course Malta (some historical Italian presence there).

I wouldn't count out the possibility that England might look the other way if Italy took some of French North Africa. After all France is out of the war and can do little about it. England might except the new reality if Italy restricts itself to French territory.
 
Who says they did? Where is Britain going to invade? Where can they be assured success? Bombing Germany won't accomplish anything as they don't have the numbers or correct doctrine.

They are rendered irrelevant.
Yugoslavia is the best guess maybe Norway.
 
Norway is out as the British don't have the ability to pull it off.

Yugoslavia, pray tell how they can pull that off?

Yugoslavia has a long coastline and there was a large partisan presence. Land troops where ever you want as the Nazis have no way of stopping it with Italy neutral and build airstrips. The Nazis can't take back the coast with the RN there.
 
Repost of an incomplete TL of mine for this very scenario.

6-10-40
Mussolini stays quiet, though the British and the French expect war at any moment (indeed the French HOPE to be attacked, knowing how weak Italy really is, mainly to have an excuse to surrender)
6-14-40
Paris falls to the Nazis. Mussolini explodes with envy, but has the guts to swallow this and much more. Italian public opinion asks for war, but he decides it's better to wait after receiving clear signs that Britain will resist, and will declare war if France is however attacked
6-27-40
After some debate, the French surrender and sign an armistice at Compiègne
6-28-40
For Air Marshall Italo Balbo, a day like any other in its golden exile as Governor of Lybia (he isn't killed in action by his own fellow countrymen, as in OTL)
6-30-40
German occupation of the Channel Islands. Italy mediates more acceptable conditions for France (German occupation reduced to the city of Paris and the Channel and Atlantic coasts, vast demilitarized strip up to OTL occupied France border) in exchange for the return of Nizza and a co-dominium on Corsica, which are reluctantly conceded. hitler is quite pleased at seeing the Italians prefer to keep quiet.
July 1940
Mers-el-Kebir, Dakar. British forces help De Gaulle in the conquest of Vichy Equatorial Africa
August 1940
The Battle of England goes on stage. The British are slightly better off in terms of fighters.
9-30-40
An embittered Hitler renounces the invasion of England and orders night terror bombing and U-boot blockade of Britain
October
Growing tensions between Greece and Italy force the British to increase the Egyptian garrison and overtly offer protection to Greece in case of attack
10-18/19/20-40
Hitler, now frustrated over his failure to break Britain's will to fight, fails to convince Franco, Pétain and Mussolini to enter the war against Britain. Indeed, the three close together in an informal alliance of neutrals.
11-15-40
After Italian pressure and German menaces Metaxas gives Italy a 99-year lend of the naval base at Suda (Creta), and that's all.
3-27-1941
Yugoslav coup against pro-Axis government
April 1941
Following unbearable losses in bombers, the Germans are forced to renounce the terror bombing campaign on Britain (Goering falls into disgrace) and focus more and more on the submarine campaign
4-6-41
Furious at the Yugoslav "betrayal", Hitler invades that country. Greece mobilizes but waits
4-7-41
Fearing a German invasion, the Greek governemnt refuses British troops
4-14-41
Yugoslavia is crushed and carved up between Germany, Croatia... and Italy, despite having not actually participated in the invasion. Italy gets Dalmatia south of Zara, Kosovo (attached to Albania) and an "independent" Montenegro as a puppet under military occupation
4-18-41
Hitler asks Greece to cede aeronaval bases on the Aegean coast. BEFORE the Greeks can ask time to decide, German troops invade northern Greece
4-19-41
British troops hurry to Greece
4-21-41
Saloniki is taken by the Germans after terrible dive bombings. The Greeks oust the Italians from Suda Bay and seize without bloodshed a cruiser, whose crew is later duly repatriated (commanding officers are tried and jailed by Mussolini for not having resisted).
4-22/25-41
British and Greek forces are defeated in the Aliakmon line battle. Repeated incidents between British and Italian ships in the Ionian, but no one declares war
5-3-41
Commonwealt forces are reduced by German air superiority at the Thermopylae and retire in the Peloponnesos
5-8-41
The Germans rise the Swastika flag on Athen's Akropolis
May
Guerrilla war begins in Montenegro. Both Communist and Chetnik forces massacre Italian garrisons, which answer in kind towards civilians, provoking harsh reaction in the Anglo-Saxon press. British forces crush Iraqi pro-Nazi insurrection
5-18-41
The British evacuation of continental Greece is a half disaster. At least 30,000 men are taken as PoWs
5-20-41
Rudolf Hess parachutes in Scotland and is captured by the British
5-25-41
Being already late with Barbarossa, Hitler decides not to take Creta (for now)
June
Huge British buildup at Crete, Cyprus, in Egypt and the Middle East. Turkey, wooed by both Germany and Britain, remains staunchy neutral and gets closer to Italy, Spain and Vichy in a Mediterranean "neutralist" (but pro-Nazi) front
6-22-41
Unternehmen Barbarossa begins
6-26-41
Romania, Hungary and Slovakia declare war on USSR. Mussolini organizes a voluntary corps to Russia (about 30,000 men)
6-27-41
Finland declares war on USSR
6-30-41
The Nazis take Minsk
7-1/9-41
Nazis fail to take Murmansk
7-6-41
Italian Fascist volunteers arrive in Ukraine
7-9-41
Nazis take Pskov and Zhitomir
7-10-41
Soviets stop the Germans at Luga and Zhitomir
7-10-41
Nazis take Vitebsk
7-15-41
The Nazis take Smolensk
7-17/24-41
Soviets stop the Germans around Smolensk
August 1941
Soviet and British forces jointly (and peacefully) occupy Iran
8-9-41
Mussolini visits Italian troops at Uman, Ukraine. Stalin declares war on Italy, Britain, after some musing, declines to do so.
8-16-41
Soviets stop Finns and Germans at Alakurtti, reconquer Jelnja but lose Roslavl
8-30-41
Nazis conquer Tallinn
9-5-41
The siege of Leningrad begins
9-17-41
The Nazis take Kiev. Rommel closes the Kiev pocket (665,000 PoWs)
9-28-41
As the Italians pour a mobilized army into Ukraine, an increasingly desperate Stalin accepts to receive British reinforcements for the southern Ukrainian front and Crimea - size some four full divisions.
10-2-41
Operation Typhoon against Moscow starts
10-3-41
Nazis conquer Orel. The first British troops from the Middle East cross into the Soviet Union in Azerbaijan. Hasty preparations for winter equipment begin in Britain.
10-5-41
The Nazis, with Italian support, take Kharkov
10-13-41
Nazis take Vjazma and Brjansk
10-20-41 British and Italian troops clash for the first time along the Donec river. Fighting is hard but war is not declared, and will remain undeclared if in full sewing down there. At first Italian prisoners are NOT treated by the British as for the Geneva convention; this will later change for better, when British prisoner begin to be mistreated in kind.
10-24-41
Finns take Petrozavodsk and stop on the Svir river
November
British buildup holds Kerch against the Germans. High tension in the Med as British naval buildup locks the Italian fleet in port as "fleet in power". Italy is not technically at war but absorbs a disproportionate amount of British resources, only for surveillance.
11-17/12-24
Operation Artemisia:
British sweep in the Aegean (Italian Dodecanese is not touched). Most of Aegean islands recpatured, heavy air and naval losses, but route open for the Dardanelles. Major air war develops in the area (the Battle over Greece)
11-30-41
Guderian manages to take Tula. First German-Italian heavy defeat at Rostov: Rommel has to withdraw in the face of spirited Russo-British counterattack and is sacked, then court-martialled and jailed by an enraged Hitler.
December
Turkey pressured to allow at least some British naval assets free passage into the Black Sea. Turks, frightened by German power, say no.
12-5-41
German forces conquer the western outskirts of Moscow and raze the Kremlin with long range artillery
12-6-41
Great Soviet counteroffensive around Moscow with Siberian divisions from the Far East. The German spearhead is broken. Britain declares war on Finland to please the Soviets.
12-7-41
Japan attacks the USA at Pearl Harbor ons chedule
12-11-41
Hitler foolishly declares war on the USA.
12-21-41
Germans at Tula, sorrounded and frozen, surrender (10,000 PoWs)
12-23-41
Japs conquer Wake Island
12-25-41
Japanese conquest of Hong Kong; Italians barely resist the Christmas British-Soviet counteroffensive around Stalino. Heavy discontent and suffering in the British army in Russia (now about 150,000 strong) for lack of winter equipment, heavy weaponry and spare parts - Russians are better equipped, but have much less food.
12-26/1-29
Operation St.George breaks German sieges of Sebastople and Kerch and drives the Germans from southern Crimea
1-2-42
The Japs take Manila
1-12/15-42
British forces stop the Japanese advance in Malaya at the battle of Kuala Lumpur
1-20-42
At Wannsee Conference Nazis begin the planned extermination of European Jews
1-25-42
Japs take Rabaul
2-16-42
Japanese victory on the Royal Navy at the Battle of Bangka near Singapore. Japanese forces land on Sumatra
February-March
British buildup in Northern Sumatra and Singapore/Southern Malaya to maintain control of the Straits. Limited US naval help in Greece; most Allied ships in the Med eye Italy and strictly control its export-import movement, much to Mussolini's rage. German winter buildup in the southern Balkans. Kesselring proposes strategic retreat to fortified Leonidas line (Salonika-Aliakmon) to spare troops: Hitler neins.
2-28-42
Japanese victory at the naval battle of the Java Sea
March 1942
RAF begins firebombing campaign on Germany. Italian troops again commit brutal war crimes against civilians in Yugoslavia in response to fierce Titoist partisan violence
3-6-42
Japs take Batavia/Jakarta
3-8-42
Japanese landing at Lae (New Guinea)
3-9-42
The Dutch East Indies surrender to the Japanese
3-28/30-42
German airdrop on the Dardanelles and capture of Istanbul led by Student as a special Brandenburger operation liquidates most of the Turkish government in Ankara. European Turkey is invaded by a 400,000 strong German-Bulgarian army, crushing any resistance. Surviving Turkish officials declare war on Germany. In Rome Mussolini fumes, ponders and decides to begin withdrawal of Italian troops from Russia, having it discreetly known to Britain and the US through diplomatic channels.
4-9-42
US besieged forces surrender to the Japanese at Bataan. Europan Turkey is solidly in German hands, apart Gallipoli where Turks and Royal Marines hold the peninsula. The Luftwaffe, in a massive surge, sinks a British battleship, three British and a US cruiser anmd a number of minor ships in the "Sinkfest" - Allied air superiority temporarily broken.
12/20-4-42
Germans capture strategic bridgehead across the Bosphorus, easily defendable with no more than two or three divisions against the bulk of the Turkish army.
5-6-42
Japanese conquest of Corregidor completes Jap conquest of the Philippines
5-8-42
Japanese forces take Rangoon. Indecisive US-Japanese aeronaval battle at the Coral Sea (tactical Jap victory, strategical US success)
5-15-42
Yamamoto renounces the Midway project, at least for now
5-15/29-42
Nazis crush British front in Crimea and capture 30,000 Pows in a Tobruk-like defeat, repushing Soviets in Sebastopol
5-24-42
The Italian expedition corps in Russia is reconstituted as a volunteer-only force, no more than three divisions strong. Hitler fumes but backs down. Rommel freed on pressure from his colleagues, sent to Turkey.
5-28/31-41
Resounding German defensive victory on the Soviets at the Second Kharkov (last great German pocket of the war, 230,000 PoWs). British/Indian/Chinese nationalist forces stop the Japs at the battle of Mandalay (central Burma).
June 1942
First limited American land support to Turkey, Marine buildup in the Greek island
6-4-42
Germans capture Kerch and plan to cross into Caucasus
6-13-42
Nazis take Voronezh in Unternehmen Blau, last hope to defeat the Sovets once and for all
6-20-42
Japs conquer Kuala Lumpur against dogged Commonwealth defence but take horrendous casualties - one of the worst battles of the war for sheer ferocity
7-1-42
US troops land in Sumatra and Singapore to help the British and Commonwealth forces
7-19-42
Von Kleist takes Rostov. Lacking forces to attack the Caucasu, Hitler focuses on a "Stalingrad first" policy
7-23/30-42
British 8th Army (Gott) mauled in the Don bend, with 150,000 total losses (100,000 PoWs). This major defeat shakes British morale.
August 1942
Failed Soviet counteroffensive on the Moscow front - a useless bloodbath.
8-1-42
Nazis take Sebastopol from the Russians after an epic siege. Nazis destroy Stalingrad with massive air bombing (50,000 civilian fatalities). Germans enter Stalingrad's northern outskirts reaching the Volga
8-7-42
US Marines land on Guadalcanal
8-16-42
Great aeronaval battle at Santa Cruz: narrow US victory against the Japanese
8-20-42
Germans secure Stalingrad, inflicting a heavy blow and terrible losses to the Soviets, but at a high price. Volga proves however impassable. Double operation aimed at Saratov (secondary) and Astrakhan (main objective) starts
8-24-42
Japanese naval victory at Santa Isabel (Solomon Islands). Italian volunteers in Russia resist a Soviet counterattack across the Don river
8-25-42
Tragic Anglo-Canadian raid failure at Dieppe. Kleist crosses the Kuban and forces the Kerch strait
9-8-42
New great naval battle near Choiseul: both US and Japan lose 2 air carriers. Yamamoto renounces further confrontations down there
9-12-42
Nazis put Novorossisk under siege
9-16-42
Astrakhan under siege, Caspian railways cut by German recon advance units. A panicking Stalin accepts US troops too in the Caucasus. Hitler swithces tank force south to capture oilfields
10-3/8-42
Nazis stemmed in house-to-house fighting in Saratov, stop offensive there. Exceptionally violent fight on the lower Volga and in Astrakhan. Motorized warfare (*think OTL Western Desert) in the Kalmuck Steppe, Kleist captures Novorossisk and Maikop
10-16-42
Soviet forces cross the Volga and establish a bridgehed in Stalingrad - prolonged heavy fighting ensues. Soviet paradrops around the city are annihilated. Kleist stops on the Terek
11-6-42
A US armored division enters combat near Maikop, USSR
11-7-42
Operation Arsenal:
US-British invasion of continental Greece. US paratroopers secure Corinth canal, air superiority achieved, swift capture of under-garrisoned Peloponnesus, subsidiary landing in the Attica - Athens proves a hard bone to gnaw
11-16-42
Soviets begin Operation Uranus, a complex of separate attacks to shatter the German southern front
11-25-42
Uranus is a wild success - Astrakhan isolated, Stalingrad bridgehed rejoined by advancing Soviet spearheads. Operation Mars around Rzhev begins under Zhukov.
11-26/27-42
Japanese forces take Midway in a surprise attack - Japanese naval code breaking by US intelligence had been revealed by a spy, code changed with false information purposely feeded with old code to simulate a massive counterattack into the Solomons
12-13-42
Thorough Japanese defeat at the aeronaval battle of Midway (3 air carriers lost to 0). Disastrous failure of Zhukov's Operation Mars on the central Russian front.
12-15-42
Patton's offensive in the Kuban and Soviet "Operation Saturn" on the lower Don force the evacuation of Stalingrad's western ruins by the Germans. Orderly retreat.
12-16-42
Astrakhan falls to the Soviets after heroic resistance: 50,000 German Pows taken, most are killed on the spot to the Americans' shock.
12-20/23-42 Allies defeated at the Thermopylae, suffer 10,000 PoWs from German counterattack led by Rommel with heavy air support
12-27-42
US forces recapture Palembang (Southern Sumatra)
12-31-42
Japanese forces successfully evacuate Guadalcanal
January 1943
US-Commonwealt forces complete the reconquest of southern Sumatra. Germans stemmed in Greece, but manage to cut Athens from Corinth and Peloponnesus. Heavy fighting in close areas, reminding WW1 or Korean War. No room for manoeuver.
1-5-43
Kleist ably retreats German southern front along the Mius despite Hitler's orders
1-7-43
Patton retakes Rostov after heavy fighting; Tolbukhin crushes the remaining Italian volunteer corps crossing the Don river
1-7/24-43 Tragic fallback of the Italian Fascist Volunteer Corps on the Don river, isolated and pocketed, towards Belgorod. In the end all are captured or die, some 30,000 casualties
1-11-43
Soviets open a way out from the siege of Leningrad
1-18/20-43
US Marines reconquer Midway: hundreds of fatalities, a US main carrier lost to subs
1-21/27-43
Manstein holds the line against Patton along the Azov Sea, heavy American losses lower morale. British re-equipped tank divisions join the slug
2-16-43
Patton refuses to hand back his PoWs to the Soviets as requested; Roosevelt, to avoid bickering, replaces him with Bradley and sends Patton to Greece to replace the unsuccessful Clark
2-18-43
Soviets retake Kharkov to the SS Panzerkorps
March
US-Australian offensive in the Solomon Islands and New Guinea; Us-British-Indian offensive in the Malaya
3-10-43
Germans abandon Vjazma panhandle to reduce battleline length
3-3/17-43
Manstein soundly defeats Soviets and US forces in the Donec battle and reconquers Kharkov
3-27-43
Australian forces retake Buna (New Guinea) after heavy losses
Aprile-June
The Bog Truce along the Eastern Front: the battered Soviets and the exhausted Nazis treat a peace in secret.
4-14-43
Last German defenders in the Novorossisk-Kerch strait area surrender to General Horrocks British XXXth Tank Corprs (who maintains the right to keep its prisoners in UK camps in Middle East): 50,000 PoWs taken
May
Allied decisive victory in the Battle of the Atlantic against Doenitz's U-Boote
5-4-43
The last battered Japs withdraw from North Malaya towards Pathani
5-16-43
US paratroopers conquer Lae (New Guinea)
5-18/20-43
Operation Liberty:
US-British forces land in Morocco and Algeria, forcing the quick surrender/cooperation of local Vichy French forces to secure access to Western Med for Allied shipping and threaten a strategic move against southern France
5-21/24-43
German forces occupy all of France with only scattered resistance by Vichy forces. Petain murdered (poison?), Laval head of puppet France, reinstated in Paris, declares war on the Allies. France descends in low-level civil war, but bolsters significantly German defence. French forces outside the motherland and in North Africa declare for Giraud, De Gaulle and the Allies. Japanese (and Asian natives) massacre Frenchmen in Indochina to avoid troubles, just in case.
5-28-43
Franco's Spain declares the strictest policy of armed neutrality; so does Italy, angering Hitler by now desperate enough to desire an Italian involvement. Operations Schwarz (vs Spain), Otto (vs Italy), Tannenbaum (vs Switzerland) unshelved and considered carefully.
June
Mussolini fortifies northern Italy and frantically searches contact with Allies, fearing a German aggression. Allies reply to evacuate at once Ethiopia, western Yugoslavia, Albania. Italian newspapers ordered to quit worship of Nazi Germany.
6-6-43
Australian and US forces land on Timor. US and British-Indian forces close on Kra Isthmus
6-12-43 The French Fleet sinks itself in the port of Toulon to prevent its being seized by the Germans
6-14/25-43
Operation Odalisque:
A strong aeronaval and land US-British-Turkish push to crush German defence of the Bosphorus and allow Allied shipping through to avoid Russian caving to German. It's a half failure, but a number of ships manage to get through, only to find themselves almost deprived of air cover and at the mercy of the Luftwaffe when bombing Crimea.
6-15-43
Hitler decides against Citadel, to hold in the Balkans, try an armistice with Stalin (for now) and stem the Allies before they make inroads into Europe.
6-20-43
Operation Bellamy:
US takeover of the Ionian islands and landings in Epirus. Kesselring calls again for strategical retreat to Leonidas line (Saloniki-Aliakmon). Immediate German withdrawal to the Thermopylae.
6-27-43
Soviet-German armistice signed in Stockholm by Molotov and Ribbentrop. Current forntlines to be maintained for three months, past which the Wehrmacht is to withdraw past the Pantherstellung (Narva, Vitebsk, Dnepr). Future accords to be negotiated later. Prisoner exchanges to occur from August onwards on a one-by-one basis.
July
Spain under crushing pressure by both sides. Franco stubbornly adheres to neutrality. Mussolini states he will fight "to the death" whoever touches Spain, its last remaining friend.
7-5-43
Hitler concedes evacuation of starved central Greece. Bolstered German defence to hold "indefinitely" on a line from the Olympus to Prespa lake. Neutral Italian Albania will cover the rest, well guarded by several divisions. German forces slip into Italian occupation zones in Yugoslavia, incidents are commonplace.
7-7-43
The Japanese stage a coup in Thailand and install a puppet government to provide Thai troops and real cooperation to the war effort
7-12-43
US landings in southern New Britain
7-14-43
Eradication of the last surviving Japanese on Timor (5,000 allied fatalities)
7-15-43
German Leonidas line proves impregnable, Roosevelt and Churchill decide Balkan theatre is secondary. All Allied troops withdrawn from Soviet Union on Stalin's request, to honor Nazi-Soviet armistice.
7-18-43
Hitler orders plans for invasion of Spain and Italy shelved, but Switzerland must be crushed and divided with collaborationist France. Operation Tannenbaum given green light - forces already deployed in secrecy - but western Allies and Italy know and warn the Swiss, already well prepared.
7-20-43
British-Indian landings at Victoria Point and the Mergui Archipelago (Tenasserim, southeastern Burma)
7-25/30-43
Hamburg Allied firebombing: 25,000 civilians killed, heavy blow to German home morale
7-27-43
Allies reconquered a ruined Istanbul after weeks of street fighting
8-1-43
Operation Tannenbaum, with German (80%) and French fascist (20%) forces: some 500,000 men attack Switzerland at dawn. Luftwaffe massacres thousands in major cities with terror bombings. Border defence is overwhelmed, Swiss General-in-Chief Henri Guisan calls for the Alpine Redoubt to be defended "to the last man". US landing on Bougainville.
8-3-43
Geneva falls under heavy artillery fire and capitulates. Mussolini forbids Allied air supplying of Switzerland; Allies warn Italy not to try annexation of Italian-speaking Switzerland or it will be war. Only a handful of Allied staff officers will make it to the Alpine country.
8-6-43
Zurich falls to a German armored spearhead.
Japanese naval defeat at Kolombangara (Solomon Islands). Japanese fleet abandons Rabaul for Truk
8-15-43
US-British landing at Kuching (western Borneo)
8-16/31-43
Battle of the Plateau - the Swiss army resits in the central western areas around the lakes, but is ultimately overrun, though at a high cost.
8-20-43
The isolated German garrison around Uskudar and Bursa surrenders - 30,000 PoWs, among which Rommel, are taken by the Allies as the Nazis refused to surrender to the Turks for fear of being massacred on the spot.
8-25-43
RAF bombers annihilate Peenemunde delaying German rocket projects. Allied and Turkish offensive against German positions in Thrace. Allied Powers declare war on Bulgaria (wich still they hadn't done)
9-11/14-43
US marines reconquer Wake Island; 800 US fatalities, 4000 Japanese
9-12-43
General Swiss retreat to the Alpine redoubt. Mussolini quietly supports Switzerland, guaranteeing its southern boundary, at least for now, despite repeated German offers for Italian annexation of Ticino. But the Allies have clearly stated that attacking Switzerland means war.
9-14-43
US landing at Brunei (west Borneo)
9-27-43
US landing at Sorong in the Vogelkop peninsula (northwestern New Guinea). The Germans respect the terms of Stockholm armistice with the Soviets and withdraw along the heavily fortified Pantherstellung (Dnepr-Beresina-Peipus-Narva line). Still half of the Wehrmacht is in Russia. Himmler has managed to convince Hitler to raise some anti-Soviet divisions from Ukraine and from PoWs unwilling to go back to the "workers' paradise"
9-30-43
US aeronaval victory on the Japanese at the Equator Battle (or Battle of Maluku Sea)
October
Fanatic Japanese resistance stops US/Commonwealth forces in Borneo at Kota Kinabalu mountain. Allied offensive in Thrace peters out near the Bulgarian border, and is indeed beaten back some miles. Swiss resist in their mountains fortresses, despite some are taken by German Alpenjaegers.
10-16/11-25-43
The Battle of Edirne rages fiercely for several weeks, till the city falls to British forces
10-30-43
US landing at Morotai (North Maluku Islands)
November
Punishing Allied round-the-clock bombardment of France. Paris, however, is mostly spared. Italy suffers austerity from Allied sea-blockade and German hostility. It will be the hardest winter in many, many decades. Switzerland resists hard in the Alps.
11-30-43
MASSIVE ALLIED PARADROP AND LANDING AT CALAIS (Operation Fortitude) with three paratroop divisions, one British and two US Marine divisions, three US and three Commonwealth army divisions. Huge air battles rage, but Luftwaffe cannot do much harm.
12-3-43
Linkup of the main allied bridgeheads at Dunkerque (Canadian-British) and Calais (USA-Free French). US and Australian forces conquer Mando (northern Celebes)
12-6-43
The SU and Mongolia declare war on Japan - some 400,000 men with strong air and tank support invade Manchuria, meeting fanatical Japanese resistance. Germany takes note but doesn't act, despite desperate and humiliating pleas for help from the Japanese - who, for theirs, hadn't helped when requested in 1941.
12-14-43
US forces capture Boulogne-sur-Mer. French pro-Nazi head of state Laval is shot dead in Paris by a suicide partisan commando and replaced by diehard Nazi Joseph Darnand.
12-15-43
Australian troops enter Madang (New Guinea). At Casablanca Roosevelt and Churchill confirm unconditional surrender policy against Germany and discuss Italy's and Spain's position
12-15/18-43
Crushing US aeronaval victory in the Battle of Marcus (fought during a typhoon!)
12-23-43
US Marines complete the extermination of Japanese garrison at Marcus/Minamitori.
 
Outstanding timeline, would like a discussion about the Nazi Death Camps, and would Italy take in Jewish and other groups from Germany.


Thanks


Orion
 
Who says they did? Where is Britain going to invade? Where can they be assured success? Bombing Germany won't accomplish anything as they don't have the numbers or correct doctrine.

They are rendered irrelevant.

You are right that the British strategic bombing might well have had a better doctrine. But the disappearance of a sizable part of Hamburg, for instance, was anything but irrelevant, in the eyes of the Germans themselves at the time, and they obviously knew better than you.

As to the general irrelevance of Britain being at war with Germany, you are right – until Germany opens another front against the SU, which they will. At that point, the British can pull off landings in Norway. Or they can recruit Greece and base bombers there. Or both. They can raid the coasts, like they did in OTL. They can supply the Soviets (like in OTL). And they can raid the coasts (like in OTL). And they go on with the bombing (like in OTL). All of that, alone, does not defeat the Germans, but it's not "alone", since the Germans are at war in the East, too.

Once the USA are in, too, there are further dividends to the absence of a Mediterranean theater; yes, on the one hand the Germans did not waste resources there, but on the other neither have the Allies to wipe out Africa and then land in Italy.

Note that the British decision to stay in the war, the likelihood of Germany turning East, and the German decision to actually do so are all closely interlinked. It wasn't just a casual series of events. One of the reasons why Churchill thought there was a chance of victory (and at the time there were people who disagreed on that, on pretty much the same assumptions you are making) is exactly that he banked on Hitler and Stalin finally coming to each other's throat. And one of the rationalizations Hitler gave himself for doing what he had always wanted to do (attack in the East) was, correctly, that the British would never make peace, as long as they had hope in the Soviets.
 
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