Hitler loved Germany? (and the germans?)

XamuelReyes

Banned
After reading a lot of information about Hitler's kindle, I realized that in Hitler he really loved the Germans, things like Hossbach's memorandum, or some of the monologues he made for his clique that are known, everything he did at least seemed to do for the Germans, reading about one of his speeches in nuremberg about the westward march etc ... I realize that really hitler loved the Germans and that he really wanted to create a utopia for them (at the cost of millions of lives of course)
 
I think Hitler liked the idea of Germans more than he actually liked them.

He did not like the German Empire, Hapsburgs, or Weimar Republic, did not like Christianity, did not seem to care for regional or local identities in Germany or of Germans outside Germany (reducing them to their race), wanted to remake huge aspects of German society through coercive action, killed minority groups that had lived there longer than himself and who identified as German, and showed a pretty serious disregard for German life.
 
Germany could have done without his kind of love. At the end he said the Germans were unworthy of him. He issued the "Nero" Degree that Germany was to be laid waste, with all means of production destroyed. It didn't matter how people would survive after the war, because all the valiant will have fallen. The future would belong to the stronger Eastern Race. He changed his country from a nation of culture, and education into one of Hangmen, Torturers, and Informers. Nazi education taught children to despise the weak, and value only strength, and courage, that the strong take what they want from the weak. He ordered the murder of Germans who were disabled, including veterans. Those things aren't love, there part of a sick dream of perfection.
 
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After reading a lot of information about Hitler's kindle, I realized that in Hitler he really loved the Germans, things like Hossbach's memorandum, or some of the monologues he made for his clique that are known, everything he did at least seemed to do for the Germans, reading about one of his speeches in nuremberg about the westward march etc ... I realize that really hitler loved the Germans and that he really wanted to create a utopia for them (at the cost of millions of lives of course)
He didn't love them. He loved them in same way a Marxist Revolutionary loves the proletariat. They were a vehicle for his own personal power and in the end would kill his beloved people without hesitation if they were standing in his way.

One doesn't kill someone that one love.
 
Germany could have done without his kind of love. At the end he said the Germans were unworthy of him. He issued the "Nero" Degree that Germany was to be laid waste, with all means of production destroyed. It didn't matter how people would survive after the war, because all the valiant will have fallen. The future would belong to the stronger Eastern Race. He changed his country from a nation of culture, and education into one of Hangmen, Torturers, and Informers. Nazi education taught children to despise the weak, and value only strength, and courage, that the strong take what they want from the weak. He ordered the murder of Germans who were disabled, including veterans. Those things aren't love, there part of a sick dream.

Very true. This said it better than I ever could.


I think Hitler liked the idea of Germans more than he actually liked them.

He did not like the German Empire, Hapsburgs, or Weimar Republic, did not like Christianity, did not seem to care for regional or local identities in Germany or of Germans outside Germany (reducing them to their race), wanted to remake huge aspects of German society through coercive action, killed minority groups that had lived there longer than himself and who identified as German, and showed a pretty serious disregard for German life.

This too. He was happy to lean on the past for examples that he liked, but the actual powerful German-speaking nations that had existed before WWI were both despised by him.
 
After reading a lot of information about Hitler's kindle, I realized that in Hitler he really loved the Germans, things like Hossbach's memorandum, or some of the monologues he made for his clique that are known, everything he did at least seemed to do for the Germans, reading about one of his speeches in nuremberg about the westward march etc ... I realize that really hitler loved the Germans and that he really wanted to create a utopia for them (at the cost of millions of lives of course)
What is the point of this thread? Are we just supposed to wax lyrically about Hitler's love of Germans?
 
Hitler reminds me of an old school first testament prophet. Dragging the chosen people through whether they want it or not. And those who don't make it don't deserve it.
Deluded is a word that gets used a lot. There is too much fatalism in Hitler's actions for that. He was gambling for high stakes and knew the odds and the consequences. The prize was a superpower Germany rather than one dominated by the US or USSR. That had to be fought for if it was going to happen.
The main delusion was viewing great power politics through a lens of anti-Semitism.

Probably a key take is that Hitler isn't looking back to an old Germany, but forward to a new one.

What is the point of this thread? Are we just supposed to wax lyrically about Hitler's love of Germans?
The contradictions in Nazis are inherently interesting. e.g. how many saved Jews they liked while condemning millions at the same time? How to have a modernised state yet elevate an imaginary rural ideal?
 
One doesn't kill someone that one love.

People kill whom they love all the time, because humans are complicated and love is one of our more complicated emotions.
I do not think its controversial to say that Hitler "loved" germany, just that that what form love takes for a fairly narcissistic social darwinist mentally succumbing to the unimanigable stress of losing a world war is quite a bit different then what most people on this site experience themself. (at least, they hopefully experience it differently).

That said, I fail to see the point of this thread.
 
Hitler loved his own idea of Germany and germans, not the country and the people living there. Not counting his extensive crimes, he disregarded the geopolitical configuration of Europe and the world to put Germany in a losing position despite being warned by several officers, from 1934 and 1938, in order to fulfill his ideological fantasy. His early successes only stirred his tendency to impose his will even further, with disregard to any second opinion.
The fact he ultimately berated the germans, who were fighting from the artic to the Sahara, because they were unable to realise his absurd and extremely flawed strategic goals, really shows how petty he was, shifting the blame on his people instead of recognizing his own, monumental failure as a leader.
 

CalBear

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Hitler loved the German people until he started to lose big. Then he went 180° the other way. According to Albert Speer (among others), Hitler stated:

“If the war is lost, the people will be lost also. It is not necessary to worry about what the German people will need for elemental survival. On the contrary, it is best for us to destroy even these things. For the nation has proved to be the weaker, and the future belongs solely to the stronger eastern nations. In any case, only those who are inferior will remain after this struggle, for the good have already been killed.”

I( defy anyone to parse "love for the German people" out of that little jewel.

select sources:




 
Hitler was in love with his own twisted thoughts of an "ideal Germany and it's ideal Aryan citizens", not the actual country or it's people.
When it became clear that his twisted dreams were coming to an end in 1945, he ordered Germany to burn with it, hence the "Nero Decree".
 
At least he is consistent on his social Darwinist principles.

I( defy anyone to parse "love for the German people" out of that little jewel.
He is putting down a dying dog that only has a life of pain, humiliation, and subjugation ahead of it.

Of course he is disgusted with the "failure" of the German people, including himself. OTOH his philosophy dooms races who fail to eventual extinction. Remember how much Generalplan Ost took inspiration from the fates of indigenous peoples in the Americas and elsewhere. Germany doesn't deserve to live, it has no future if it does live, so better to die on its feet and deny anything to the conquerors.
 
“There is a man alone, without family, without children, without God....He builds legions but he doesn’t build a nation. A nation is created by families, a religion, tradition: it is made up out of the hearts of mothers, the wisdom of fathers, the joy and the exuberance of children. [Hitler's Germany would be]....an all-swallowing State, disdainful of human dignities and the ancient structure of our race, sets itself up in place of everything else. And the man who, alone, incorporates in himself this whole State, has neither a God to honour nor a dynasty to conserve, nor a past to consult.

For a few months I was inclined to believe in National Socialism. I thought of it as a necessary fever. And I was gratified to see that there were, associated with it for a time, some of the wisest and most outstanding Germans. But these, one by one, he has got rid of or even killed.... This man could bring home victories to our people each year without bringing them glory....But of our Germany, which was a nation of poets and musicians and artists and soldiers, he has made a nation of hysterics and hermits, engulfed in a mob and led by a thousand liars or fanatics....”
 
Real wages in the mid 30s were lower than at the height of the great depression in 1932. Unions were crushed, minimum wages were abolished, maximum working hours were abolished and child and sunday labour was re-legalized. Life was miserable for the german people, even before the war started.

I doubt Hitler had much love for the german people on a personal level. And his regime certainly hadn't.
 

Garrison

Donor
Hitler loved his vision of the Germany he was going create, purged of 'impurities' to become a master race. The actual Germany he ruled over was simply a resource to be used to create that vision regardless of the cost.
 
He, like any dictator, liked his people for what they could do for him... His insistence on continuing the war in 1944 as cities were torched by Allied bombing and Soviet troops were pushing the Germans out of the Baltic shows he didn't care for the well being of his people at all...
 
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Deleted member 94680

It’s interesting to note how many of his desires for the reconstituted Europe harked back to Charlemagne or the Holy Roman Empire rather than the Kaiserreich and (being an Austrian) little he cared for the Hapsburgs.
 
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