Germany sends Blucher to Kamerun at war start

[NOMISYRRUC]

And Diana Rigg - national treasure - and that last scene.......sorry its too soon

FWIW (1) It was intended to end with James and Tracy driving off into the sunset with her death scene being the pre-title sequence of the next film and was changed when George Lazenby told the producers he wouldn't make another film. IIRC they didn't want two actors playing Bond in the same film or maybe Diana Rigg refused to come back for a reshoot.

FWIW (2) Radio Four did "You Only Live Twice" in 1990 with Michael Jayston as James Bond and it began with the Tracy's death scene. Incidentally, Burt Kwouk who was in the film was also in the radio play, but in a different part, which I thought was a nice touch.

FWIW (3) when Radio Four did "OHMSS" as part of the Toby Stephens series in 2014 it did end with Tracy's death scene and incidentally New Avenger girl Joanna Lumley (who was in the film) played Irma Bunt, which I also thought was a nice touch. Jarvis & Ayres who make the "current" Bond series for Radio Four haven't done "You Only Live Twice" yet and IIRC the last one was "The Man with the Golden Gun" in 2020.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Does she have coal? Cameroon probably doesn't really have the facilities to support a ship of that size. Probably just sits in dock until captured.

Now we're back on topic, what's to stop the Germans sending some colliers with her to provide the coal? No colliers to spare, is the obvious answer, but apart from that?

 

[The Tai-Pan]

Now we're back on topic, what's to stop the Germans sending some colliers with her to provide the coal? No colliers to spare, is the obvious answer, but apart from that?

Surely it isn't worth the investment. Anything you send to Africa will be lost, 100%. Surely you'd rather protect those resources that the High Seas Fleet may need? That is my quick take, anyway.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Surely it isn't worth the investment. Anything you send to Africa will be lost, 100%. Surely you'd rather protect those resources that the High Seas Fleet may need? That is my quick take, anyway.

That was addressed in the last half of the OP.

Blucher was sort of an oddball, too small to fight against other Battlecruisers.

What if at war start, lets say July 28th, the Germans send her out with a company of marines on board to help defend Kamerun.
Douala due to its geography could be a defended port with a little work, and the ship and marines and landed guns could assist defense of the port.

If the Blucher is lost, no big deal, obsolete anyway.
If Britain stays neutral, She could dominate the area.
If Britain comes it might require a big effort to neutralize her like cruiser Konigsberg in 1915.
The navy might score political points even in a short war scenario if the Navy does something active.

At least the book and film "Shout at the Devil" would have been based on a true story.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Surely it isn't worth the investment. Anything you send to Africa will be lost, 100%. Surely you'd rather protect those resources that the High Seas Fleet may need? That is my quick take, anyway.

P.S. Don't call me Shirley.

 

[YYJ]

Now we're back on topic, what's to stop the Germans sending some colliers with her to provide the coal? No colliers to spare, is the obvious answer, but apart from that?

Germany had a bunch of her merchant fleet loose on the waves when the war started. I have a list of the ones in the Americas somewhere. If even a few weeks of planning had been done, some could have ended up in West Africa, loaded with coal.

If the merchants had been chosen well, then with a few weeks planning, Blucher could have donated a few 88mm tertiary guns and spare crewmen and outfitted another fast liner raider or two, to scour the Atlantic for Entente shipping. That would give Craddock and company a few more grey hairs as they spread their forces even more thinly.

 

[Cryhavoc101]

Germany had a bunch of her merchant fleet loose on the waves when the war started. I have a list of the ones in the Americas somewhere. If even a few weeks of planning had been done, some could have ended up in West Africa, loaded with coal.

If the merchants had been chosen well, then with a few weeks planning, Blucher could have donated a few 88mm tertiary guns and spare crewmen and outfitted another fast liner raider or two, to scour the Atlantic for Entente shipping. That would give Craddock and company a few more grey hairs as they spread their forces even more thinly.

Early war there would be a number of German ships dotted around the world that could serve to provide coal but increasingly not as time went on with the German Merchant fleet swept from the seas very early on.

For example the Geoban and Breslau when at Taranto were refused coal by the Italian authorities so they sailed to Messina where a number of German merchant ships where able to provide them with 1,800 tons of coal keeping them in the game.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Germany had a bunch of her merchant fleet loose on the waves when the war started.

When I came downstairs this morning the plan was to catch up on the housework, but (as usual) I spent most of the day writing posts on this forum.

However, before I belatedly hoover the bedrooms my inner Ed Reardon was offended by . . .

. . . a bunch of her merchant fleet . . .

. . . is a linguistic impossibility.

FWIW my inner Ed Reardon would have tolerated . . .

. . . a bunch of her merchant ships . . .

 

[ArtosStark]

What if at war start, lets say July 28th, the Germans send her out with a company of marines on board to help defend Kamerun

Blucher is listed as having almost 9 meters of draft. That is about 4.5-5 fathoms. The Wouri estuary is extremely silty and therefore quite shallow. Which was the main reason the Germans never considered putting a major fleet base there. This depth chart from 1954 is after the French had done a lot of dredging. (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/17/Admiralty_Chart_No_1456_Riviere_Cameroun,_Published_1896,_New_Edition_1954.jpg).

Even then, the channel to Douala (which I don’t think had yet been dredged in WW1) was only 19 ft deep, far too shallow for Blucher, and very narrow. Blucher cannot base out of Kamarun. At best she could anchor off shore in the anchorage. Well outside of the fixed defences. The same limitations would apply to most sea going colliers. So any coaling would have to use smaller shallow boats and probably transfer the coal over in bags.

If she is sent to Kamerun she is functionally useless as a ship. She could perhaps try and cause some trouble in the Bight of Biafra but most British shipping of the time went past there, rather than through it. She wouldn’t make an extremely effective merchant raider further in the South Atlantic proper. So if she is sent to Kamarun it’s likely the only purpose she will serve is as a transport for land troops and a source to be stripped for artillery.

 

[ghappy1000]

Which would still tie up British ships until Blucher's destruction as mentioned above.

 

[ArtosStark]

Which would still tie up British ships until Blucher's destruction as mentioned above.

Yep, but it denies Blucher a safe harbour. She cannot anchor close enough to Douala to be adequately covered by its guns. So if she is in harbour, the British ship sent after her can effectively bombard her at their leisure.

 

[The Tai-Pan]

Which would still tie up British ships until Blucher's destruction as mentioned above.

If I recall the port fell by September in 1914, so not very long.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

How about German South West Africa as Post 49 by @ArtosStark has ruled The Cameroons out as a base for Blücher?

With that in mind here are some posts from the thread "von Spee’s cruisers based out of Namibia (German South West Africa)" from January and February 2022.

Post 33 by yours truly, dated 26.01.22.

FWIW the following RN forces were in the South Atlantic at the outbreak of the Great War.

Cape Station - Three cruisers

• Highflyer (Flag.) a Highflyer class second class protected cruiser completed in 1900
• Astraea an Astraea class second class protected cruiser completed in 1895
• Pegaus a Pelorus class third class protected cruiser completed in 1897. She was sunk on 20th September 1914 by Königsberg the German light cruiser operating from German East Africa.

West Coast of Africa Station one sloop.

These were the RN forces adjacent to the South Atlantic.

• The Fifth Cruiser Squadron covered the Mid-Atlantic are between the West Coast of Africa and Brazil which one of the sources I am using says, "In which lay the converging points of the great southern trade." It had four armoured cruisers. These were the Devonshire class Carnarvon (Flag.) and the Monmouth class Cornwall, Cumberland and Monmouth.
• The Town class light cruiser Glasgow was on the South East Coast of America Station.
• Finally, there was the East Indies Squadron, with the battleship Swiftsure, the Town class light cruisers Dartmouth and Weymouth, the Astraea class second class protected cruiser Fox completed in 1895 and four sloops.

My sources are this page on the Naval-History.Net website

https://www.naval-history.net/WW1Book-RN1a.htm#2

And Cruisers of the Royal and Commonwealth Navies by Douglas Morris.

Post 35 by @YYJ dated 27.01.22.

German warships in the South Atlantic/Africa/Caribbean at the outbreak of the Great War.
West Africa Station:
2 gunboats SMS Panther, SMS Eber

East Africa Station : Dar es Saleem, German East Africa
Survey vessel SMS Mowe, Small Cruiser SMS Königsberg (1905)

East and West America Station:
SMS Karlsruhe (1912) who had days before arrived to replace SMS Dresden (1907), so both ships were still in theatre.

Source The Kaiser's Pirates by John Walter.

Post 128 from 23.02.22 by me.

Following on from Post 127...

This is the coast artillery that the British Army had in the South Atlantic at the out break of World War One.

(5) Cape of Good Hope.​

Defended Ports of Capetown, Simonstown.​

R.G.A. Garrisons:-​

Nos. 84 and 97 Coys. R.G.A.​

Cape Garrison Artillery.​

Armament:-​

Capetown​

2―9.2 inch.​

2―6 inch.​

2―4.7 inch.​

Simonstown​

3―9.2 inch.​

4―6 inch.​

(6) Sierra Leone.​

Defended Port of Freetown.​

R.G.A. Garrison:-​

No. 50 Coy. R.G.A.​

Sierra Leone Coy. R.G.A.​

Armament:-​

2―9.2 inch.​

4―6 inch.​

It's from Page 190 of "The History of the Coast Artillery in the British Army" by Col. K. W. Maurice-Jones, D.S.O., late R.A., published by the Royal Artillery Institution in 1959. It's an extract of a list of naval-bases and defended ports at home and abroad which were guarded by the Coast Artillery of the British Army, together with their coast-artillery garrisons and their armaments. The author regretted that the armament figures may not be absolutely accurate as the official records for the period 1907-14 had been lost or destroyed, but they were as nearly correct as it had been possible to get them. The author also noted that only "modern" guns had been included.

I looked it up because I was going to suggest that if Moltke was in the vicinity of GSWA when war was declared her first targets would be Cape Town and the Simonstown naval base which was nearby. Or if the ship was in the vicinity of Cameroon or Togo she'd turn back and bombard the RN base at Freetown.

However, now I know the above I don't think her captain would risk attacking any of the above. He'd bombard the "undefended" ports like Durban, Lagos, Takoradi and Walvis Bay.

Although that thread was 7 pages long, included 129 posts and was active for a month the only post that analysed the suitability of the ports in GSWA was Post 70 on 27.01.22 by @Catspoke.

View attachment 714004

Swakopmund is like a jetty thrust into the Ocean (above) no way you could protect that. And below is Luderitz, just a bit of flat desert land between the Harbor and the sea, would require some stout large caliber artillery to defend against parking a British Pre Dreadnaught off shore and sinking everything inside.

View attachment 714005

Ironically, that post lead to an analysis of whether the ports in The Cameroons would have been suitable as a base for von Spee's cruisers.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

One of the problems of using a port in GSWA is that it would take longer to get there, which reminded me to re-read the OP and this is the relevant sentence.

What if at war start, lets say July 28th, the Germans send her out with a company of marines on board to help defend Kamerun.

Can Blücher reach her destination in seven days?

 

[YYJ]

How about German South West Africa as Post 49 by @ArtosStark has ruled The Cameroons out as a base for Blucher?

With that in mind here are some posts from the thread "von Spee’s cruisers based out of Namibia (German South West Africa)" from January and February 2022.

Post 33 by yours truly, dated 26.01.22.

Post 35 by @YYJ dated 27.01.22.

Post 128 from 23.02.22 by me.

Although that thread was 7 pages long, included 129 posts ad was active for a month the only post that analysed the suitability of the ports in GSWA was Post 70 on 27.01.22 by @Catspoke.

Ironically, that post lead to an analysis of whether the ports in The Cameroons would have been suitable as a base for von Spee's cruisers.

I think I found out later that SMS Panther, while technically on West Africa station, was back in Germany for a refit at the outbreak of war, and so was stuck in Germany.

 

[oofo]

If Kamerun doesn’t work, would Blucher be able to dock at Walvis Bay? I haven’t been able to find what the garrison there was in summer 1914, but if Blucher has a contingent of marines, the Germans could hold it for a bit.

The only port in German Southwest Africa is Luderitz, and in 1914 it’s very undeveloped.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

The last paragraph of Post 49.

If she is sent to Kamerun she is functionally useless as a ship. She could perhaps try and cause some trouble in the Bight of Biafra but most British shipping of the time went past there, rather than through it. She wouldn’t make an extremely effective merchant raider further in the South Atlantic proper. So if she is sent to Kamarun it’s likely the only purpose she will serve is as a transport for land troops and a source to be stripped for artillery.

Which prompted the replies.

Which would still tie up British ships until Blücher's destruction as mentioned above.

Yep, but it denies Blücher a safe harbour. She cannot anchor close enough to Douala to be adequately covered by its guns. So if she is in harbour, the British ship sent after her can effectively bombard her at their leisure.

If I recall the port fell by September in 1914, so not very long.

If the object of the exercise is now to make Douala hold out for longer then they'd be better off sending an older armoured cruiser as it had less fighting value than Blücher or better still one of the older pre-dreadnoughts as it had heavier guns.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

I think I found out later that SMS Panther, while technically on West Africa station, was back in Germany for a refit at the outbreak of war, and so was stuck in Germany.

Yes you did.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

If Kamerun doesn’t work, would Blücher be able to dock at Walvis Bay? I haven’t been able to find what the garrison there was in summer 1914, but if Blücher has a contingent of marines, the Germans could hold it for a bit.

I may have got the wrong end of the stick, but Walvis Bay was part of the Union of South Africa, so are you suggesting that Blücher tries to take it in a coup de main?

The only port in German Southwest Africa is Luderitz, and in 1914 it’s very undeveloped.

See Post 53.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Perhaps would also be possible that without Blücher the other BCs can maintain a higher speed and escape at Dogger Bank, the battle being a draw only having a BC damaged each.

Maybe.

If the British send one or two BCs after Blücher that is one or two less in the GF, at least temporarily, which may or may not matter depending how long they are away. One less at Dogger Bank means 4 RN vs 3 HSF.

I think they won't take any more battle cruisers from the Grand Fleet. IOTL they sent Sturdee with a squadron built around the battle cruisers Invincible and Inflexible to the South Atlantic to deal with Von Spee's armoured cruisers. ITTL it might take a detour to the Gulf of Guinea to render Blücher hors de combat.

In any case we've already concluded that a squadron of older armoured cruisers or a few pre-dreadnoughts could do the job.