Fascists vs. Fascists?

Lycaon pictus

Donor
Has there ever been a TL in which two fascist states went to war with one another?

It seems like something that could happen pretty naturally. We've seen communist states fight each other (the USSR v. China, China v. Vietnam, etc.) in spite of their rhetoric of international brotherhood and solidarity. And fascism doesn't even have that rhetoric. Maybe a war between Mussolini's Italy and Franco's Spain?
 

KACKO

Lycaon pictus said:
Has there ever been a TL in which two fascist states went to war with one another?

It seems like something that could happen pretty naturally. We've seen communist states fight each other (the USSR v. China, China v. Vietnam, etc.) in spite of their rhetoric of international brotherhood and solidarity. And fascism doesn't even have that rhetoric. Maybe a war between Mussolini's Italy and Franco's Spain?
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You don't need a timeline. Hungary attacked Slovakia in march 1939 and Hungary a Romania almost went to warin 1940. In 1944 Slovakia was kinde of eager to participate on occupation of Hungary and recover lost territories. ;)
 

d32123

Banned
Not to mention Italy and Germany invading Greece who were fascist in all but name at the time.
 

BigWillyG

I can see it. Maybe have no Nazi Germany or Italian neutrality in alt WWII so Fascists survive in Italy and come into conflict with Spain over territory in North Africa or islands in the Med. Could also happen if Fascist government spreads to the Third World like Communism did so that border wars in South America, Asia or Africa are fought between Fascist states rather than Communist ones. An Ogaden War between Fascist Ethiopia and Somalia as opposed to Communist seems like it would work. To an extent it's already happened if you consider Baathist states to be Fascist and look at Syria fighting Iraq in 1991.
 

Paul MacQ

Monthly Donor
Would have been interesting Italy getting upset about Austria early 1935-36 Italy and Germany going to war for influence there. The Wehrmacht is not the urber force it would become in 1940. Not sure what it would take.
 

Deleted member 40957

Not sure about Spain vs Italy, but it would be very easy to get Arrow Cross Hungary vs Iron Guard Romania, with their massive overlapping territorial claims.

The Nazi-backed coup attempt against Dollfuss in Austria could escalate into a war between Germany and Italy, but Hitler was unlikely to try this before rearmament was complete and while the Stresa Front was intact. With the right PoD it might be possible though.

Edit: Looks like I was semi-ninja'd on both counts, but I'll let this stand.
 

d32123

Banned
serbrcq said:
Not sure about Spain vs Italy, but it would be very easy to get Arrow Cross Hungary vs Iron Guard Romania, with their massive overlapping territorial claims.

The Nazi-backed coup attempt against Dollfuss in Austria could escalate into a war between Germany and Italy, but Hitler was unlikely to try this before rearmament was complete and while the Stresa Front was intact. With the right PoD it might be possible though.

Edit: Looks like I was semi-ninja'd on both counts, but I'll let this stand.
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Has anyone here ever done a Germany vs. Italy war TL?
 

HeavyWeaponsGuy

Banned
d32123 said:
Hitler vs. Mussolini
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That I have always wanted to see.

Last I checked the consensus was something along the lines of:

If it had been in the July Putsch revolving around the assassination of Engelbert Dolfuss and a subsequent (failed) attempt to force an early Anschluss, Mussolini would have trounced the Germans.
 

d32123

Banned
HeavyWeaponsGuy said:
That I have always wanted to see.

Last I checked the consensus was something along the lines of:

If it had been in the July Putsch revolving around the assassination of Engelbert Dolfuss and a subsequent (failed) attempt to force an early Anschluss, Mussolini would have trounced the Germans.
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*imagines Italian troops marching through the streets of Berlin*

I wonder if other nations would have joined in to take their piece of Germany?
 

Rich Rostrom

Lycaon pictus said:
Has there ever been a TL in which two fascist states went to war with one another?
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During WW II, there was a rather nasty covert conflict between Fascist Italy and Fascist Croatia. Italy claimed (and occupied) Dalmatia, which Croatia also claimed.

Italy secretly armed the Serb-monarchist Chetnik guerrillas to fight the Croatian fascist Ustashe.

The Ustashe, for their part, were believed to murder Italian officers travelling through their territory.
 

Darth_Kiryan

HeavyWeaponsGuy said:
That I have always wanted to see.

Last I checked the consensus was something along the lines of:

If it had been in the July Putsch revolving around the assassination of Engelbert Dolfuss and a subsequent (failed) attempt to force an early Anschluss, Mussolini would have trounced the Germans.
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Really?
My understanding is that the Italian military was no where near the strength of the German military.....at any time.
 
Cook

Cook

Banned
You could probably add to the list the German invasion of Poland in 1939 since there was little to distinguish the Polish regime from its fascist neighbours.
 

abc123

Banned
Rich Rostrom said:
During WW II, there was a rather nasty covert conflict between Fascist Italy and Fascist Croatia. Italy claimed (and occupied) Dalmatia, which Croatia also claimed.

Italy secretly armed the Serb-monarchist Chetnik guerrillas to fight the Croatian fascist Ustashe.

The Ustashe, for their part, were believed to murder Italian officers travelling through their territory.
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Yep, it allmost came to war when Italian Army wanted to occupy larger part of Croatia than previously agreed, but Croats relented at the last moment...
 

Deleted member 40957

Cook said:
You could probably add to the list the German invasion of Poland in 1939 since there was little to distinguish the Polish regime from its fascist neighbours.
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I've just been reading Norman Davies' Heart of Europe, about Poland, and he takes pains to distinguish the Sanacja regime from fascism. While it's true that it did become more repressive and anti-Semitic after Pilsudski's death, it did allow civil society to operate and did not mobilize the whole country in the way fascism did, and was not rooted in blood-and-soil nationalism. So this probably doesn't count.

How about Peronist Argentina vs Integralist Brazil? Peron wasn't purely fascist either, so it could be seen as a struggle between two different factions of the movement (like Maoism vs Soviet communism).
 

ctesiphon

Cook said:
You could probably add to the list the German invasion of Poland in 1939 since there was little to distinguish the Polish regime from its fascist neighbours.
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The word "fascism" has a meaning, and it's not "random military junta".
 
Maponus

Maponus

While it wasn't a conventional war, Romania's period of political strife between the wars featured a truly shocking amount of Fascist-on-Fascist violence.
 
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