Exile States

Beatriz

In Kaiserreich, you see the permanent exile of various empires into their colonies (the UK into the Dominions and the Raj, France into Africa).
The closest OTL equivalent is Taiwan, but the social stratification and heavyhandedness that led to the 2-28 incident would be amplified tenfold given the explicit use of biological racism, the designation of 'indigene', and the use of pre-existing practices like forced labor, concentration camps and gassing of villages. The 'ideal' situation is one where racialized military rule gives way to majority-rule democracy complete with renunciation of claims to the metropole, akin to a hybrid of the goals of the Taiwanese Independence Movement and the apartheid-era ANC. The worst case is racial warfare followed by the metropole invading.

What are some likely outcomes for the following exiles, assuming they occurred at the height of their empires?:
  • US
  • France
  • Britain
  • Netherlands
  • Germany
  • Japan
 
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GuildedAgeNostalgia

The Netherlands would go to Suriname after a Axis victory(they wouldn't last in DEI). Low native population and vast oil and natural resources means things go well.
 

Admiral Spaun

The empire of Japan could create an exile state in Taiwan and probably hang onto Okinawa and some of the Pacific islands as well. The real problem they would have is that both China and the new Japan would both be gunning to take them out.
 

Father Maryland

Admiral Spaun said:
The empire of Japan could create an exile state in Taiwan and probably hang onto Okinawa and some of the Pacific islands as well. The real problem they would have is that both China and the new Japan would both be gunning to take them out.
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Yeah I'm wondering about some insane scenario where the Japanese Empire manages to lose all of the Home Islands but keeps Formosa, Okinawa, maybe Korea, and less likely Manchuria. Some sort of semi apocalyptic "Peshwar Lancers" like scenario where the Home Islands (along with a decent chunk of the world) are made uninhabitable forcing the Empire to relocate as many Japanese as possible to a new Empire composed of the Colonies of Okinawa, Jeju Island, the Korean Peninsula, Formosa and maybe Manchuria and or coastal enclaves of China.

Reminds me of a story where a Zombie Semi Apocalypse occurs and the America's are lost to the Zombie Hordes and the US and other parts of the world destroyed. A group of American exiles scheme to set up a sort of "New United States" based in a Coastal Chinese city in the 1870s. A place where American refugees can flee to and be accepted.
 

mianfei

Beatriz said:
...
  • France
  • Britain
  • ...
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I have often imagined these exiles occurring as a result of the Bolshevik Revolution spreading to those countries, so that the workers took permanent power from the ruling classes. Trotskyists groups like Socialist Alternative, the International Socialist Organization, and others often argued that all the problems of bureaucratization, and isolation would be completely solved as soon as the revolution spread to Western Europe, but at times I have imagined that the old ruling classes would have been able to move themselves to resource-rich colonies and complicate the world revolution Trotskyists imagine.

For Britain, the answer is exceedingly obvious: Australia. It had very weak socialist movements due to its high living standards, hyper-abundant flat land and hyper-abundant natural resources. Some of these resources – the high field strength elements of titanium and zirconium – might have been pioneered by the British in the 1920s and excluded from the socialist countries, which would greatly tilt the balance of airspace and nuclear power against a workers’ state that did not seize these resource-surfeited lands.

For France, there is not such a definitive answer as none of France’s colonies were remotely so ideal as Australia. All had problems of infectious disease, numerous native people, or being impoverished in natural resources. French Guiana is not impossible, but it is small (only slightly larger than Tasmania), disease-infested and lacks the natural resources of the other non-Hispanophone South American nations. New Caledonia is resource-rich and free of malaria but very small (about a quarter the size of Tasmania). Most of the African nations are extremely hot and fairly well-populated with natives, as well as being affected by yellow fever and other dangerous tropical diseases.

GuildedAgeNostalgia said:
The Netherlands would go to Suriname .... Low native population and vast oil and natural resources means things go well.
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I would agree with that one, although there are the issues noted above like yellow fever.
 
Clandango

Clandango

glenn67 said:
Or they could go to Aruba and Curacao.
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It can be assumed they also go there, as well as the other couple Islands they have. Still, Suriname offers a territorial base and actual money. Considering how Suriname and Guyana have no real racial majority (mostly being made up of a mixture of native groups, Africans, and people shipped over with varying degrees of consent from India and Indonesia) depending on when you have them exiled there could still be plenty of space for colonists. Depending if we expect the population of the Netherlands to move there and make it a rump state, or if it is just the government and is more of a government-in-exile.Probably already too late though, unless they decide to give tickets back to Asia for the children and grandhiclred of those who came before them.
Monk78 said:
Alaska a penal colony?
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By the Russians? I suppose they might have put up forced labor camps when they discovered gold and tried keeping it all in the hands of the Royals, nobles, and the camp administration.


Now, Germany... almost a shame we aren’t saying Prussia, as it would be easier for them to have spare places to go to.
 
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