DBWI: Roman Republic doesn’t survive to present day

writofcertiorari

The life of the Roman Republic has been incredible- it’s survived over 2200 years, and though its territorial bounds have shifted, it has usually been a strong state. What would be the most likely time for it to have fell, and why would this have been? Try to keep it past 500 AD, as the obvious answer before then would have been barbarians/East-West schism.

OOC: Alright, this is sort of ambitious. Imagine the Roman Republic never slipped into Empire... and also never fell at all... and never even broke into East and West. Assume it only holds Italy and a maybe couple of Greek islands by 2018. Also, all the world religions do exist in TTL.
 

VictorLaszlo

The republic might have fallen after 1253 AUC (or 500 AD as you christians like to term it), but it would not have survived until even then had not the land reform of Tiberius Sempronius Gracchus been succesfully introduced and implemented after 620 AUC. Any kind of failure to implement said reform would have led to an ever increasing stratification of the republic's society with an obscenely rich senetorial class having their latifundia, often vastly expanded by appropriating ager publicus in violation of existing laws, worked by slaves, while driving away free farmers, who'd held it for generations and who were the backbone of the republic well into the industrial age, thus significantly increasing the highly volatile urban proletariat, a development that would have destabilised the precarious equilibrum of political power in the republic with civil wars and strongmen taking advantage of them.
 
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Lalli

OOC: I am pretty sure that Christianity would be butterflied away in this scenario. You need quiet early POD save the republic.
 

Johnrankins

It almost certainly wouldn't have evolved at all. Rome was already an empire by the birth of Christ, although barely. Luke 2:1 states "In those days Caesar Augustus issued a decree that a census should be taken of the entire Roman world. " which means the Bible was written after Caesar Augustus became emperor. That is right after Rome became an empire.
 

HIM Dogson

OOC: this technically works, as the Romans considered themselves a Republic even in the early days of the Principate.

I don't know how you could completely destroy Rome as a state, but I feel like the answer is internal, not external. Maybe you could have the early Princeps fail to divorce their power from the military as was the case in the aftermath of the end of the Second Republic? Maybe stopping Germanicus from becoming Princeps could work.
 

writofcertiorari

ROMA INVICTA!

OOC: Maybe England could have developed separately, as it ended up doing IOTL, perhaps with Germanic influences and such. It's not like it would be totally unreasonable for the Romans to abandon the island later on. An empire of just France+Italy+Spain+Greece is already stronger than most countries until 1800. Of course, Latin would be the equivalent of English in this timeline, as the worldwide language of business.
 

Johnrankins

Maybe if Rome wasn't able to conquer Germania or only a small part of it. Eventually it could become a threat as it was the largest non-Roman power in Europe. The Persian Empire could possibly pull something off although that is unlikely IMO. It had its own problems on and off. The big question is why shouldn't the Republic last a few millennia? The Chinese , the Indians , and the Persians were all able to exist for thousands of years until this very day so why shouldn't the Romans do so as well?
 
Planet of Hats

Planet of Hats

Donor
I·VVOVLD·IMAGINE·THERE·VVOVLD·BE·SOME·SERIOVS·PODS·CONCERNING·THE·LANGUAGE·CERTAINLY·IF·THE·REPVBLIC·FELL·I·SVSPECT·MANY·OF·THE·OUTLYING·PEOPLES·VVOVLD·SIMPLY·ADOPT·LANGVAGES·INFLVENCED·BY·LATIN·GIVEN·THE·OBVIOVS·STATVS·OF·LATIN·AS·THE·PRIMARY·LANGVAGE·OF·CIVILIZATION·AND·SOVND·GOVERNMENT

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IamtheEmps

IamtheEmps

Planet of Hats said:
I·VVOVLD·IMAGINE·THERE·VVOVLD·BE·SOME·SERIOVS·PODS·CONCERNING·THE·LANGUAGE·CERTAINLY·IF·THE·REPVBLIC·FELL·I·SVSPECT·MANY·OF·THE·OUTLYING·PEOPLES·VVOVLD·SIMPLY·ADOPT·LANGVAGES·INFLVENCED·BY·LATIN·GIVEN·THE·OBVIOVS·STATVS·OF·LATIN·AS·THE·PRIMARY·LANGVAGE·OF·CIVILIZATION·AND·SOVND·GOVERNMENT

BY·THE·VVAY·VVHAT·IS·VVITH·ALL·YOV·PEOPLE·AND·YOVR·BLANKSPACES·AND·SMALLFONTS·ARE·YOU·GERMANIC·OR·SOMETHING
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OOC: VERY GOOD
 
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