Communism fails to grab hold of Russian Empire

[PaulGonzalez]

So imagine. The Revolution is attempted, but fails. The Tsar survives. What would happen then? Would Hitler still wage war against a non-Communist east? I know he hated both Slavs and Reds, but what'd he hate more? If he did wage that war, would there even have been a Cold War after Germany's defeat? It's not like there would have been an ideological gap. We would all be imperial, to an extent.....Also, what of China. Let's say that they went Red, just as in the real world. Would the US and Russian Empire team up along with Europe and form a superalliance......a NATO on steroids, but it would to an extend include Pacific nations as well...

I leave it to you to discuss.

 

[SeptimusMagistos]

First things first: You realize there were two revolutions, right? Do you mean that the February Revolution fails, or the October one?

 

[Slowpoke]

You do know that when the Bolsheviks grabbed hold of powuh the Tsar had already been deposed by Aleksandr Kerenski's provisional pseudo-federal government?

A more functional question would be whether, missiing Bolshevik takeover, the Republic could survive.

Edit: ninja'd by one minute.

 

[nbcman]

You realize the major reason that the Nazis got into power was fear of the Communists? I'd say that no Communists in Russia would butterfly the Nazis from Germany. Plus no Russian Communists would probably butterfly the ChiComs away (an Imperial Russian invasion of Manchuria would not result in a safe haven for the ChiComs like OTL). Can't really discuss it with the topics that you have presented.

 

[Troyer IV]

Oh my... you'd need a PoD far before the revolutions in order to accomplish a Tsarist Russia in the long-term after WW1. Or even a 'reestablished' Tsarist regime thereafter. The entirety of Russian history and social order is almost a prescription for radical socialism; you'd need to look at Russian history, the roots of Communism/Bolshevism/Marxism, and the events leading up to the 20th century to really get a good solid understanding of the question which you are asking.

Perhaps if Tsar Alexander II was not assassinated in 1881 (that is, that he survives that particular attempt and any that might follow it - he was a popular target of assassins, after all) and he was thus able to establish a workable Duma.

The reason the first two Dumas failed so quickly and irrevocably was due to the fact they were filled with those who were terribly angry at the Tsarist regime after the humiliation of the Russo-Japanese War (among other things) and the marginal success of the Third Duma (considered the only real working one since it was the only which served its full 5-year term) was undermined by the complete failures of the first two.

Now, say Alexander II was able to pass that legislation and force it down the nobility's collective throat (when he was assassinated, Alexander III walked in and ripped it up) thereby allowing for an earlier attempt at successful democratic institutions (though don't call it Parliament, because Russians didn't think much of the parliamentary system at the time) then MAYBE they could avoid 1) Russo-Japanese humiliation, 2) disasterous WW1, and 3) Red Revolution.

MAYBE - MAYBE - MAYBE avoiding some of them to some degree, but who knows if they'd avoid all three to any great extent.

 

[Anaxagoras]

A POD that allows the Czar to remain on the throne of Russia would have to be between 1906 and 1914 at the latest. But it would create so many butterflies that Hitler would never have taken power in Russia, so your original OP is not valid. And without the Soviets in Russia, I can't see any scenario in which China goes Communist.

Welcome to the board, by the way.

 

[PaulGonzalez]

I thought the MAIN reason's the Nazi's came to power was because of anti-semitism, and the outcome of WW1. Yes, communism was a great fear, but not #1.

 

[Anaxagoras]

I thought the MAIN reason's the Nazi's came to power was because of anti-semitism, and the outcome of WW1. Yes, communism was a great fear, but not #1.

For the Nazis, anti-Bolshevism and anti-Semitism pretty much went hand in hand. But even so, if you remove the Communist threat from the equation, the Nazis cannot come to power in Germany. Remember that their key electoral opposition was the German Communist Party, and much of the electoral support the Nazis received was from center-right Germans who basically voted for the Nazis because they were seen as the most likely to beat the Communists. If you don't have the Communists as a major political force in Germany, or if the German Communist Party is not seen as a major threat, then you would not have the Nazis getting the support they got IOTL.

 

[King Thomas]

Try Alexander III staying alive far longer then OTL.He was a Tsar who ruled with the proverbial rod of iron.

 

[Troyer IV]

Try Alexander III staying alive far longer then OTL.He was a Tsar who ruled with the proverbial rod of iron.

And one of the ones which helped foster the greatest disparity in class divisions within Imperial Russia. He felt the peasants should not have been emancipated under his father's reign; or perhaps its more appropriate to say that after his father's death, he hated that these lower classes (which his father had helped) were responsible for the death and wished they were still serfs. His father's death changed him for the worst - he became essentially vengeful against the lower classes and anyone who wasn't of the upper crust.

I say that to say this: Ruling with a rod of iron is more likely to incite revolution sooner than later.

 

[Anaxagoras]

One wonders if a genuine constitutional monarchy might have developed in Russia had it not been for a certain rather weird Siberian self-declared holy man.

 

[Troyer IV]

One wonders if a genuine constitutional monarchy might have developed in Russia had it not been for a certain rather weird Siberian self-declared holy man.

Again, that's too late to have much bearing on Communism's roots in Russia. It would need at least 2 full generations...

 

[LordIreland]

Regardless of the state of Russia Communist or Tsarist, Hitler would have waged war on it. Instead of Judao-Bolshevik, it would have been Judao-Tsarist Granted, it is questionable as to whether he would have gained power in this scenario.