Challenge: more monastic states

rcduggan

My topics have a habit of getting no replies, but anyway:

this thought occurred to me while trying to figure out where the name Dominican Republic came from. :p

so the challenge is, with as late a possible POD (after the crusades preferably) is to make there be more monastic states (besides the Teutonic One).

they can be anywhere in the world as long as it is Catholic. bonus points if they are in the new world.

ready...... GO!
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
How about if the disputed Seven Missions in what's now Uruguay (I think) get turned into an independent Guarani state under Jesuit leadership to solve the border dispute?

...pretty unlikely, I admit, unless it was delayed until the Spanish colonies were declaring independence anyway...
 

Valdemar II

Banned
Avoid the French Revolution, that would keep a lot of German Church States alive for a few more years, if not to today.
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
Valdemar II said:
Avoid the French Revolution, that would keep a lot of German Church States alive for a few more years, if not to today.
Click to expand...

And Liege in Flanders. But I'm not sure if just church states qualify as opposed to 'monastic' ones.

A good one would be to keep Malta under the Knights of St John, and Rhodes under the Knights Hospitallier...somehow.
 

Codae

1823: Mexican Emperor Agustin de Iturbide is deposed. Various people try to take power, but are unsuccessful. Some church somewhere takes hold of the surrounding area and is able to hold it through the rest of the turbulence.

And, if you want, the Pope can try to turn it into the new Holy Roman Empire!

(being holier, romaner, and an empirer than the original)
 

NapoleonXIV

Banned
Codae said:
1823: Mexican Emperor Agustin de Iturbide is deposed. Various people try to take power, but are unsuccessful. Some church somewhere takes hold of the surrounding area and is able to hold it through the rest of the turbulence.

And, if you want, the Pope can try to turn it into the new Holy Roman Empire!

(being holier, romaner, and an empirer than the original)
Click to expand...

Wasn't the Mexican Revolution started by a priest named Hidalgo?

What if the Franciscans took over one of the Renaissance states of Italy?

What if the Popes decided to fight heresy with conversion and declared the Cathars, Albigenses and Bogomils as lay orders with temporal power in their respective areas, (as long as they tithed to Rome properly, of course)
 
Thande

Thande

Donor
Codae said:
1823: Mexican Emperor Agustin de Iturbide is deposed. Various people try to take power, but are unsuccessful. Some church somewhere takes hold of the surrounding area and is able to hold it through the rest of the turbulence.

And, if you want, the Pope can try to turn it into the new Holy Roman Empire!

(being holier, romaner, and an empirer than the original)
Click to expand...

Sig-worthy :D
 

Gonzaga

Thande said:
How about if the disputed Seven Missions in what's now Uruguay (I think) get turned into an independent Guarani state under Jesuit leadership to solve the border dispute?

...pretty unlikely, I admit, unless it was delayed until the Spanish colonies were declaring independence anyway...
Click to expand...

The Seven Missions are now in Brazilian territory.

As you said, it's unlikely, but not completely impossible. But still you need to avoid the supression of the Jesuits. Also, the Seven Missions were just a small part of the Jesuit Missions in OTL Brazil, Argentina and Paraguay. If it works we could have a greater Paraguay ruled by Jesuits.
 

RPW@Cy

One thought that does occur. There are numerous islands around the coasts of Britain that have a decidedly feudal relationship with the British crown that renders them de facto independent in a wide range of domestic affairs (Isle of Man and the Channel Islands basically though there were others in the past that also had this privilege but where those rights are now defunct - apparently the Isle of Wight once fell into this category), and there are others that have been home to monasteries in the past.

Sadly these two categories don't seem to have ever overlapped, but is there any obvious reason why they couldn't? Assuming that such a monastic lordship manages to survive the dissolution of the monasteries (a big ask granted, but lets assume some quirk of feudal law saves it - the king is notionally abbot and doesn't dissolve it because it's already technically his property, or something) then there's no reason why it couldn't survive to the present day.

To take one rather fun possibility - in the middle ages the Knights Templar were granted possession of the island of Lundy in the Bristol Channel on condition they used it as a base to suppress piracy. They showed no interest in taking occupation however, but what if they did? Say they built a port and a fortress/monastery which, after the order is suppressed is transferred to a more compliant order like the Hospitallers? Then, at the time of the reformation a wily abbot swiftly pledges his loyalty to the "king of Lundy" (Henry VIII) with the result that an Anglican form of the Order of St John of Jerusalem is created about 300 years early...
 
Grey Wolf

Grey Wolf

Donor
The Knights of St John are of course STILL independent and are recognised as a sovereign state by several countries; I think their 'state' is sort of an annex to the Vatican or something...

Best Regards
Grey Wolf
 
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