SysyphusOfEphyra
Banned
I think he means it in quality only not quantity. They might have had a lot of ships but as the R J war ahowed they weren't worth much.
Behold a Red Horse (a sequel to "Let Them Pass")
- Thread starter Geon
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Facist france oh wow, still britain support to facist france it leave bad reputation for them, the importan question is who america will support facist or imperialist?
With whoever sides against Japan, once Japan starts disrupting American trade with China?
Hmmmm it up to japan though if japan just focus in russia maybe america will sell oil & weapon for them or america will sell to both side and got massive profit
Chapter 7: Germany
Geon
Donor
Chapter 7: Germany
Germany emerged the undisputed victor of World War I. She had gained a larger industrial base with the acquisition of the French provinces as well as the Polish territories. The war had not lasted long enough to cause anything more than a “hiccup” for the German economy which was quickly offset by the production from the new territories.
Germany now saw herself as the undisputed Great Power of Europe. She had faced the most powerful nations in Europe and won. This bred a pride bordering on arrogance among the Germans. This pride would lead not only to great achievements but also to a false sense of security among them.
Post War Euphoria
The years following the end of World War I were called the “Glad Times” by many later German historians. The nation to be sure had suffered losses. The German campaign in France had cost 80,000 German dead and over 100,000 wounded. But considering the toll could have been much worse had the war dragged on the German people counted themselves extremely fortunate.
Trade had not been seriously hurt during the brief two-month war. Thus, the German economy quickly rebounded from the losses suffered by the British blockade. By 1915 the German economy was back to its pre-war heights and showed no sign of slowing down.
Berlin would quickly reassert itself as one of the economic and cultural centers of Europe. Entrepreneurs, artists and bon-vivants descended on the city. Berlin would vie with Paris in the decades to come as the artistic center of Europe. Several new artistic styles were unveiled in Berlin that would influence the artistic world for years to come.
One example of these new styles was a style dubbed by its originator – “triumphalism.” Adolph Hitler a relatively unknown artist from Austria offered a new style in art. Accepted into the Vienna Art Academy after several unsuccessful tries Hitler created a new style which showed the German victors of war in heroic terms. His portraits starting in 1922 were characterized by powerful Nordic masculine figures in various poses of victory. His Home from the War showing a bare-chested German soldier his gun laid aside in the background while he and his family till the German soil was particularly well received.
Other artists also found Germany a haven from persecution.
The end of the war was marked with several pogroms in Jewish communities and cities in Eastern Europe. Many in those areas blamed the Jews for the loss of the war. As a result, many refugees would flee eastward to find haven in the German occupied areas of Poland and Germany itself. Germany would benefit from their migration both economically and intellectually as scholars and artists from various fields took up residence in Germany.
In 1924 on the tenth anniversary of the war Kaiser Wilhelm would declare in an address which was broadcast by radio throughout Germany:
“We may well thank Almighty God for the blessings He has bestowed on us since the end of the Brief War. What could have been an unthinkable and terrible calamity for this nation has instead turned to our favor in every way we could imagine. Today Germany prospers as never before in its factories, its universities, on its farms. German art is the envy of the world. Truly this is an amazing time to be German!”(from Kaiser Wilhelm’s speech on the 10th anniversary of World War I)
Democratic Reforms
Like some of the other nations of Europe, Germany began to see the need for more and more democratic reforms. Kaiser Wilhelm solidly opposed any such reforms. However, he realized that there were a few changes that needed to be made.
The Junkers were slowly deprived of the power they had held in the 19th century. A new generation of intellectuals and reformers were clamoring for a say in government. But their time was not yet. Wilhelm made it clear that there would only be such reforms as he deemed suitable.
The office of Chancellor became an elected office, But the Chancellor would only hold such executive powers as allowed him by the Kaiser. The Kaiser retained a great deal of control over the affairs of the German nation
The old ruling elite was relaxing the leash but not significantly. And the fact that Germany was still in a state of euphoria following the war allowed them to do so without much protest from the populace.
The Kaiser allowed some limited freedom in the press while suppressing any newspaper which did not faithfully serve the needs of the Fatherland. That title usually referred to socialist and communist publications. The new limited freedom of the press was at times regretted and at times welcomed by the Kaiser.
Kaiser Wilhelm II would say of this time, it was an amazing time to be German.”
German Innovation and Invention
The Germans had learned like the other participants in World War I the importance of mobility. They quickly began building prototypes of the British “land battleship” or “Tank” as it was colloquially called. By 1925 Germany had two fully equipped tank divisions and was beginning to replace its cavalry – not without some resistance – with trucks. It was also beginning to look at the concept of mobile infantry.
At sea the Germans were also improving what would become known as the Kriegsmarine. It became clear to many that the days of the dreadnaught and the battleship were numbered with the coming of the airplane. A demonstration by Ernst Udet leading a corps of fliers to drop bombs on old antiquated ships from the German High Seas Fleet slated for scrapping showed conclusively that airpower would be a major factor in future sea battles. By the 1930’s Germany boasted 5 aircraft carriers.
German development in the air was no less impressive. Longer range airplanes were built and tested. And Germany was determined to win “the race to cross the Atlantic.” Unfortunately, Germany would lose three pilots in their attempt to cross the Atlantic non-stop. The last and most famous being Manfred von Richthofen whose plane would disappear without a trace over the Atlantic sometime between March 9, 1920 and March 11, 1920.
German technicians experimenting with radio waves discovered means of improving that medium. A government program put a small radio in the home of everyone in Germany who wanted it by the end of 1923. The research of these same scientists, especially after learning of British successes also led to the development of a usable radar system by 1931.
In both science and in art Germany was becoming a leader in Europe.
Foreign Affairs
Sadly, German foreign affairs could not be described as anything but lackluster regarding the rest of Europe. France was still cold toward Germany despite German overtures to that nation over the next decade to improve relations. Russia also continued to be distant from the German Empire. Kaiser Wilhelm had hoped Nicholas II would be able to gradually help improve relations between the two nations despite the recent war. But Nicholas death meant an end to those hopes. The Kaiser went into seclusion for a month to mourn “his dear cousin Nicky” after the fatal accident that took Czar Nicholas II’s life. The fact that the Kaiser offered his widow, Alexandra, the chance to come to Germany didn’t help matters either given that many Russians still believed that Alexandra was a German spy. Austro-Hungary seemed like the only firm friend Germany had on the continent.
Germany during this time did manage to rebuild relationships with Great Britain. Even though the Kaiser was initially not fond of his British relatives he was willing to visit them often enough. Eventually his private journals indicate his suspicion of them slowly changed to a grudging admiration and even affection. German and British naval vessels began to conduct maneuvers together. And British tourism reached record levels by the 1930’s in Germany as German tourism did the same in England.
Germany also tried to develop better relationships with the new world power in the west, the United States. During the 1920’s the Germans were able to improve relations with the U.S. despite the U.S. isolationist policies. German tourism to the U.S. increased.
German technology mentioned above would prove the means by which Lindbergh conquered the Atlantic in his flight from New Jersey to Amsterdam, Netherlands in May 1927. The Spirit of St. Louis was equipped with engine technology that had been perfected in Germany for its air force.
As German tourism increased so also did American tourism to Germany. This in turn brought a new fad to Germany which caused many a white hair among traditional German parents as their teenagers and college young people began to form Daredevil Clubs mimicking the Clubs begun on U.S. colleges. These Clubs will be documented later but one of the effects of said groups was to give an additional boost to German technology as young backyard mechanics, inventors, etc. all of whom were members of these clubs teamed up to discover and exceed the limits of both plane, motorcycle, and automobiles. Private discoveries by these individuals boosted the efficiency of both the airplane and other vehicles.
Germany was indeed a global superpower by the 1930’s. But she had neighbors that were becoming more hostile with the passage of time.
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Monitor
Donor
Well, that is impressively wrong.
It looks to be an amalgamation of the common mispelling Kreigsmarine and the correct Kriegsmarine (from Krieg (war) And Marine (navy))
Paintings by Adolf Hitler - Wikipedia
I believe the issue was that he didn't portray people with the proper liveliness, or something like that.
Reportedly Hitler told Neville Chamberlin "I am an artist and not a politician. Once the Polish question is settled, I want to end my life as an artist." Maybe Chamberlin should have commissioned some artwork . Believe it or not there is a market for Hitler's artwork. Wikipedia has an article that lists some of the pieces sold in recent years.
Deleted member 94680
The OTL German October Constitution in 1918 proposed a Parliamentary Monarchy system (essentially the British style) and that gained enough support to pass into law. What you have here is a Presidential system where the Chancellor can dismiss the Reichstag. Where is the Kaiser’s role? I can see Willy begrudgingly accepting the Westminster system (provided the ‘right people’ are in government) but I can’t see him going for what you’ve proposed. It’s stripping the Kaiser’s powers from him for what reason? Teenagers are getting antsy?
Geon
Donor
More like young people (young adults) are getting tired of the status quo. Many young men fought in a war they had little say over whether they would fight in or not. They are hoping to change that.
This is a most promising TL, consider this watched! I must confess that my heart leapt for joy when I saw this, I still consider "How Silent Fall the Cherry Blossoms" one of my favorite TL's of all time.
Great timeline. One interesting side effect: the way the USA can mobilize when it decides to hasn't really been seen...
Without commenting on the artistic merit, if someone gets there first with a theme, he can do well. Art, be it paintings, books, music, or whatever need not be "good" to become a fad.
Deleted member 94680
Yes, the staus quo you’ve laid out sounds terrible for a young, working age German:
You can’t wank Germany to the point of being a superpower and then suggest that there is great domestic discontent by the people who gain the most from it.
And? Fought in a short, victorious War. A War with far lower casualties and far more success than anyone could have hoped for. I just don’t see there being the impetus to completely strip the Kaiser of his constitutional role. “Little say over” doesn’t ring true either. OTL the War was popular in Germany - especially at the start - and here the War is nowhere near long enough for discontent to set in
OTL after the chaos and national trauma of the loss (or impending loss) of WWI, there was just enough support for a constitutional monarchy system. Here, with a far better society and far less ‘damage’ to the national psyche, you’ve removed the Kaiser’s political roles with the justification that some guys in their forties (those that fought in the War would be older by the time of the change) are annoyed? Why would they not push for change in the immediate aftermath of the War? What of the older more senior political figures and (importantly) military personnel who have lived their entire lives under the Kaiser?
It’s a massive change with minimal justification, IMO.
Geon
Donor
Your thoughts are well taken Stenz. And I do appreciate your take on this.
If I can just share some final thoughts on the subject? At the time of the First World War there was a growing dissatisfaction with the status quo throughout Europe. Socialists campaigned both before and during the war prophetically warning of what would happen if war occurred. Granted in TTL because the war is shorter and less bloody that dissatisfaction is much less, but it is still there.
My rationale is that the various emperors and other powers in Europe have long memories. Communism may have been dealt a death blow with Lenin's death here. But socialism is still very much alive. The monarchies have long memories and remember all too well the fate of the nobility and monarchy of France in the French Revolution and The Terror that followed. They would like to avoid that fate if possible. A little peaceful change now may prevent a lot of violent change later.
I don't know if this will adequately answer your critique but I will take under advisement your question regarding the Kaiser's role in German government.
Again thanks for the critique.
P.S. Please note I've made a change or two in the German entry to fit some of your critique.
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Deleted member 94680
You're welcome and I apologise if I came off as pushy, but I feel the German Empire and it’s... peculiar constitutional arrangements are often misunderstood or misrepresented.
Agreed, in Europe in general, but not really in Germany - the “Spirit of 1914” shows how strongly German socialists held these views, for instance - and I can’t see it growing stronger in Germany in the aftermath of a victorious War.
German socialism was mistrusted by the nobility in Germany, that much is true, but it was ‘controlled’ by the constitutional system. The very system your TL is ripping up for... angry teenagers? History should show you that “little peaceful change now may prevent a lot of violent change later” is not a realistic attitude for “old world” ruling classes to have. One could almost call it impossible for them to have. To suggest that Kaiser Wilhelm would look at the Germany you’ve crafted, with the victories and advances it‘s achieved, and think “You know what, I’m going to toss all my power away because one hundred and fifty years ago a feudal monarchy in a backwards, pathetic nation got their comeuppance” doesn't ring true to me.
I appreciate that you’ve made changes, I really do, but i just think you’ve got the powers the wrong way round. The Kaiser should have the power to disband the Reichstag and the Chancellor should have the limited three month power. Otherwise, essentially you have a Presidential system and the Kaiser is limited to Supreme Warlord.
I just think absent of any further domestic upheaval (a Great Depression analogue, civil unrest of a prolonged nature, a further War where Germany doesn’t too as well) there isn’t the impetus for such a dramatic change of governmental system practically overnight twenty odd years after Germany has achieved it’s “Place in the Sun”.
But, and I cannot stress this enough, this is your timeline and you should do what you want.
Chapter 8: Great Britain
Geon
Donor
Chapter 8: Great Britain
Germany may have emerged as the victor in World War I but Great Britain came out of the war in the best condition of all the nations that participated. First, the UK had the lowest casualty rate suffering barely 20,000 casualties total from the La Havre breakout attempt, the sinking of the HMS Revenge, and four troopships. She had not lost any territory in the war. And her economy had survived the war intact.
For the British this was what one would call a “good war.” As one British historian defined it.
“The old definition of war for most of the European powers was that a war would be a short affair. If the opposing side one, well and good. You collected your dead and wounded, called it a day and looked forward to a rematch sometime in the future. That was of course before the advent of technologies that made war the truly deadly business it became in the 20th century.”
The British had not only survived the war but would actually manage to thrive because of it.
Most notably, the British found themselves the beneficiaries of a post-war economic boom. The reason for this boom was simple. France. France needed raw materials that it could no longer get. Coal and iron ore especially as well as other materials were now scarce with the establishment of the German occupation zone. Britain was thus able to capitalize on the French defeat by selling these materials to the French. The arrangement worked well as far as the British were concerned.
With the war over Britain went back to tending its vast empire. As had been true before the war, so now, “the sun never set on the British Empire.” But not all was sunny underneath the British umbrella.
The Irish Uprising, 1916
In Dublin, on April 9, 1916 a bomb exploded outside the British Army HQ there. Twenty-three civilians and Eighteen soldiers were killed in the blast and 33 injured. The explosion was the opening shot in a terror campaign by the IRA which would last throughout the month. It was also the opening shot in the Irish Uprising.
By May 1916 the Free Ireland Brigade had formed and was seizing control in several major Irish cities and towns. British forces deployed to deal with these Brigade found themselves dealing with a whole new kind of warfare, urban guerilla warfare. This new form of warfare seemed barbaric to the British, but it kept them off guard for some time. It was one thing to charge an enemy in an open field. It was another to have to fight from house to house even room to room to root out said enemy only to have him slip away from you after causing casualties.
Veteran troops from 1914 were sent to Ireland to try and quell the uprising. But by 1917 the Free Irish Brigades still held parts or all of the cities of Galway, Belfast, and most of Dublin.
With casualty lists growing by the day the British government under Prime Minister Lloyd George sought some way to end the war without amassing more British casualties. The answer was air power.
On May 13, 1917 – what the Irish would call The Black Day – a squad of British bombers flew over Dublin and dropped bombs on the Post Office and other strongpoints of the Free Irish Brigades and IRA. Similar raids were held on Belfast and other Irish cities. The raids were followed by attacks by the British Army. The British offensive would successfully retake Belfast and Dublin. But the cost would be terrible. While figures on the casualty list for the “Black Day” have varied depending on which history you are reading it is generally agreed that casualties from the British bombing ranged between 10,000 and 35,000.
The Uprising was crushed. But at a terrible cost. In addition to the casualties on the Black Day, Britain would suffer a total of 15,000 troops dead and over 3,000 wounded. Total casualties for the Free Irish Brigades are debated to this day. But are presumed to be high.
There was no formal peace ending the Uprising. Instead the various groups like the IRA simply went underground to await another day. In the meantime, peace would be a difficult thing to come by as British troops would find themselves the victims of terror attacks well into the 30’s and beyond in Ireland. Further, the IRA and other Irish nationalist groups would express their displeasure in other ways such as bombings in the U.K. itself over the next several years.
The Irish Uprising some historians would later say was a foretaste of the war to come.
The “Plot” to Invade Egypt and Ottoman Uprisings
On September 21, 1920 the British envoy in Egypt presented documents which purportedly were plans by the Ottoman Empire to launch an invasion of British controlled Egypt in conjunction with provocation of an uprising among the Egyptian population.
These “documents” have come under scrutiny practically from the time they were first shown to the public. How they were acquired or who they were being sent to has never been adequately explained. Today historians remain divided on whether in fact these documents are genuine or a clever forgery.
The case for forgery is compelling. British oil interests had long coveted the potential wealth residing beneath the Arabian desert. And British military were also concerned about a possible enemy presence so close to the Suez Canal.
By 1920 the Ottoman Empire was truly the “sick man” of Europe and the Middle East. But the Empire still had a great deal of influence in the Middle East. The possibility of the Ottomans invading Egypt however slight it might be perceived by modern historians seemed much more real to the British at the time.
However, a war with the Ottoman Empire might end up drawing the other major powers in Europe. Fighting the Ottomans was one thing. But the possibility of fighting against Germany and Austro-Hungary was considered too risky.
Thus, a different strategy was devised.
British agents masquerading as archeologists, explorers, and adventurers began to enter the areas of Palestine, the Trans-Jordan, and the Arabian Peninsula. There they began to contact the Arabic and Bedouin tribes which had long had an axe to grind with the Ottoman authorities.
Promises were made of British aid (surreptitious aid) in the form of weapons and supplies to aid in uprisings and rebellions.
Thus, by the end of 1920 the Arab Revolts had begun. Although this term is a misnomer as it wasn’t just Arabs who revolted. It was also Bedouins, Lebanese, Persians, and other minorities in the Ottoman Empire. The Ottomans reaction was typically brutal. But, trying to snuff out so many fires at once proved too much for the old Empire. By the end of 1921 the Arab Revolts had resulted in the collapse of the Sultanate and the new republic of Turkey was born.
For the British the collapse of Turkey however did not mean they could simply move in and occupy the Arabian Peninsula. Instead they agreed to allow the Arab sheikhs and other tribal chieftains to assume control, mindful of course of whom it was that had aided them to gain their freedom. Thus, the House of Saud would become the ruling force on the Arabian Peninsula. Palestine would come under British protection for the foreseeable future. The Persians would reassert control over Persia (Iran) and the rest of the Trans-Jordan was organized under a series of Arab sheikhs and local princes.
Britain had successfully toppled the Ottoman Empire and ended their “perceived” threat to Egypt and the Suez Canal. But she had opened a Pandora’s box for the future.
Britain’s Military
The post-war British military, like most of the rest of Europe’s armies, took away the simple lesson of mobility from the brief World War I. The land battleship – tank – was one of the premier war machines of the future battlefield, as was the airplane.
The British quickly had assumed the lead in air power with the development of both tactical and strategic bombers. The use of these planes in the Irish Uprising made it clear just how effective air power could be in turning the tide of conflict.
Like other powers the British also attempted to challenge the non-stop trans-Atlantic crossing challenge. But 2 British pilots separately attempting the feat died. One had his plane crash shortly after taking off from London’s Heathrow Airport. The other disappeared somewhere over the Atlantic and was never seen again.
Like the Germans the British also experimented with radar and would by the 30’s have a workable system for aircraft detection.
The British Navy was finding itself during an arms race as various attempts at limiting tonnage failed to go anywhere despite 6 naval conferences. None of the great maritime powers wanted to end up second in this race. Least of all Britain. So, by the 1930’s Britain could boast of a fleet of 5 aircraft carriers and 20 battleships as well as dozens of cruisers, light cruisers, destroyers and submarines. The British indeed still ruled the waves. But that supremacy would be tested within the decade.
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