Anime without "Lost 30 Years"

[WotanArgead]

Good day.

The economic crisis of the late 80s and early 90s had a profound impact on the socio-economic life of the Land of the Rising Sun. This, in turn, influenced the psychological state of the Japanese, which, in turn, was reflected in the media and culture. In the anime and manga industry, this is primarily characterized by the spread of the Sekai-Kei style - introspective stories, where the disintegration of the surrounding world is associated with the relationship of lovers. Here, of course, not only this phenomenon is also mass escapism, passivity, social phobia, and so on. This can be found in many anime projects of different levels. But what if Japan can bounce back from the crisis and move on.

One Russian-speaking colleague creates a world dedicated to an alternative cold war about the role of the USSR in it. Interestingly, the fate of Japan - which, as a result, is moving from the role of the main Ally in the United States to a neutral state. And the monopoly of the LDP is replaced by competition between the conservatives and the Socialists. So far, the article on Japan is only half done, and stops at the Liberal Democrats' crisis, and the appointment of Takako Doi as Prime Minister of Japan. I understand that there are still many questions, but I'm interested in the possible consequences for the world of Japanese animation.

 

[Nivek]

I would say nothing would change besides more experimental ovas

 

[WotanArgead]

I would say nothing would change besides more experimental ovas

That is, in your opinion, the tone and character of most anime series will not change.

In fact, on the subject of the OVAs, Evangelion did a lot to shift the focus from the OVAs back to the TV series. And in a world where Sekai-kei doesn't become one of the central phenomena, chances are that without EVE, the focus will be more on OVA. But from your words it turns out that Evangelion will still be released.

 

[Nivek]

That is, in your opinion, the tone and character of most anime series will not change.

In fact, on the subject of the OVAs, Evangelion did a lot to shift the focus from the OVAs back to the TV series. And in a world where Sekai-kei doesn't become one of the central phenomena, chances are that without EVE, the focus will be more on OVA. But from your words it turns out that Evangelion will still be released.

What i remember from the expo a guy used to bring anime from Japan, the bubble crash was overstated but did make a trend of moving What could have been ovas into the midnight anime phenomenon, as investors/money launders dry off and the all powerful comitte took over. That phemonenon might be change but if the bubble doesnt crash or crash more controlable the economics are there,atx, midnigth anime were before the crash in fact the crash might have delayed them.

Individual content is imposible to measure but with more money in the system more auteur would take more risk yet investors will want their money back

 

[WotanArgead]

What i remember from the expo a guy used to bring anime from Japan, the bubble crash was overstated but did make a trend of moving What could have been ovas into the midnight anime phenomenon, as investors/money launders dry off and the all powerful comitte took over. That phemonenon might be change but if the bubble doesnt crash or crash more controlable the economics are there,atx, midnigth anime were before the crash in fact the crash might have delayed them.

Did I understand correctly that the sources of funding are changing - no more? And that won't save the ubiquitous Bandai as a member of the sponsor list? Therefore, such judgments are irrelevant:

By the way, no one interferes with Soviet censorship to "edit" uncomfortable moments in the same anime - in our country, as far as I remember, in the official dubbing of "Samurai X", a non-traditional character was simply changed sex, made a girl, and let in this form on the air. If going beyond the "limits of what is permitted" can be cut out during editing without extra effort, then there will be no problems with this. This, by the way, is another question whether Death Note and other titles will appear in this AI - after the collapse of the economy in 1989, the Japanese clearly began to tilt towards acute social phobia, plus all Japanese mass cinema was ordered to die for a long time, due to which for three decades they have not supplied anything other than anime to foreign film markets. There is no such collapse here, so the idea is that the assortment of anime should seriously change and the situation with the cinema will be better.

This is not about "Death Note" in general, but about the situation with anime in general. Still, such a gloomy as "Jin-Roh" or "Perfect Blue", according to my feelings, until 1989 there were fewer. Yes, even in the cinema, the obvious disappointment of the Japanese in the surrounding reality is felt (the same "Battle Royale" can be recalled).

It's a pity - but it was about an event that made a significant part of the population sociophobic loners.

 

[Nivek]

understand correctly that the sources of funding are changing - no more? And that won't save the ubiquitous Bandai as a member of the sponsor list? Therefore, such judgments are irrelevant:

Yes they change and move to squeze the most yen possible from loyal/potential business, anime after all is a business,if there no money to be made it will die,plain and simple (besides some goverment funded artístic or vanity projects,like a billonaire funding his Child a la laika studios) , reminder that pingu was the most popular animate show(the 3D version)in Japan .
Funny you mentioned movies,i remember reading in a book that a japanese videogame developer mentioned/joked that his fellow sucks at team work,that is why manga and videogames are sucessful but their traditional movies sucks

It's a pity - but it was about an event that made a significant part of the population sociophobic loners.

a pity - but it was about an event that made a significant part of the population sociophobic lone

Those are not even the 0.1% of the population, ie a White noise

 

[WotanArgead]

Funny you mentioned movies,i remember reading in a book that a japanese videogame developer mentioned/joked that his fellow sucks at team work,that is why manga and videogames are sucessful but their traditional movies sucks

(Akira Kurosawa - am I a joke to you?)
Well, by the way, I didn’t mention it - but the author of the original article (these are quotes from our conversation in the comments).

Well, actually there are more "dramas" - which are not so popular in the West, but are popular in South Korea and Taiwan. And the emergence of a number of social-democratic governments cannot lead to an increase in projects sponsored from the state budget? Or will their number be too small?

 

[Nivek]

Akira Kurosawa - am I a joke to you?)

Almost 80 years ago and he took a lot inspiration in hoĺlywood too,plus the guy waa talking 2010-2011 he was well dead and burried.

Well, actually there are more "dramas" - which are not so popular in the West, but are popular in South Korea and Taiwan

Yet korean movies are popular in streaming,at least they know how to try to sell internatonally.

social-democratic governments cannot lead to an increase in projects sponsored from the state budget? Or will their number be too small?

The question is who and what will earn those grants,at lot will be paying political favours too,some could be very local based, like animated equivalent of taiga dramas or based in very localized concepts.

First of all think of anime as a business. That will answer your own question

 

[Godot]

Almost 80 years ago and he took a lot inspiration in hoĺlywood too,plus the guy waa talking 2010-2011 he was well dead and burried.

This is, frankly, just incorrect. Kurosawa had a half-century-long career and is one of the most important and influential directors *ever*, not just out of Japan. His work has been and will continue to be more of a cultural landmark and an influence over cinema as an art than any anime I can think of.

 

[Godot]

Good day.

The economic crisis of the late 80s and early 90s had a profound impact on the socio-economic life of the Land of the Rising Sun. This, in turn, influenced the psychological state of the Japanese, which, in turn, was reflected in the media and culture. In the anime and manga industry, this is primarily characterized by the spread of the Sekai-Kei style - introspective stories, where the disintegration of the surrounding world is associated with the relationship of lovers. Here, of course, not only this phenomenon is also mass escapism, passivity, social phobia, and so on. This can be found in many anime projects of different levels. But what if Japan can bounce back from the crisis and move on.

One Russian-speaking colleague creates a world dedicated to an alternative cold war about the role of the USSR in it. Interestingly, the fate of Japan - which, as a result, is moving from the role of the main Ally in the United States to a neutral state. And the monopoly of the LDP is replaced by competition between the conservatives and the Socialists. So far, the article on Japan is only half done, and stops at the Liberal Democrats' crisis, and the appointment of Takako Doi as Prime Minister of Japan. I understand that there are still many questions, but I'm interested in the possible consequences for the world of Japanese animation.

Anime as a modern cultural phenomenon would not exist, not really. The aggressive push to broaden anime's appeal and reach came in light of the decline of more traditional industries and the otherwise stagnating Japanese economy. Anime proved a growth sector and business took note.

With a differently structured Japanese economy or just enough luck to avoid the near-permanent state of treading water they've entered, anime would be far more niche.

 

[WotanArgead]

Almost 80 years ago and he took a lot inspiration in hoĺlywood too,plus the guy waa talking 2010-2011 he was well dead and burried.

Well, to put it more broadly, there was a period of the dawn of Japanese cinematography, and when Japanese cinema determined the work of a new generation of Western directors. That's why I don't like it when they say that "Japanese don't know how to make movies". They can - besides, as far as I understood in this moment, the author decided, so there's nothing I can do about it even in my fanon.

Yet korean movies are popular in streaming,at least they know how to try to sell internatonally.

The Japanese do not need a foreign market - and frankly, let it stay that way. To be honest, I am opposed to too much foreign capital infiltration into Japan, as well as the idea that the Japanese should make their anime more internationally oriented. Only they know how to do their stuff - so we'd better just watch.
Also, for my taste, Korean media.... it could have been made in the USA or let's say in France.

(And about stagnation - do I understand your idea correctly that its effect on the moral and psychological state of the Japanese is exaggerated? I understand that this topic requires a separate thread - but still I would like to hear the answer)

 

[WotanArgead]

With a differently structured Japanese economy or just enough luck to avoid the near-permanent state of treading water they've entered, anime would be far more niche.

It seems that the cult anime series in Japan were created in the 80s. And they were successful in France, Korea, and Latin American countries.

 

[Godot]

It seems that the cult anime series in Japan were created in the 80s. And they were successful in France, Korea, and Latin American countries.

Cult popularity does not equal success. Further many of those series only actually made it over the pond post-bubble.

 

[WotanArgead]

Cult popularity does not equal success. Further many of those series only actually made it over the pond post-bubble.

Am I Joke to you?

Magical Angel Creamy Mami was dubbed into Italian by Studio PV, who released it as L'incantevole Creamy from 1985-02-03.[19] It was also broadcast in France by La Cinq (later on TMC, AB1 and Manga) as Creamy, merveilleuse Creamy from April 29, 1988,[20] and more recently released in French DVD editions (French dub or Japanese and French subtitles) by Declic Image. It was also distributed in Spain as "El Broche Encantado" in 1992


It was dubbed into Cantonese by a Hong Kong TV Station - TVB, who released it as "我係小忌廉" (I am Creamy Mami) from January 7, 1985 showing it from Monday to Friday at 6pm, each time shown half an hour.

 

[Jiraiyathegallant]

Japan’s working age population decreases shortly after the start of the time period and Japanese media is filled with legacy franchises that Japanese companies own a legal monopoly on. Why have a shrinking population move into making new media instead of making easy money off of older franchises?

I’m also not sure to what extent Japan’s cultural issues like social isolation are unique. That seems to be increasingly ubiquitous in the 21st century. American movie ticket sales per capita have steadily fallen for generations.

 

[Godot]

Am I Joke to you?

You? I don't think I've ever interacted with you before, not sure how I could already regard you as a joke.

As per what you quoted, though, again it's rare and occasional cult popularity. It'd be like me claiming Nigerian music as a significant cultural wave and citing the relative popularity of Fela Kuti.

 

[WotanArgead]

You? I don't think I've ever interacted with you before, not sure how I could already regard you as a joke.

This is a set expression - or more precisely a meme. Perhaps I should have inserted the name I'm speaking from. Although he directly referred to the quote that he cited below.

However, not only was Creamy Mami wildly popular (to the point that the girls themselves repeated silly spells in order to become charismatic teenagers). And this is not the first time - the first anime to be shown on French TV was Goldorak (UFO Grendizer). Already in 1987, the broadcast of Club Dorothée began - which contributed to the popularization of anime in France. The same thing happened in Italy, where by 1984 anime became part of the leisure of local youth.
Perhaps this is far from the influence that gave rise to the phenomenon of Western otaku - but already much wider than at the same time in the United States.

Anime and Manga in France | Japanese Animation

In recent years, anime has become a staple of the global pop culture. Whether it’s the long term arc-based storytelling, visually-spectacular fight scenes, frustratingly-adorable creatures, or the introduction of giant robots and magical girls, anime has certainly captured the world’s ...

japanesegallery.com

I’m also not sure to what extent Japan’s cultural issues like social isolation are unique. That seems to be increasingly ubiquitous in the 21st century. American movie ticket sales per capita have steadily fallen for generations.

Well, as far as I know, they are all products of the 1989 crisis and the subsequent stagnation in the economy.

 

[Neoteros]

This is a set expression - or more precisely a meme. Perhaps I should have inserted the name I'm speaking from. Although he directly referred to the quote that he cited below.

However, not only was Cream Mami wildly popular (to the point that the girls themselves repeated silly spells in order to become charismatic teenagers). And this is not the first time - the first anime to be shown on French TV was Goldorak (UFO Grendizer). Already in 1987, the broadcast of Club Dorothée began - which contributed to the popularization of anime in France. The same thing happened in Italy, where by 1984 anime became part of the leisure of local youth.
Perhaps this is far from the influence that gave rise to the phenomenon of Western otaku - but already much wider than at the same time in the United States.

Anime and Manga in France | Japanese Animation

In recent years, anime has become a staple of the global pop culture. Whether it’s the long term arc-based storytelling, visually-spectacular fight scenes, frustratingly-adorable creatures, or the introduction of giant robots and magical girls, anime has certainly captured the world’s ...

japanesegallery.com

Well, as far as I know, they are all products of the 1989 crisis and the subsequent stagnation in the economy.

Indeed; the main difference between France and Italy however, is that while France's 1970s/1980s classic anime boom eventually resulted in the development of quite a few animated series that took cues from anime (Miraculous and Totally Spies! above all) but became successful series in their own right, Italy... didn't have much of that, really. Sure, some local series tried (Winx Club, for example), but they were even more derivative than the French ones, and didn't make as big an impact overseas.

 

[Nivek]

Totally Spies

That was Canadian,I think you mean Oban or code lyoko isn't it?

 

[WotanArgead]

That was Canadian,I think you mean Oban or code lyoko isn't it?

Marathon Group is based in France and the author is a Frenchman from Paris.

Indeed; the main difference between France and Italy however, is that while France's 1970s/1980s classic anime boom eventually resulted in the development of quite a few animated series that took cues from anime (Miraculous and Totally Spies! above all) but became successful series in their own right, Italy... didn't have much of that, really. Sure, some local series tried (Winx Club, for example), but they were even more derivative than the French ones, and didn't make as big an impact overseas.

Winx were popular in Russia.
(Here, by the way, it is interesting that in the world that I mentioned, France and Italy in the late 70s will experience a political transformation - but that's another topic).