Krakow would only continue being a city-state as long as the rest of Poland doesn't exist.
Might I suggest cities in India, such as Goa, Madras, Pondicherri, et. al, depending on how much you want to mitigate a Brit-wank.
AHC: Other Singapore style City States
- Thread starter Bolt451
- Start date
Krakow would only continue being a city-state as long as the rest of Poland doesn't exist.
Might I suggest cities in India, such as Goa, Madras, Pondicherri, et. al, depending on how much you want to mitigate a Brit-wank.
Buenos Aires is one of the more likely candidates, given that one of the most significant Argentinean conflicts of the 19th Century was the struggle between BA and the rest of the country. If the conflict goes a little differently, you could easily see an independent Buenos Aires.
I see very unlikely by a number of reasons. The war, a more appropriate name for the conflict of Buenos Aires with the rest of country, would inevitably end in only one option. The war between Buenos Aires and the Provinces (the rest of the country) was
a) who controls the port, the main and only connection for foreign trade of great volume. By the XVIII it became clear that grain and cattle produced in the interior was a very good business specially to Europe, agro-exportation model.
b) who controls the customs revenue, that were quite significant source of wealth. Buenos Aires jealously fought to keep this revenue under its control. However the Provinces thought that it could better used instead of going to the pockets of the fat cats of Buenos Aires.
Even if it became detached from the rest of the province and it only was the port and the city that remained independent (as it happened briefly in OTL) it still was seeing as bad solution by the rest of the country.
How about an independent Principality of Neuchâtel? It's roughly the same size as Singapore, previously it was independent and had been in personal union with Prussia, however when the ruling House died out the process of selecting a replacement was fairly wide open. A different candidate is chosen, they don't join with Switzerland but remain close with a relationship similar to Liechtenstein. Sitting between France and Switzerland with few natural resources they enter the banking/financial industry and free trade with enthusiasm. This was in no way inspired by the Duchy of Grand Fenwick.
What about a spanish city where Punta Arenas in the Magallanes Straits are? they founded it pre independence and after it they keep it. And now its a dominion of the Spanish Crown
Or after a Chile - Argentina war, it's become a condominium and eventually became independent (IDK why, but imagine british intervention)
Or after a Chile - Argentina war, it's become a condominium and eventually became independent (IDK why, but imagine british intervention)
Good idea. Just let the Royal Navy arrive earlier and use as a port of call and supply station for whaling ships. A bonus if its coordinate with efforts to control the Falklands.
By the time of the Napoleonic Wars Venice's splendor was gone. Besides Venice porper, people forget that at that time it also included a third of northern Italy (aprox OTL Veneto and
Friuli-Venezia Giulia regions). So it was already too large to be considered a city-state like Singapore.
Perhaps Trieste and Ragusa can be better choices.
Of the ones mentioned my favorites are:
*Zanzibar
*Kilwa Kisiwan. Or any Swahili city state or federation of them.
*Mogadishu
I don't see people considering:
* Hausa city-states
*Tripoli. Trading center between the Mediterranean and the interior of Sahara
*The capital city of the Kanem–Bornu Empire. It can fancy all the territorial claims it can think of but it mostly consists of sand and nomads.
*Maya city-states. (kinda of difficult with Spanish conquest, but one can have dreams)
*Other Mesoamerican city-states.
*Central Asian cities along the silk route
*Russian city states: Novgorod and Pskov. The Venices of the North!!!
*Malacca in the middle of Strait of the same name. If things had worked another way and the Dutch or British had more foresight it could have been Singapore's twin.
*Brunei
A good source of information and ideas of city states is:
Mogens Herman Hansen (ed.) 2000. A comparative study of thirty city-state cultures 2000. ISBN 87-7876-177-8.
*Zanzibar
*Kilwa Kisiwan. Or any Swahili city state or federation of them.
*Mogadishu
I don't see people considering:
* Hausa city-states
*Tripoli. Trading center between the Mediterranean and the interior of Sahara
*The capital city of the Kanem–Bornu Empire. It can fancy all the territorial claims it can think of but it mostly consists of sand and nomads.
*Maya city-states. (kinda of difficult with Spanish conquest, but one can have dreams)
*Other Mesoamerican city-states.
*Central Asian cities along the silk route
*Russian city states: Novgorod and Pskov. The Venices of the North!!!
*Malacca in the middle of Strait of the same name. If things had worked another way and the Dutch or British had more foresight it could have been Singapore's twin.
*Brunei
A good source of information and ideas of city states is:
Mogens Herman Hansen (ed.) 2000. A comparative study of thirty city-state cultures 2000. ISBN 87-7876-177-8.
Most certainly. All UAE are in some way city-states. If you add Qatar, Mascate and Eden an interest thing could have resulted sort of like the Italian sea-city states. Thought I think some one (i.e. any polity in control Persia) could easily block the strait of Hormuz and make them tributaries or vassals.
Plus it seems Sinbad the sailor was originally or at least the myth refers, to sailors of Mascate. Just image these city states in a League of the Piracy Coast
or League of the Pearl Coast How about the Dutch keep Malacca, but the rest of Malaysia (and Singapore) end up British? A different Anglo-Dutch Treaty of 1824.
Alternatively, there is no federation of Malaya. Instead, each of the independent sultanates are separate protectorates, becoming independent separately. Meanwhile, the Straits Settlements also become independent separately.
This means that Penang is also effectively a city state, as, possibly, is Dinding and (if you stretch the definition a bit) Labuan.
That could work, especialy if the Dutch and British kind of divide malaysia, possibly even other countries; although I am not sure which counties the British and Dutch would accept and are at the same time powerful enough to manage to colonise/conquer parts of Malaysia. Maybe an earlier POD than 1824 could work for France or Portugal to capture a citystate in malaysia.
Ignoring the fact that Brunei and Djibouti are sort of like mega-city states...
- Guayaquil. The entire department almost became independent from Ecuador and anyone else in the Latin American Wars for Independence, so it could be its own city-state.
- Dakar and Freetown in west Africa. They were important to the French and British respectively, sit on peninsulas, and were often quite distinct from the rest of the country. This is especially true for Freetown which had origins in Black Nova Scotian loyalists.
- Trieste. Italians, Slovenes, and Germans have all called this city home, and being an international city could be enforced by European powers.
- Sevastopol. International city with Russia being the guarantor of their sovereignty.
- Mecca. A movement could potentially arise that would desire to see Mecca as a sort of 'Vatican State' for Muslims where no Muslim nation has strict "control" of the city, and it is free and belongs to all Muslims everywhere. An international free Muslim city.
- Guayaquil. The entire department almost became independent from Ecuador and anyone else in the Latin American Wars for Independence, so it could be its own city-state.
- Dakar and Freetown in west Africa. They were important to the French and British respectively, sit on peninsulas, and were often quite distinct from the rest of the country. This is especially true for Freetown which had origins in Black Nova Scotian loyalists.
- Trieste. Italians, Slovenes, and Germans have all called this city home, and being an international city could be enforced by European powers.
- Sevastopol. International city with Russia being the guarantor of their sovereignty.
- Mecca. A movement could potentially arise that would desire to see Mecca as a sort of 'Vatican State' for Muslims where no Muslim nation has strict "control" of the city, and it is free and belongs to all Muslims everywhere. An international free Muslim city.
Maybe a city state around Cam Ranh Bay in Vietnam? The area was one of the last remnants of Champa, and maybe at some point a Cham prince or noble could convert to Christianity and attempt to seize control by inviting in European help (basically trading heathen Vietnamese masters for fellow Christians). Expansion inland would be difficult due to Vietnamese strength (earlier on) and also the terrain, so it would keep the potential territory ruled by this protectorate small. It makes for a good naval base, after all. Europeans either fail at seizing the rest of Vietnam, a different European power than the protectorate of this small Cham state seizes the rest of Vietnam, or Vietnam is never colonised to begin with. Later on this Cham city state regains proper independence.
Panduranga/Phan Rang or Kauthara/Nha Trang would also make for good potential city states, although in every case they have the potential to be bigger than most city states, although in practice I'd expect the titular city to dominate the rest of the country in all aspects making them defacto city states.
Is this plausible?
Panduranga/Phan Rang or Kauthara/Nha Trang would also make for good potential city states, although in every case they have the potential to be bigger than most city states, although in practice I'd expect the titular city to dominate the rest of the country in all aspects making them defacto city states.
Is this plausible?
Depends on which power claims it, and whether the Vietnamese would want to take it. Interesting idea, regardless.
I don't see why the Vietnamese wouldn't want to take it. Although Vietnam was divided at several times, Europeans could exploit these divisions to prevent a conquest of their Cham vassal.
The best choice for a European power is probably Spain, given the fact they tried to conquer Cambodia at one point. If Spain can't hold it, maybe another European power can claim the place instead.
Unless they are large islands thus nation-states, I have my doubts for any Caribbean island or port to survive has a city-state.
Troubles I see: It is in the middle of a hurricane zone, there is piracy (lots of it). All major colonial powers (Dutch, English, Spain, France to name a few) fought dearly over the control of the islands. Besides sugar and coffee, that are no other valuable commodities to control and I don't see any other economic good that makes its possible to exist.
Small islands (like the Bahamas and Lesser Antilles) are too dependant on sea commerce to survive and have large population, just blockade a rebellious one and it's done for. So they are dependant on a colonial or regional power to survive.
Even the Island of Tortuga had its days counted for after it became a pirate haven.
Everything you said is also valid for Singapore - excluding the hurricane part, of course. Still, not all of the islands are in zone. The only special thing about Singapore is that it just happens to be between China and India.