AHC: Limited Nuclear Exchange Post-1980

[Shaby]

Yes, that's why it's just a scenario. On SSBN's launching when detected I think there's no way any SSBN skipper would launch without explicit launch orders.

Of course, not in peace time. But once nukes start flying around, this changes very quickly.

Not all, but majority of bomber force could well get caught with SSBN missiles. That was the reason why bomber force wasn't that a great investment after ICBM's anyway.

It all depends how much time they would have. It is possible if strike is simultaneous with tactical strikes in Germany. Any other way is a tough proposal. If the bombers are alerted and dispersed, you are looking at too many targets for a sneak attack.

In peacetime NATO's nuclear weapons were in quite few bases and dispersal areas well known to Warsaw Pact intelligence services and constantly monitored by their agents. This was a problem especially in an open community such as West Germany, thus quite large escort detachments assigned to NATO's tactical nuclear weapons.

The number of targets was surprisingly few and could get served by mix of nuclear and chemical weapons making recovery painstaking to say at least.

That could work. Still, weapons in Britain, sea based weapons of the Sixth fleet in the Med and other similar systems within easy strike range.

As a BOOB attack strategy, this could work. If there is a prolonged crisis, then it is other story.

 

[SergeantHeretic]

I preffer my nuclear scenarioes more fantastic and far fetched, IE a limited use of tactical weapons in a largely conventional war, and the use of nukes stops boths sides and scares them to the talking table.

Basically a romantic fantsy by a cold war kid.

 

[Simon Darkshade]

Eric L. Harry's Ark Light features a limited nuclear war, with an initial Russian counter force strike of 649 megatons and an American response of 1092 megatons (around 5000 warheads). Quite decent read.

 

[SergeantHeretic]

Eric L. Harry's Ark Light features a limited nuclear war, with an initial Russian counter force strike of 649 megatons and an American response of 1092 megatons (around 5000 warheads). Quite decent read.

Five thousand warheads is limited? Jeep and Chrysler, man what does that leave afterward?

 

[Armored Diplomacy]

Some world crisis happens, and like in previous situations (India-Pakistan, Arab-Israeli, etc), each side deploys a fleet to the area. As almost happened in the 1970s, a confrontation takes place. But something goes wrong, and a full-scale naval engagement erupts.

Something goes wrong as the information is passed up the command chain (such mistakes happened in the past), and the Soviet General Staff is mistakenly told that the Soviet Union is under attack by the United States. Believing that nuclear missiles are on their way to Moscow, they give the order to Soviet missile bases and submarines launch all nuclear-equipped missiles. The Premier soon finds out. Having spoken with the US President over the incident and received more accurate information, and having been told why the General Staff was evacuating, he immediately countermands the order and orders the General Staff back in. Nuclear bases and submarines get the order to stand down, but not in time enough for two submarine-launched nukes to have been launched.

Right before San Diego and Key West are obliterated, the Premier telephones the President and explains what is going to happen. After deliberating with his cabinet, the President comes to a decision; there will be no full-on nuclear exchange, but the United States cannot allow the nukings of two cities to go without a response. Vladivostok and Sevastopol, both homes to important naval bases, will be destroyed. If the Soviets agree not to respond, there will be no further nuclear attacks. In addition to satisfying the US public and military's demands for retribution, the President secretly hopes the Soviet Navy will be less of a threat. The Premier is informed, and agrees not to retaliate. The cities are destroyed by submarine-launched cruise missiles.

 

[SergeantHeretic]

Some world crisis happens, and like in previous situations (India-Pakistan, Arab-Israeli, etc), each side deploys a fleet to the area. As almost happened in the 1970s, a confrontation takes place. But something goes wrong, and a full-scale naval engagement erupts.

Something goes wrong as the information is passed up the command chain (such mistakes happened in the past), and the Soviet General Staff is mistakenly told that the Soviet Union is under attack by the United States. Believing that nuclear missiles are on their way to Moscow, they give the order to Soviet missile bases and submarines launch all nuclear-equipped missiles. The Premier soon finds out. Having spoken with the US President over the incident and received more accurate information, and having been told why the General Staff was evacuating, he immediately countermands the order and orders the General Staff back in. Nuclear bases and submarines get the order to stand down, but not in time enough for two submarine-launched nukes to have been launched.

Right before San Diego and Key West are obliterated, the Premier telephones the President and explains what is going to happen. After deliberating with his cabinet, the President comes to a decision; there will be no full-on nuclear exchange, but the United States cannot allow the nukings of two cities to go without a response. Vladivostok and Sevastopol, both homes to important naval bases, will be destroyed. If the Soviets agree not to respond, there will be no further nuclear attacks. In addition to satisfying the US public and military's demands for retribution, the President secretly hopes the Soviet Navy will be less of a threat. The Premier is informed, and agrees not to retaliate. The cities are destroyed by submarine-launched cruise missiles.

Ah, a "Fail safe" style scenario, interesting. Not too terribly likely but as I mentioned I very much like romantic fantasy where this scenario is concerned.

 

[Viscount Stanthorpe]

Even in a limited nuclear war scenario (something that I personally think is rather unlikely for the use-or-loose reasons mentioned above), I suspect that the shock of the attack would infect the target countries for years, in terms of political discourse.

I can well imagine, in a near-miss world, demagogues being subsequently elected (or otherwise getting into power) vowing to finish the job. After all, given the smouldering ruins, the enemy has *proven* himself to be utterly evil in the mindset of the attacked nation, so surely an attack is only a preemptive defence against a future, even worse, atrocity?

 

[Bernard Woolley]

Eric L. Harry's Ark Light features a limited nuclear war, with an initial Russian counter force strike of 649 megatons and an American response of 1092 megatons (around 5000 warheads). Quite decent read.

It isn't bad. Should really have called it Arc Heavy though.

 

[Simon Darkshade]

Five thousand warheads is limited? Jeep and Chrysler, man what does that leave afterward?

Quite a lot.
The Russians have 22 SSBNs in a bastion in the Kara Sea with 416 SLBMs carrying 3760 warheads, with 1610 targeted on 536 US military installations worldwide not hit in the first strike and 2150 targeted at the 304 largest American cities. Their fail deadly status is a significant plot point.

The USN boomers and RN bombers are similarly reserved for countervalue strikes, and there are inferences to a reasonable amount of weapons left to the bomber leg of the triad.

Jan - Indeed, although unfortunately SAC was renamed by the time the book was set. The title is a bit of a misnomer, as the initial reference to Arc Light in Korea isn't followed up and the bit at the end is rather rushed.

 

[TheKinkster]

Has anyone ever seen Arc Light in ebook format?

 

[Bernard Woolley]

Jan - Indeed, although unfortunately SAC was renamed by the time the book was set. The title is a bit of a misnomer, as the initial reference to Arc Light in Korea isn't followed up and the bit at the end is rather rushed.

The whole Korea plot is never fully explored and I agree about the end.
Harry did have ACC controling the bombers and having its H.Q at Offutt. In reality the bombers came under Stratcom along with the missiles and boomers. H.Q ACC is at Langley AFB.

 

[MerryPrankster]

I haven't read "Arc Light," but it involves a strategic nuclear exchange followed by a U.S. conventional invasion of Russia itself, right?

I found that a bit implausible--the targets (including ports and logistical centers) closest to Russia should get hit the worst and that'd make it harder for such a force to even get there, let alone get supplied.

Of course, NATO forces already in Europe would likely make up most of the force, but again, rail hubs and the like would likely be hit.

 

[asnys]

I haven't read "Arc Light," but it involves a strategic nuclear exchange followed by a U.S. conventional invasion of Russia itself, right?

I found that a bit implausible--the targets (including ports and logistical centers) closest to Russia should get hit the worst and that'd make it harder for such a force to even get there, let alone get supplied.

Of course, NATO forces already in Europe would likely make up most of the force, but again, rail hubs and the like would likely be hit.

If I recall correctly - and it's been a while since I read the book - it's a pure counterforce exchanging targeting only ICBM fields and bomber bases, with cities and other facilities - including non-strategic military installations - left alone. The US-Soviet exchange started unintentionally when the US president tipped off China about an impending Soviet nuclear strike; in the chaos of the Chinese preemption, a renegade Soviet general fired a counterforce volley at our Minuteman fields. They're on the Hot Line before the missiles even land explaining what happened, and the US agrees to limit our retaliatory response to the same class of targets. Afterwards, millions of people are dead or dying from fallout and the political pressure to go to war is irresistible; the president tries to resist it anyway and ends up being impeached for refusing to implement Congress's declaration of war.

It's a very good book, with a lot more depth than your typical technothriller. I'm skeptical of its plausibility, but it's got a lot of nice touches, like scenes of Congress meeting under Mount Weather, and the US economy collapsing as people flee the cities into the countryside.

 

[Bernard Woolley]

The exchange is US/Russia only and much of the US Army is already packed up for deployment to Korea. NATO also collapses soon after to be replaced by a new alliance - TEAMS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arc_Light

 

[Simon Darkshade]

Arc Light is perhaps the only novel I know that combines global thermonuclear war with soldiers singing and dancing along to the dulcet tones of MC Hammer.

I'm not sure which had the more deleterious impact on the future of civilisation.

 

[SergeantHeretic]

Quite a lot.
The Russians have 22 SSBNs in a bastion in the Kara Sea with 416 SLBMs carrying 3760 warheads, with 1610 targeted on 536 US military installations worldwide not hit in the first strike and 2150 targeted at the 304 largest American cities. Their fail deadly status is a significant plot point.

The USN boomers and RN bombers are similarly reserved for countervalue strikes, and there are inferences to a reasonable amount of weapons left to the bomber leg of the triad.

Jan - Indeed, although unfortunately SAC was renamed by the time the book was set. The title is a bit of a misnomer, as the initial reference to Arc Light in Korea isn't followed up and the bit at the end is rather rushed.

Oh, well, nowsee, I did not know that. thank you. I apreciate the education.

 

[atreides]

Quite a lot.
The Russians have 22 SSBNs in a bastion in the Kara Sea with 416 SLBMs carrying 3760 warheads, with 1610 targeted on 536 US military installations worldwide not hit in the first strike and 2150 targeted at the 304 largest American cities. Their fail deadly status is a significant plot point.

The USN boomers and RN bombers are similarly reserved for countervalue strikes, and there are inferences to a reasonable amount of weapons left to the bomber leg of the triad.

Jan - Indeed, although unfortunately SAC was renamed by the time the book was set. The title is a bit of a misnomer, as the initial reference to Arc Light in Korea isn't followed up and the bit at the end is rather rushed.

A list of the 304 largest American cities:

New York NY 8,363,710
Los Angeles CA 3,833,995
Chicago IL 2,853,114
Houston TX 2,242,193
Phoenix AZ 1,567,924
Philadelphia PA 1,447,395
San Antonio TX 1,351,305
Dallas TX 1,279,910
San Diego CA 1,279,329
San Jose CA 948,279
Detroit MI 912,062
San Francisco CA 808,976
Jacksonville FL 807,815
Indianapolis IN 798,382
Austin TX 757,688
Columbus OH 754,885
Fort Worth TX 703,073
Charlotte NC 687,456
Memphis TN 669,651
Baltimore MD 636,919
El Paso TX 613,190
Boston MA 609,023
Milwaukee WI 604,477
Denver CO 598,707
Seattle WA 598,541
Nashville TN 596,462
Washington DC 591,833
Las Vegas NV 558,383
Portland OR 557,706
Louisville KY 557,224
Oklahoma City OK 551,789
Tucson AZ 541,811
Atlanta GA 537,958
Albuquerque NM 521,999
Fresno CA 476,050
Sacramento CA 463,794
Long Beach CA 463,789
Mesa AZ 463,552
Kansas City MO 451,572
Omaha NE 438,646
Cleveland OH 433,748
Virginia Beach VA 433,746
Miami FL 413,201
Oakland CA 404,155
Raleigh NC 392,552
Tulsa OK 385,635
Minneapolis MN 382,605
Colorado Springs CO 380,307
Honolulu HI 374,676
Arlington TX 374,417
Wichita KS 366,046
St. Louis MO 354,361
Tampa FL 340,882
Santa Ana CA 339,130
Anaheim CA 335,288
Cincinnati OH 333,336
Bakersfield CA 321,078
Aurora CO 319,057
New Orleans LA 311,853
Pittsburgh PA 310,037
Riverside CA 295,357
Toledo OH 293,201
Stockton CA 287,037
Corpus Christi TX 286,462
Lexington KY 282,114
St. Paul MN 279,590
Anchorage AK 279,243
Newark NJ 278,980
Buffalo NY 270,919
Plano TX 267,480
Henderson NV 252,064
Lincoln NE 251,624
Fort Wayne IN 251,591
Glendale AZ 251,522
Greensboro NC 250,642
Chandler AZ 247,140
St. Petersburg FL 245,314
Jersey City NJ 241,114
Scottsdale AZ 235,371
Norfolk VA 234,220
Madison WI 231,916
Orlando FL 230,519
Birmingham AL 228,798
Baton Rouge LA 223,689
Durham NC 223,284
Laredo TX 221,659
Lubbock TX 220,483
Chesapeake VA 220,111
Chula Vista CA 219,318
Garland TX 218,577
Winston-Salem NC 217,600
North Las Vegas NV 217,253
Reno NV 217,016
Gilbert AZ 216,449
Hialeah FL 210,542
Arlington VA 209,969
Akron OH 207,510
Irvine CA 207,500
Rochester NY 206,886
Boise City ID 205,314
Modesto CA 202,967
Fremont CA 202,867
Montgomery AL 202,696
Spokane WA 202,319
Richmond VA 202,002
Yonkers NY 201,588
Irving TX 201,358
Shreveport LA 199,729
San Bernardino CA 198,580
Tacoma WA 197,181
Glendale CA 197,176
Des Moines IA 197,052
Augusta GA 194,149
Grand Rapids MI 193,396
Huntington Beach CA 192,620
Mobile AL 191,022
Moreno Valley CA 190,871
Little Rock AR 189,515
Amarillo TX 187,236
Columbus GA 186,984
Oxnard CA 185,717
Fontana CA 184,984
Knoxville TN 184,802
Fort Lauderdale FL 183,126
Salt Lake City UT 181,698
Newport News VA 179,614
Huntsville AL 176,645
Tempe AZ 175,523
Brownsville TX 175,494
Worcester MA 175,011
Fayetteville NC 174,091
Jackson MS 173,861
Tallahassee FL 171,922
Aurora IL 171,782
Ontario CA 171,691
Providence RI 171,557
Overland Park KS 171,231
Rancho Cucamonga CA 171,176
Chattanooga TN 170,880
Oceanside CA 169,684
Santa Clarita CA 169,500
Garden Grove CA 165,796
Vancouver WA 163,186
Grand Prairie TX 160,641
Peoria AZ 157,960
Rockford IL 157,272
Cape Coral FL 156,835
Springfield MO 156,206
Santa Rosa CA 155,796
Sioux Falls SD 154,997
Port St. Lucie FL 154,353
Dayton OH 154,200
Salem OR 153,435
Pomona CA 152,699
Springfield MA 150,640
Eugene OR 150,104
Corona CA 149,923
Pasadena TX 146,439
Joliet IL 146,125
Pembroke Pines FL 145,661
Paterson NJ 145,643
Hampton VA 145,494
Lancaster CA 145,469
Alexandria VA 143,885
Salinas CA 143,640
Palmdale CA 143,197
Naperville IL 143,117
Pasadena CA 143,080
Kansas City KS 142,562
Hayward CA 142,061
Hollywood FL 141,740
Lakewood CO 140,989
Torrance CA 140,820
Syracuse NY 138,068
Escondido CA 137,103
Fort Collins CO 136,509
Bridgeport CT 136,405
Orange CA 136,392
Warren MI 133,939
Elk Grove CA 133,003
Savannah GA 132,410
Mesquite TX 132,123
Sunnyvale CA 132,109
Fullerton CA 131,868
McAllen TX 129,776
Cary NC 129,545
Cedar Rapids IA 128,056
Sterling Heights MI 127,160
Columbia SC 127,029
Coral Springs FL 125,783
Carrollton TX 125,595
Elizabeth NJ 124,755
Hartford CT 124,062
Waco TX 124,009
Bellevue WA 123,771
New Haven CT 123,669
West Valley City UT 123,447
Topeka KS 123,446
Thousand Oaks CA 123,091
El Monte CA 121,791
McKinney TX 121,211
Concord CA 121,160
Visalia CA 121,040
Simi Valley CA 120,543
Olathe KS 119,993
Clarksville TN 119,735
Denton TX 119,454
Stamford CT 119,303
Provo UT 118,581
Springfield IL 117,352
Killeen TX 116,934
Abilene TX 116,484
Evansville IN 116,309
Gainesville FL 114,916
Vallejo CA 114,729
Ann Arbor MI 114,386
Peoria IL 114,114
Lansing MI 113,968
Lafayette LA 113,656
Thornton CO 113,429
Athens GA 113,398
Flint MI 112,900
Inglewood CA 112,714
Roseville CA 112,660
Charleston SC 111,978
Beaumont TX 110,553
Independence MO 110,440
Victorville CA 110,318
Santa Clara CA 110,200
Costa Mesa CA 110,080
Miami Gardens FL 109,346
Manchester NH 108,586
Miramar FL 108,484
Downey CA 107,587
Arvada CO 107,361
Allentown PA 107,250
Westminster CO 107,056
Waterbury CT 107,037
Norman OK 106,957
Midland TX 106,561
Elgin IL 106,330
West Covina CA 105,790
Clearwater FL 105,774
Cambridge MA 105,596
Pueblo CO 104,951
West Jordan UT 104,447
Round Rock TX 104,446
Billings MT 103,994
Erie PA 103,817
South Bend IN 103,807
Ventura CA 103,706
Fairfield CA 103,683
Lowell MA 103,615
Norwalk CA 102,982
Burbank CA 102,968
Richmond CA 102,285
Pompano Beach FL 101,943
High Point NC 101,835
Murfreesboro TN 101,753
Lewisville TX 101,624
Richardson TX 101,589
Daly City CA 101,514
Berkeley CA 101,371
Gresham OR 101,221
Wichita Falls TX 101,202
Green Bay WI 101,025
Davenport IA 100,827
Palm Bay FL 100,786
Columbia MO 100,733
Portsmouth VA 100,577
Rochester MN 100,413
Antioch CA 100,219
Wilmington NC 100,192
Centennial CO 99,680
Odessa TX 98,801
West Palm Beach FL 98,779
Rialto CA 98,700
Everett WA 98,212
Murrieta CA 97,918
Tyler TX 97,705
Temecula CA 97,100
Kenosha WI 96,950
Frisco TX 96,676
Sandy UT 96,660
South Gate CA 96,640
Carlsbad CA 96,374
Gary IN 95,920
Mission Viejo CA 94,461
North Charleston SC 94,407
Boulder CO 94,171
Compton CA 93,851
Hillsboro OR 93,638
Albany NY 93,539
Fargo ND 93,531
Lakeland FL 93,333
Orem UT 93,250
Brockton MA 93,007
Roanoke VA 92,967
Broken Arrow OK 92,931
Surprise AZ 92,897
Macon GA 92,775
El Cajon CA 92,718
Carson CA 92,366
Quincy MA 92,339


Limited attack...

 

[SergeantHeretic]

A list of the 304 largest American cities:

New York NY 8,363,710
Los Angeles CA 3,833,995
Chicago IL 2,853,114
Houston TX 2,242,193
Phoenix AZ 1,567,924
Philadelphia PA 1,447,395
San Antonio TX 1,351,305
Dallas TX 1,279,910
San Diego CA 1,279,329
San Jose CA 948,279
Detroit MI 912,062
San Francisco CA 808,976
Jacksonville FL 807,815
Indianapolis IN 798,382
Austin TX 757,688
Columbus OH 754,885
Fort Worth TX 703,073
Charlotte NC 687,456
Memphis TN 669,651
Baltimore MD 636,919
El Paso TX 613,190
Boston MA 609,023
Milwaukee WI 604,477
Denver CO 598,707
Seattle WA 598,541
Nashville TN 596,462
Washington DC 591,833
Las Vegas NV 558,383
Portland OR 557,706
Louisville KY 557,224
Oklahoma City OK 551,789
Tucson AZ 541,811
Atlanta GA 537,958
Albuquerque NM 521,999
Fresno CA 476,050
Sacramento CA 463,794
Long Beach CA 463,789
Mesa AZ 463,552
Kansas City MO 451,572
Omaha NE 438,646
Cleveland OH 433,748
Virginia Beach VA 433,746
Miami FL 413,201
Oakland CA 404,155
Raleigh NC 392,552
Tulsa OK 385,635
Minneapolis MN 382,605
Colorado Springs CO 380,307
Honolulu HI 374,676
Arlington TX 374,417
Wichita KS 366,046
St. Louis MO 354,361
Tampa FL 340,882
Santa Ana CA 339,130
Anaheim CA 335,288
Cincinnati OH 333,336
Bakersfield CA 321,078
Aurora CO 319,057
New Orleans LA 311,853
Pittsburgh PA 310,037
Riverside CA 295,357
Toledo OH 293,201
Stockton CA 287,037
Corpus Christi TX 286,462
Lexington KY 282,114
St. Paul MN 279,590
Anchorage AK 279,243
Newark NJ 278,980
Buffalo NY 270,919
Plano TX 267,480
Henderson NV 252,064
Lincoln NE 251,624
Fort Wayne IN 251,591
Glendale AZ 251,522
Greensboro NC 250,642
Chandler AZ 247,140
St. Petersburg FL 245,314
Jersey City NJ 241,114
Scottsdale AZ 235,371
Norfolk VA 234,220
Madison WI 231,916
Orlando FL 230,519
Birmingham AL 228,798
Baton Rouge LA 223,689
Durham NC 223,284
Laredo TX 221,659
Lubbock TX 220,483
Chesapeake VA 220,111
Chula Vista CA 219,318
Garland TX 218,577
Winston-Salem NC 217,600
North Las Vegas NV 217,253
Reno NV 217,016
Gilbert AZ 216,449
Hialeah FL 210,542
Arlington VA 209,969
Akron OH 207,510
Irvine CA 207,500
Rochester NY 206,886
Boise City ID 205,314
Modesto CA 202,967
Fremont CA 202,867
Montgomery AL 202,696
Spokane WA 202,319
Richmond VA 202,002
Yonkers NY 201,588
Irving TX 201,358
Shreveport LA 199,729
San Bernardino CA 198,580
Tacoma WA 197,181
Glendale CA 197,176
Des Moines IA 197,052
Augusta GA 194,149
Grand Rapids MI 193,396
Huntington Beach CA 192,620
Mobile AL 191,022
Moreno Valley CA 190,871
Little Rock AR 189,515
Amarillo TX 187,236
Columbus GA 186,984
Oxnard CA 185,717
Fontana CA 184,984
Knoxville TN 184,802
Fort Lauderdale FL 183,126
Salt Lake City UT 181,698
Newport News VA 179,614
Huntsville AL 176,645
Tempe AZ 175,523
Brownsville TX 175,494
Worcester MA 175,011
Fayetteville NC 174,091
Jackson MS 173,861
Tallahassee FL 171,922
Aurora IL 171,782
Ontario CA 171,691
Providence RI 171,557
Overland Park KS 171,231
Rancho Cucamonga CA 171,176
Chattanooga TN 170,880
Oceanside CA 169,684
Santa Clarita CA 169,500
Garden Grove CA 165,796
Vancouver WA 163,186
Grand Prairie TX 160,641
Peoria AZ 157,960
Rockford IL 157,272
Cape Coral FL 156,835
Springfield MO 156,206
Santa Rosa CA 155,796
Sioux Falls SD 154,997
Port St. Lucie FL 154,353
Dayton OH 154,200
Salem OR 153,435
Pomona CA 152,699
Springfield MA 150,640
Eugene OR 150,104
Corona CA 149,923
Pasadena TX 146,439
Joliet IL 146,125
Pembroke Pines FL 145,661
Paterson NJ 145,643
Hampton VA 145,494
Lancaster CA 145,469
Alexandria VA 143,885
Salinas CA 143,640
Palmdale CA 143,197
Naperville IL 143,117
Pasadena CA 143,080
Kansas City KS 142,562
Hayward CA 142,061
Hollywood FL 141,740
Lakewood CO 140,989
Torrance CA 140,820
Syracuse NY 138,068
Escondido CA 137,103
Fort Collins CO 136,509
Bridgeport CT 136,405
Orange CA 136,392
Warren MI 133,939
Elk Grove CA 133,003
Savannah GA 132,410
Mesquite TX 132,123
Sunnyvale CA 132,109
Fullerton CA 131,868
McAllen TX 129,776
Cary NC 129,545
Cedar Rapids IA 128,056
Sterling Heights MI 127,160
Columbia SC 127,029
Coral Springs FL 125,783
Carrollton TX 125,595
Elizabeth NJ 124,755
Hartford CT 124,062
Waco TX 124,009
Bellevue WA 123,771
New Haven CT 123,669
West Valley City UT 123,447
Topeka KS 123,446
Thousand Oaks CA 123,091
El Monte CA 121,791
McKinney TX 121,211
Concord CA 121,160
Visalia CA 121,040
Simi Valley CA 120,543
Olathe KS 119,993
Clarksville TN 119,735
Denton TX 119,454
Stamford CT 119,303
Provo UT 118,581
Springfield IL 117,352
Killeen TX 116,934
Abilene TX 116,484
Evansville IN 116,309
Gainesville FL 114,916
Vallejo CA 114,729
Ann Arbor MI 114,386
Peoria IL 114,114
Lansing MI 113,968
Lafayette LA 113,656
Thornton CO 113,429
Athens GA 113,398
Flint MI 112,900
Inglewood CA 112,714
Roseville CA 112,660
Charleston SC 111,978
Beaumont TX 110,553
Independence MO 110,440
Victorville CA 110,318
Santa Clara CA 110,200
Costa Mesa CA 110,080
Miami Gardens FL 109,346
Manchester NH 108,586
Miramar FL 108,484
Downey CA 107,587
Arvada CO 107,361
Allentown PA 107,250
Westminster CO 107,056
Waterbury CT 107,037
Norman OK 106,957
Midland TX 106,561
Elgin IL 106,330
West Covina CA 105,790
Clearwater FL 105,774
Cambridge MA 105,596
Pueblo CO 104,951
West Jordan UT 104,447
Round Rock TX 104,446
Billings MT 103,994
Erie PA 103,817
South Bend IN 103,807
Ventura CA 103,706
Fairfield CA 103,683
Lowell MA 103,615
Norwalk CA 102,982
Burbank CA 102,968
Richmond CA 102,285
Pompano Beach FL 101,943
High Point NC 101,835
Murfreesboro TN 101,753
Lewisville TX 101,624
Richardson TX 101,589
Daly City CA 101,514
Berkeley CA 101,371
Gresham OR 101,221
Wichita Falls TX 101,202
Green Bay WI 101,025
Davenport IA 100,827
Palm Bay FL 100,786
Columbia MO 100,733
Portsmouth VA 100,577
Rochester MN 100,413
Antioch CA 100,219
Wilmington NC 100,192
Centennial CO 99,680
Odessa TX 98,801
West Palm Beach FL 98,779
Rialto CA 98,700
Everett WA 98,212
Murrieta CA 97,918
Tyler TX 97,705
Temecula CA 97,100
Kenosha WI 96,950
Frisco TX 96,676
Sandy UT 96,660
South Gate CA 96,640
Carlsbad CA 96,374
Gary IN 95,920
Mission Viejo CA 94,461
North Charleston SC 94,407
Boulder CO 94,171
Compton CA 93,851
Hillsboro OR 93,638
Albany NY 93,539
Fargo ND 93,531
Lakeland FL 93,333
Orem UT 93,250
Brockton MA 93,007
Roanoke VA 92,967
Broken Arrow OK 92,931
Surprise AZ 92,897
Macon GA 92,775
El Cajon CA 92,718
Carson CA 92,366
Quincy MA 92,339


Limited attack...

Holy jumping jehosephat, I knew the U.S. was a big ole place but WOWEEWOW! THAT is a BUNCH of big cities,.

 

[atreides]

Seems to me that if the Soviets in a "limited" scenario bother to bomb something like Broken Arrow, OK, I don't want to know what a total scenario means. The above list adds up to 87,220,305 people with a direct hit.

 

[SergeantHeretic]

I favor limited scenarios, that is to say, perhaps five or six cities AT MOST per side with slightly more use of tactical weapons against military targets, with DC and Moskow excepted to prevent "Dead hand" activations.