AH Discussion: Marriages that could've changed history
- Thread starter GameBawesome
- Start date
Yes. Her stepmother, Empress Maria Ludovica, wanted that match (the Duke of Modena was her own brother)
Before the OTL OTP of Edward Longshanks and Eleanor of Castile, her brother Alfonso X preferred a different marriage for his sister and was stalling negotiations with the English. Alfonso wanted to marry Eleanor to the young King of Navarre, Theobald II, in order to start gaining further influence over and control of Navarre or possibly annexing it outright. Alfonso wasn't trusted by Theobald's mother and regent Margaret of Bourbon and instead had Theobald marry Isabella of France, the daughter of Louis IX.
If Alfonso was able to make that marriage happen, it butterflies the entire English royal line after Edward out of existence and would start causing butterflies in other dynasties shortly thereafter. Who does Edward marry now if Eleanor is not available?
Theobald and his OTL wife Isabella failed to have any children and Theobald was succeeded by his younger brother Henry. Eleanor gave birth to something like 15 or so kids, even if most of them died young. Odds are pretty good that she is able to give birth to an heir, who would be a vassal in all but name to Alfonso.
Alfonso, provided he foregoes trying to be elected Holy Roman Emperor, would be in a tremendous position in Spain. Portugal, Aragon, and Granada will almost certainly be very serious about making an alliance together.
If Alfonso was able to make that marriage happen, it butterflies the entire English royal line after Edward out of existence and would start causing butterflies in other dynasties shortly thereafter. Who does Edward marry now if Eleanor is not available?
Theobald and his OTL wife Isabella failed to have any children and Theobald was succeeded by his younger brother Henry. Eleanor gave birth to something like 15 or so kids, even if most of them died young. Odds are pretty good that she is able to give birth to an heir, who would be a vassal in all but name to Alfonso.
Alfonso, provided he foregoes trying to be elected Holy Roman Emperor, would be in a tremendous position in Spain. Portugal, Aragon, and Granada will almost certainly be very serious about making an alliance together.
Henry VII marrying Juana la Loca or even her cousin Joanna of Naples could have tremendously interesting butterflies.
Both could have provided him with additional Tudor heirs, with ramifications for Henry VIII's matrimonial career and subsequent Tudor/British history.
Juana married to a foreign potentate would divide Castille between her party and Fernando's, weaking el Catolico's hold on Castilian affairs and perhaps even forestalling Spanish unification.
We might even see Charles V marrying an English step-sister in Mary Tudor, and Arthur/Henry VIII marrying elsewhere as the match with Catherine would become rather useless. Leaving Catherine free to marry in Portugal or elsewhere.
Both could have provided him with additional Tudor heirs, with ramifications for Henry VIII's matrimonial career and subsequent Tudor/British history.
Juana married to a foreign potentate would divide Castille between her party and Fernando's, weaking el Catolico's hold on Castilian affairs and perhaps even forestalling Spanish unification.
We might even see Charles V marrying an English step-sister in Mary Tudor, and Arthur/Henry VIII marrying elsewhere as the match with Catherine would become rather useless. Leaving Catherine free to marry in Portugal or elsewhere.
Mary Tudor - Charles V/Eleanor-Henry VIII matches would be impossible here.
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Because as soon as Juana marries Henry VII, Henry VIII, Mary, Charles and Eleanor become full siblings under canon law. There's no way they'd get the dispensation.
True, unless all the matches happened at the same time (meaning all three weddings celebrated together). That was more doable as was done in some circumstances…
Still Joanna of Naples would be a better match for Henry VII
As I said she was sister of the Duke of Modena and wanted secure a good match for him
Manuel was able to marry the sisters Isabella and Maria of Aragon and then their niece, Eleanor of Austria. Henry VIII was able to marry Catherine of Aragon, his brother's widow. Ferdinand el Catolico was able to marry Germaine, his own great-niece. And of course, there's the famous legend - not sure how solid it is - that Henry VIII was offered a Papal dispensation allowing him to marry Mary to male relatives to the first degree, ie, even to Henry FitzRoy her half-brother.
These are all real, contemporary matches, making me think dispensations would have been well within reach of the concerned monarchs.
NOT for marrying step-siblings or step-parents to step-children (see Francis III of Brittany and Maria of Viseu OR John III of Portugal and Eleanor of Austria)…
And remember who Mary/Fitzroy dispensation, if truly was on the table, was an exceptional offer, put on the table ONLY for giving Henry something useful for stabilizing his kingdom without giving him what he had asked
None of your suggested ideas are step-siblings. Which is what we're discussing here
Did Henry III have that kind of juice with the church to get a dispensation for Edward to marry his first cousin Isabella? Their mothers were two of the four Provence sisters. Otherwise there is Constance of Aragon, the daughter of James I of Aragon; Sophia of Denmark should Henry be so inclined; Alix of Brittany, sister of Edward's OTL brother in law John II of Brittany.
Considering how devout he was, I can see it being either that he doesn’t even want to try for it or that the pope is immediately like ‘yes ok’ because Henry is a good catholic king
but honestly, I can’t see it happening - first cousin marriages really weren’t much of a thing among european royalty during the Middle Ages. Joan of Kent and the black prince caused quite a stir and they were even a generation removed.