A Giant Sucking Sound: a President Perot TL

Status
Not open for further replies.

Unknown

Talk about being prescient concerning a President Donald Trump...

OTOH, I am bothered by his choice of words around Hill Harper but, keep in mind, Ross Perot grew up in East Texas in the 1930s-1950s, so he was a product of that era, so it doesn't bother me as much as it does others (but it is still wrong)...

I wonder what people like Kamala Harris, etc. are up to ITTL...
 
LouisTheGreyFox

LouisTheGreyFox

Bookmark1995 said:
Now that we are two years into the Presidency of President Spicy Cheeto, I wanted to ask you @MaskedPickle , what kind of Governor and President did you imagine Donald Trump being, and how differently is he governing then what you expected?

You never really got into the details, but I get hints he was...kind of a Rockefeller Republican, mixed some very harsh views on criminal justice, mixed with hawkish views on foreign policy, to the point where the military locked him up for nearly creating World War III with Zhrinovsky.

Did being the governor of a large, diverse state make him less likely to indulge in his OTL bigtory, or was he forced to cloak it when the far-right nutjobs started killing so many important people.

What was ITTL Trump like, compared to OTL Trump?
Click to expand...
You know I wondered about the same thing before honestly if Trump is different in this world now. Plus I recall his vice president was an African-American guy (I forget his name it been a while since I read this TL)
 
LouisTheGreyFox

LouisTheGreyFox

Another thing I wonder is about Elon Musk in this world like does he still ends up creating SpaceX and Telsa Motors?

And I pretty much can easily see Andrew Yang being a Freedomite in this TL.
 

Bookmark1995

Banned
LouisTheGreyFox said:
You know I wondered about the same thing before honestly if Trump is different in this world now. Plus I recall his vice president was an African-American guy (I forget his name it been a while since I read this TL)
Click to expand...

Hill Harper. OTL he was an obscure actor. ITTL, he worked for Perot, became a Senator from Iowa, and later Trump's Vice President.

To me, the idea that a black man could become a Senator from lily-white Iowa would mean the America from Giant Sucking Sound is perhaps far closer to a post-racial America then OTL. I think this can be partly chalked up to the rise of an explicitly white supremacist terrorist movement.

I'm guessing if Donald Trump did the same things he did OTL, he would not have been elected a dog catcher. ITTL Millennials grew up witnessing a Presidential candidate and several Hollywood figures being blown away by white power nuts, so I'm guessing that even coded racism is political suicide as so many famous people died.

ITTL, the Freedom Party became the escape route for a lot liberal-moderate Republicans. I'm guessing that Trump molded himself into that, so he could become the Governor of New York.


LouisTheGreyFox said:
Another thing I wonder is about Elon Musk in this world like does he still ends up creating SpaceX and Telsa Motors?

And I pretty much can easily see Andrew Yang being a Freedomite in this TL.
Click to expand...

Well, Perot is ITTL credited with inventing the Internet (ITTL, he made it free and installed it into every home), so it makes sense for the Freedom Party to attract people pushing for technological solutions.
 
LouisTheGreyFox

LouisTheGreyFox

Bookmark1995 said:
Hill Harper. OTL he was an obscure actor. ITTL, he worked for Perot, became a Senator from Iowa, and later Trump's Vice President.

To me, the idea that a black man could become a Senator from lily-white Iowa would mean the America from Giant Sucking Sound is perhaps far closer to a post-racial America then OTL. I think this can be partly chalked up to the rise of an explicitly white supremacist terrorist movement.

I'm guessing if Donald Trump did the same things he did OTL, he would not have been elected a dog catcher. ITTL Millennials grew up witnessing a Presidential candidate and several Hollywood figures being blown away by white power nuts, so I'm guessing that even coded racism is political suicide as so many famous people died.

ITTL, the Freedom Party became the escape route for a lot liberal-moderate Republicans. I'm guessing that Trump molded himself into that, so he could become the Governor of New York.




Well, Perot is ITTL credited with inventing the Internet (ITTL, he made it free and installed it into every home), so it makes sense for the Freedom Party to attract people pushing for technological solutions.
Click to expand...

Plus US in this TL had a Jewish president, being Russ Feingold.
 
X_X

X_X

Terrorism being far worse than in OTL would heavily effect children's' media, especially television. I would love to visit this world to see the butterflies that laid upon the shows I adored as a kid. I certainly see cartoons like Arthur and Hey Arnold making episodes in response to things like the Aum Shinrikyo nuclear bombing, the Stromfront attacks, the Chechen nuclear genocide, etc. Basically more emphasis on teaching children about tolerance, death, and life on shows that air on children's channels.
 
Last edited:

Lalli

One thing I am wondering how StormFront's terrorist attacks and its downfall affect to extreme rightwing in America and Europe? Would such nationalist terrorism be seen as big threat as extreme Islam?
 
Anarcho-Occultist

Anarcho-Occultist

LouisTheGreyFox said:
Another thing I wonder is about Elon Musk in this world like does he still ends up creating SpaceX and Telsa Motors?

And I pretty much can easily see Andrew Yang being a Freedomite in this TL.
Click to expand...

Tesla's success in OTL has largely been made possible due to the Obama administration's support for green energy. Given the last two presidents of the United States in this timeline were Donald Trump and Jeb Bush IIRC, I'd guess there would be less of these initiatives occurring. So Tesla might've failed in this timeline. On the other hand, Elon might've realized that and gone all-in on SpaceX (although that'd be harder without building up revenue from Tesla). I think Elon might be just a semi-obscure tech billionaire in this timeline-he's rich, but not really a household name or notable for any reason beyond being rich (or maybe he's known for being a billionaire indulging in social media rants and shitposting).

I could also easily see Andrew Yang as a Freedomite in this TL. He'd be on the left side of the party, but closer to the center than some Freedomites (eg: Jello Biafra). Expanding on that, I'd predict Kirstin Gillibrand, Tulsi Gabbard, Pete Buttigieg, Bill Weld, Jeff Flake, John Kasich, Larry Hogan and Justin Amash all could be Freedomites in this timeline, Gabbard and Buttigieg being on the left and Amash being in for similar reasons as Ron Paul while the rest are part of the centrist wing of the Freedom Party.
 

Bookmark1995

Banned
LouisTheGreyFox said:
Plus US in this TL had a Jewish president, being Russ Feingold.
Click to expand...

The fact that the unabashed liberal Feingold could become President, even if it was for one term, proves how much American politics has shifted.

X_X said:
Terrorism being far worse than in OTL would heavily effect children's' media, especially television. I would love to visit this world to see the butterflies that laid upon the shows I adored as a kid. I certainly see cartoons like Arthur and Hey Arnold making episodes in response to things like the Aum Shinrikyo nuclear bombing, the Stromfront attacks, the Chechen nuclear genocide, etc. Basically more emphasis on teaching children about tolerance, death, and life on shows that air on children's channels.
Click to expand...

Consider this.

Remember that Steven Spielberg OTL was producing Warner Brothers cartoons during this time period. Tiny Toons, Animaniacs, etc.

ITTL, he was shot dead! A lot media, not just his cartoons, would play various tributes to his death. A lot of upcoming artists, on top of a young fans, have seen their idol cut down for nothing but vicious racism.

And that is on top of all the other horrific things that have occurred.

So imagine kids shows are a lot darker, and are more willing to tackle themes like racism.
 

MaskedPickle

Bookmark1995 said:
Now that we are two years into the Presidency of President Spicy Cheeto, I wanted to ask you @MaskedPickle , what kind of Governor and President did you imagine Donald Trump being, and how differently is he governing then what you expected?

You never really got into the details, but I get hints he was...kind of a Rockefeller Republican, mixed some very harsh views on criminal justice, mixed with hawkish views on foreign policy, to the point where the military locked him up for nearly creating World War III with Zhrinovsky.

Did being the governor of a large, diverse state make him less likely to indulge in his OTL bigtory, or was he forced to cloak it when the far-right nutjobs started killing so many important people.

What was ITTL Trump like, compared to OTL Trump?
Click to expand...

Well, I have had second thoughts about this TL : I imagined Donald Trump as a do-nothing Governor, leaving day-to-day business to his advisors while building a national image from his office as Governor of New York. But I had imagined what his bigotry was.

In retrospective, given Jeb Bush's poor skills, I would have had Feingold winning re-election, and maybe a Republican finally returning to the White House in 2016. Maybe with J. C. Watts, John Kasich or Marco Rubio.

As of the parties of 2016 and 2020 candidates...

Republicans - Ted Cruz, John Kasich, Jeb Bush, Mike Huckabee, Rick Santorum, Rick Perry, Scott Walker, George Pataki, Bobby Jindal
Democrats- Martin O'Malley, Pete Buttigieg, Cory Booker, Julian Castro, Kirsten Gillibrand, John Hicklenlooper, Kamala Harris, Jay Inslee, Wayne Massam, Amy Klobluchar, Beto O'Rourke
Freedomites - Ben Carson, Elizabeth Warren, Rand Paul, Chris Christie, Carly Fiorina, Lindsey Graham, Bernie Sanders, Lincoln Chafee, Lawrence Lessig, William Weld, John Delaney, Tulsi Gabbard, Marianne Williamson, Andrew Yang
 

Bookmark1995

Banned
MaskedPickle said:
Well, I have had second thoughts about this TL : I imagined Donald Trump as a do-nothing Governor, leaving day-to-day business to his advisors while building a national image from his office as Governor of New York. But I had imagined what his bigotry was.
Click to expand...

So, he would be "style over substance" type of politician, and as President, and his hawkish behavior was him trying to overcompensate for his lack of style?

In retrospective, given Jeb Bush's poor skills, I would have had Feingold winning re-election, and maybe a Republican finally returning to the White House in 2016. Maybe with J. C. Watts, John Kasich or Marco Rubio.
Click to expand...

Yay. Two-term Feingold.

I'm guessing the choice of figures like J.C. Watts or Marco Rubio is for a very calculated reason.

ITTL, the existence of the Freedom Party, which is basically a centrist party, and the decade of far-right terrorism have made the OTL Partisanship and coded bigotry of the GOP far less effective in politics. There is also the Freedomite Party having been the ones to push a balanced budget amendment.

I'm guessing most Republicans ITTL have moved closer to Bush-style "compassionate conservatism." A conservatism that is more inclusive and trades the hyperpartisan message of OTL with one that celebrates "church and family." OTL Bush's strategy allowed him to get a good amount of Hispanic votes, unlike Pete Wilson who helped break apart the California GOP with his coded attacks on the growing Hispanic community.

Hence the choices of JC Watts and Marco Rubio, in order for the Republican Party to retain its relevance.

As of the parties of 2016 and 2020 candidates...

Republicans - Ted Cruz, John Kasich, Jeb Bush, Mike Huckabee, Rick Santorum, Rick Perry, Scott Walker, George Pataki, Bobby Jindal
Democrats- Martin O'Malley, Pete Buttigieg, Cory Booker, Julian Castro, Kirsten Gillibrand, John Hicklenlooper, Kamala Harris, Jay Inslee, Wayne Massam, Amy Klobluchar, Beto O'Rourke
Freedomites - Ben Carson, Elizabeth Warren, Rand Paul, Chris Christie, Carly Fiorina, Lindsey Graham, Bernie Sanders, Lincoln Chafee, Lawrence Lessig, William Weld, John Delaney, Tulsi Gabbard, Marianne Williamson, Andrew Yang
Click to expand...

Why would Ben Carson be a Freedomite?
 
Anarcho-Occultist

Anarcho-Occultist

Bookmark1995 said:
So, he would be "style over substance" type of politician, and as President, and his hawkish behavior was him trying to overcompensate for his lack of style?



Yay. Two-term Feingold.

I'm guessing the choice of figures like J.C. Watts or Marco Rubio is for a very calculated reason.

ITTL, the existence of the Freedom Party, which is basically a centrist party, and the decade of far-right terrorism have made the OTL Partisanship and coded bigotry of the GOP far less effective in politics. There is also the Freedomite Party having been the ones to push a balanced budget amendment.

I'm guessing most Republicans ITTL have moved closer to Bush-style "compassionate conservatism." A conservatism that is more inclusive and trades the hyperpartisan message of OTL with one that celebrates "church and family." OTL Bush's strategy allowed him to get a good amount of Hispanic votes, unlike Pete Wilson who helped break apart the California GOP with his coded attacks on the growing Hispanic community.

Hence the choices of JC Watts and Marco Rubio, in order for the Republican Party to retain its relevance.



Why would Ben Carson be a Freedomite?
Click to expand...

Carson was for a time a Dem OTL. He might be drawn to a third party
 
Top
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top