Map Thread VI
- Thread starter Ian the Admin
- Start date
- Status
I don't think that the Soviets would want to split Germany into two SSR's.
I think they would, to make sure the Germans wont become too much of a force inside the SU.
Hi, I don't know if it's the right thread to post my map.
It's my first map and my first photoshop creation too, hope you like it.
Great meap for a Greater Serbia.
Greetings and salutations.
This one is from Mary Rosenblum's Sacrifice, from the "Sideways in Crime" anthology.
Due to some ATL events in medieval central Asia, butterflies flapped. The Ottoman Empire never arose, the Byzantines survived (albiet under a Bulgarian dynasty) and when Europeans arrived in the Americas, a more outward-looking Chinese dynasty than the Ming had preceded them by three quarters of a century - and had been selling the locals, among other things, guns, horses, gunpowder...
Not that it was all roses for the Amerindians - the plagues were still pretty awful (by the time the Europeans arrived, some rather careful protocols had been put in place for trading with often disease-carrying Chinese), and the more backward peoples of the eastern Americas and the Caribbean were still overwhelmed - but the Aztecs had a line of brilliant leaders, who managed to form a defensive alliance with the Inca and the Maya people which succeeded in fighting off European efforts at conquest and Chinese efforts to make puppets of them.
It is now the 1820s. The industrial revolution is well under way, and both the Germans and the British are experimenting with steam-powered vehicles (both rail and Honking Huge Iron Wheels).
The Chinese are still the world's greatest power, but their slowness in adopting European production methods and scientific ideas means they are slipping behind technologically: however, in a world where China has been the Big Dog for centuries, this has not yet sunk in either in China or Europe. China still has huge armies and perfectly adequate artillery and rifles and a huge sail navy, so it still looks mighty imposing.
Most of East Asia is Chinese vassals and colonies. India is divided into European and Chinese spheres of influence, and the Sultans of Andhra and the Deccan have so far maintained independence by playing off the outside powers against eachother: the Sikhs are less troubled by belligerent foreigners, but are having distinct trouble with an increasingly rebellious Muslim population. Central Asia is somewhat fragmented, with the largest state being a backwards "Persian" Khanate ruled from Herat by an Uzbek dynasty - it is a Sunni-majority state, the brilliant career of the Safavids having been butterflied away.
Anatolia and Iraq is ruled by a Turkish dynasty in Konya, which has managed to establish a fairly solid dynastic state: however, they have recently lost their southern Syrian provinces (often disputed between Konya and Cairo) to a rebellion fed by anger over the severe tax increases brought about by the bloody stalemate of the Caucuses War with Russia. This was aided and abetted by the French, the Most Catholic Monarch not wanting to lose a chance to establish a protectorate over the Holy Land (said protectorate is now increasingly unhappy with the French presence in the Palestine).
Russia is a backwards giant, currently feeling a bit stymied: it has succeded in consolidating its control over the Lithuanian territories, but the Polish-Hungarian monarchy is strong enough to not be easily pushed around, the Chinese lie to the east and have their own interests in Central Asia, and the last effort to "liberate" the Georgians did not go well. There are murmurrings of discontent against the Czar...
France is still ruled by the Bourbons, although some serious economic reforms of the Ancient Regime have finally been pushed through (there was an ATL version of the Revolution, but it was squashed in short order by a monarch more decisive than OTL Louis XVI). The Germanic Federation, which has evolved fairly organically from the old HRE, is loosely under the leadership of the House of Habsburg-Wettin, who rule as kings from Vienna and as Emperors from Prague. The Federation isn't coherent enough to have too much of a foreign policy, but is united enough to discourage Polish-Hunarian, Danish (the Swedes have had a hard time ATL) or French armies from marching across their territory to settle disputes.
The French, as OTL, in the name of supressing piracy have established themselves in N. Africa, which worries the neighboring sultanate of Tunis, a bustling trading state which has supressed nomadic raiding to strengthen trade ties with the Sahel (which has also benefited the ancient state of Bornu), and has led them to a close alliance with the Konya sultanate. The Egyptians, with the French in Syria, have gone so far as to make the prostrations of vassalage to China to gain the Emperor's protection (aside from a military alliance, some nominal tribute, and protection for Chinese merchants, this actually doesn't amount to any change in the actual running of Egypt): currently, annoyed by Spanish exactions, the Chinese are working on creating a canal connecting the Red and Mediterranean seas (the British never took Gibraltar in this world, and the Spanish have established themselves as effective gate-keepers of the Med).
Spain ended up with a much more modest American Empire (even after really sticking it to the Portuguese), with Caribee and Selvascalientes being profitable but not particularly popular-to-live-in slaves and tropical products colonies: only in the more temperate climates of New Spain has there been substantial Spanish settlement (enough, by now, to support two different independence movements). Spain, having missed out on the poisoned treasure of the Habsburg inheritance jackpot and the ruinous inflow (and outflow) of American treasure, is in rather better shape economically than OTL 1820s, and although not quite a power of the first rank, isn't considered a "extension of Africa" either by other Europeans.
Africa is in fact doing a bit better than OTL 1820s, with more and larger coherent kingdoms, partially because of Chinese influence filtering in from the east coast, partially because of a smaller slave trade (for one thing, the Spanish put an end to theirs a while back: a Christian-minded Spanish monarch decided to give planters in the Caribbean and south America incentive for NOT WORKING THEIR SLAVES TO DEATH FASTER THAN THEY CAN REPRODUCE by cutting off the trade).
Parliament won out over kings as OTL in England, but with quite different casts of characters on both sides of the Atlantic, more equitable arrangements were agreed on, and, so far, New Brittania remains part of the Empire. (Having stronger and better armed native American states on the western border may have helped contribute to this amicable outcome).
The native states of the North American interior, of which the Sioux-dominated confederation of the northern plains is the most important, have learned writing from the Aztecs, ideas on political organization from the Aztecs and the Chinese, and receive a lot of trade guns: neither the Aztecs or the Chinese really want to have the pushy, bellicose British as neighbors. A major worry is the French coming to an agreement to divide up the region with the British, although historical hostility has so far prevented such an outcome.
The Three Peoples Alliance is headed by the Aztecs, although theoretically a league of equals. Like the Chinese, they are slipping behind in science and technology: unlike the Chinese, their leadership is aware of this and taking vigorous steps to improve local education and develop industries. While the Inca (who have, influenced by Christianity, moved their worship of Inti-Virachocha to something a lot closer to monotheism) have dropped human sacrifice, and the Mayas don't do it much anymore (ritual self-mutilation remains popular), the Aztecs still make a big thing of it, although nowadays the practice is reserved for criminals, traitors, and volunteers (the preferred category). Interestingly, this makes the Aztec legal system rather fairer than ours, since judges are under considerable pressure to assign the death penalty to the great and powerful - after all, the Gods would much prefer, say, a famous sports star
as a sacrifice, than some crackhead mugger...
Bruce
This one is from Mary Rosenblum's Sacrifice, from the "Sideways in Crime" anthology.
Due to some ATL events in medieval central Asia, butterflies flapped. The Ottoman Empire never arose, the Byzantines survived (albiet under a Bulgarian dynasty) and when Europeans arrived in the Americas, a more outward-looking Chinese dynasty than the Ming had preceded them by three quarters of a century - and had been selling the locals, among other things, guns, horses, gunpowder...
Not that it was all roses for the Amerindians - the plagues were still pretty awful (by the time the Europeans arrived, some rather careful protocols had been put in place for trading with often disease-carrying Chinese), and the more backward peoples of the eastern Americas and the Caribbean were still overwhelmed - but the Aztecs had a line of brilliant leaders, who managed to form a defensive alliance with the Inca and the Maya people which succeeded in fighting off European efforts at conquest and Chinese efforts to make puppets of them.
It is now the 1820s. The industrial revolution is well under way, and both the Germans and the British are experimenting with steam-powered vehicles (both rail and Honking Huge Iron Wheels).
The Chinese are still the world's greatest power, but their slowness in adopting European production methods and scientific ideas means they are slipping behind technologically: however, in a world where China has been the Big Dog for centuries, this has not yet sunk in either in China or Europe. China still has huge armies and perfectly adequate artillery and rifles and a huge sail navy, so it still looks mighty imposing.
Most of East Asia is Chinese vassals and colonies. India is divided into European and Chinese spheres of influence, and the Sultans of Andhra and the Deccan have so far maintained independence by playing off the outside powers against eachother: the Sikhs are less troubled by belligerent foreigners, but are having distinct trouble with an increasingly rebellious Muslim population. Central Asia is somewhat fragmented, with the largest state being a backwards "Persian" Khanate ruled from Herat by an Uzbek dynasty - it is a Sunni-majority state, the brilliant career of the Safavids having been butterflied away.
Anatolia and Iraq is ruled by a Turkish dynasty in Konya, which has managed to establish a fairly solid dynastic state: however, they have recently lost their southern Syrian provinces (often disputed between Konya and Cairo) to a rebellion fed by anger over the severe tax increases brought about by the bloody stalemate of the Caucuses War with Russia. This was aided and abetted by the French, the Most Catholic Monarch not wanting to lose a chance to establish a protectorate over the Holy Land (said protectorate is now increasingly unhappy with the French presence in the Palestine).
Russia is a backwards giant, currently feeling a bit stymied: it has succeded in consolidating its control over the Lithuanian territories, but the Polish-Hungarian monarchy is strong enough to not be easily pushed around, the Chinese lie to the east and have their own interests in Central Asia, and the last effort to "liberate" the Georgians did not go well. There are murmurrings of discontent against the Czar...
France is still ruled by the Bourbons, although some serious economic reforms of the Ancient Regime have finally been pushed through (there was an ATL version of the Revolution, but it was squashed in short order by a monarch more decisive than OTL Louis XVI). The Germanic Federation, which has evolved fairly organically from the old HRE, is loosely under the leadership of the House of Habsburg-Wettin, who rule as kings from Vienna and as Emperors from Prague. The Federation isn't coherent enough to have too much of a foreign policy, but is united enough to discourage Polish-Hunarian, Danish (the Swedes have had a hard time ATL) or French armies from marching across their territory to settle disputes.
The French, as OTL, in the name of supressing piracy have established themselves in N. Africa, which worries the neighboring sultanate of Tunis, a bustling trading state which has supressed nomadic raiding to strengthen trade ties with the Sahel (which has also benefited the ancient state of Bornu), and has led them to a close alliance with the Konya sultanate. The Egyptians, with the French in Syria, have gone so far as to make the prostrations of vassalage to China to gain the Emperor's protection (aside from a military alliance, some nominal tribute, and protection for Chinese merchants, this actually doesn't amount to any change in the actual running of Egypt): currently, annoyed by Spanish exactions, the Chinese are working on creating a canal connecting the Red and Mediterranean seas (the British never took Gibraltar in this world, and the Spanish have established themselves as effective gate-keepers of the Med).
Spain ended up with a much more modest American Empire (even after really sticking it to the Portuguese), with Caribee and Selvascalientes being profitable but not particularly popular-to-live-in slaves and tropical products colonies: only in the more temperate climates of New Spain has there been substantial Spanish settlement (enough, by now, to support two different independence movements). Spain, having missed out on the poisoned treasure of the Habsburg inheritance jackpot and the ruinous inflow (and outflow) of American treasure, is in rather better shape economically than OTL 1820s, and although not quite a power of the first rank, isn't considered a "extension of Africa" either by other Europeans.
Africa is in fact doing a bit better than OTL 1820s, with more and larger coherent kingdoms, partially because of Chinese influence filtering in from the east coast, partially because of a smaller slave trade (for one thing, the Spanish put an end to theirs a while back: a Christian-minded Spanish monarch decided to give planters in the Caribbean and south America incentive for NOT WORKING THEIR SLAVES TO DEATH FASTER THAN THEY CAN REPRODUCE by cutting off the trade).
Parliament won out over kings as OTL in England, but with quite different casts of characters on both sides of the Atlantic, more equitable arrangements were agreed on, and, so far, New Brittania remains part of the Empire. (Having stronger and better armed native American states on the western border may have helped contribute to this amicable outcome).
The native states of the North American interior, of which the Sioux-dominated confederation of the northern plains is the most important, have learned writing from the Aztecs, ideas on political organization from the Aztecs and the Chinese, and receive a lot of trade guns: neither the Aztecs or the Chinese really want to have the pushy, bellicose British as neighbors. A major worry is the French coming to an agreement to divide up the region with the British, although historical hostility has so far prevented such an outcome.
The Three Peoples Alliance is headed by the Aztecs, although theoretically a league of equals. Like the Chinese, they are slipping behind in science and technology: unlike the Chinese, their leadership is aware of this and taking vigorous steps to improve local education and develop industries. While the Inca (who have, influenced by Christianity, moved their worship of Inti-Virachocha to something a lot closer to monotheism) have dropped human sacrifice, and the Mayas don't do it much anymore (ritual self-mutilation remains popular), the Aztecs still make a big thing of it, although nowadays the practice is reserved for criminals, traitors, and volunteers (the preferred category). Interestingly, this makes the Aztec legal system rather fairer than ours, since judges are under considerable pressure to assign the death penalty to the great and powerful - after all, the Gods would much prefer, say, a famous sports star
as a sacrifice, than some crackhead mugger... Bruce
*blink* *blink*
*looks at the name of the Green territory in Europe*
*goes to sharpen knives*
Hey, hey. Take it up with Mary Rosenblum, not me...
Bruce
*blink* *blink*
*looks at the name of the Green territory in Europe*
*goes to sharpen knives*
You know, Susano, it's called Alternate History. When the POD is before the discovery of the Americas, you wouldn't think it is inconceivable for Germanic to refer to solely Germany.
That's to indicate the somewhat uncertain nature of borders where organized state rule fades out into tribal areas, jungles, nomad stomping grounds...
Bruce
Susano
Banned
No, it just isnt. That would require a PoD before the creation of Germany. The words are after all completly different in German, which is what many Anglophones dont seem to grasp!
But I missed that this wasnt Bruces invention, so I guess hes off the hook
No, it just isnt. That would require a PoD before the creation of Germany. The words are after all completly different in German, which is what many Anglophones dont seem to grasp!
But I missed that this wasnt Bruces invention, so I guess hes off the hook
This is an English message board, we are speaking English, and if the Anglophones of an ATL use Germanic to refer to Germany than that is the way it is. We already say Germany when you say Deutschland, why is it so ASB that we could be using a slightly different incorrect terminology?
- Status