Railroad thread
- Thread starter Duke Andrew of Dank
- Start date
At any rate, I had some ideas for a Lima-themed museum in Lima, OH later in my TL, any ideas are welcome:
- PRR K4 #5399: Modified by Lima in 1939
- A B&A Berkshire
- A SP GS engine
- PRR K4 #5399: Modified by Lima in 1939
- A B&A Berkshire
- A SP GS engine
Another idea I had concerns the Indiana Railroad network.
Specifically, during the 1920s the railroad tries to convert itself into a primarily freight line. With the mainline being from Ft. Wayne to Louisville via Muncie and Indianapolis. At Indy, a new line to Evansville via Bloomington and Terre Hautte is also present.
Eventually, said line becomes part of my TL's Erie Lackawanna.
Specifically, during the 1920s the railroad tries to convert itself into a primarily freight line. With the mainline being from Ft. Wayne to Louisville via Muncie and Indianapolis. At Indy, a new line to Evansville via Bloomington and Terre Hautte is also present.
Eventually, said line becomes part of my TL's Erie Lackawanna.
Now for some more possible rail details in my TL:
1941-1950
- Many of the same engine design restrictions as OTL come in. So Lima responds by creating a "standards" fleet made from upgraded versions of their engine designs for the C&O.
- As Erie Lackawanna was formed earlier than OTL, they operate many Lima Standard types.
Any other ideas for wartime railroads are welcome.
1941-1950
- Many of the same engine design restrictions as OTL come in. So Lima responds by creating a "standards" fleet made from upgraded versions of their engine designs for the C&O.
- As Erie Lackawanna was formed earlier than OTL, they operate many Lima Standard types.
Any other ideas for wartime railroads are welcome.
here is my idea for how a proposal to revise the Ripley Plan in 1919 would work out.
June 3, 1919
Washington D.C.
William Z. Ripley sat in a room with numerous railroad executives from across the country. All were intent on one issue: the plan of mass-consolidation.
The railroads had recently recieved copies of the proposals, and immediately went up in arms. There was instantly discussion by the railroads, who had themselves given their own opinions on who they would prefer to be merged with. Everyone had something to complain about. One of the most vocal complainers was the Pennsylvania Railroad, who insisted on keeping the Norfolk & Western. Likewise, the Southern Pacific and Santa Fe complained about the Frisco-Rock Island idea. As SP wanted the latter and ATSF wanted the former as ways to expand their respective territories.
After the first day of talks, Ripley took a long drink of water.
"Perhaps they are right." he thought to himself. "There should be some sort of regional competition plan."
Ripley looked at his map again. The Hill Roads, with the Colorado & Southern, had a route down into Texas. If the Frisco or Katy roads went to them, it would create a better link. To placate the Milwaukee Road, the new plan could give them the Missouri Pacific. Ripley spent several hours going through all the possibilities, beaming with pride as more and more puzzle pieces came together. Soon, he was done and strode out of his office.
"They're sure to accept most of this at least." he thought hopefully.
June 3, 1919
Washington D.C.
William Z. Ripley sat in a room with numerous railroad executives from across the country. All were intent on one issue: the plan of mass-consolidation.
The railroads had recently recieved copies of the proposals, and immediately went up in arms. There was instantly discussion by the railroads, who had themselves given their own opinions on who they would prefer to be merged with. Everyone had something to complain about. One of the most vocal complainers was the Pennsylvania Railroad, who insisted on keeping the Norfolk & Western. Likewise, the Southern Pacific and Santa Fe complained about the Frisco-Rock Island idea. As SP wanted the latter and ATSF wanted the former as ways to expand their respective territories.
After the first day of talks, Ripley took a long drink of water.
"Perhaps they are right." he thought to himself. "There should be some sort of regional competition plan."
Ripley looked at his map again. The Hill Roads, with the Colorado & Southern, had a route down into Texas. If the Frisco or Katy roads went to them, it would create a better link. To placate the Milwaukee Road, the new plan could give them the Missouri Pacific. Ripley spent several hours going through all the possibilities, beaming with pride as more and more puzzle pieces came together. Soon, he was done and strode out of his office.
"They're sure to accept most of this at least." he thought hopefully.
Well, there's what would be my third post if the rebooted TL is made.
Any further ideas or critiques are genuinely welcome.
Any further ideas or critiques are genuinely welcome.
I originally shared this thread with just @WaterproofPotatoes. But I chose to add thise Trainorders thread and American-Rail's Frisco articles.
Especially since they explain why I am so convinced ATSF+SLSF could work.
https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,118804
https://www.american-rails.com/frisco.html
Especially since they explain why I am so convinced ATSF+SLSF could work.
https://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?1,118804
https://www.american-rails.com/frisco.html
Let's also bring up some ideas for foreign railroads. Namely, British Rail Standards that didn't exist IOTL.
My ideas included:
- 6MT Class 4-6-0: Based on the LMS Jubilees.
- 8MT Class 2-8-4T: Essentially a Standard-esque 8F built as a tank engine.
- 9MT Class 4-8-2: Based loosely on Gresley's proposed LNER 4-8-2
- 10F Class 2-10-0: An upgraded 9F with LDP innovations.
My ideas included:
- 6MT Class 4-6-0: Based on the LMS Jubilees.
- 8MT Class 2-8-4T: Essentially a Standard-esque 8F built as a tank engine.
- 9MT Class 4-8-2: Based loosely on Gresley's proposed LNER 4-8-2
- 10F Class 2-10-0: An upgraded 9F with LDP innovations.
I read those links, and that is not the conclusion I reached. The Trainorders thread is mostly old-timers reminiscing about the pre-BNSF Santa Fe, and the american-rails thread tells the story of a small railroad flirting with bankruptcy most of its life, before briefly finding a niche market moving goods to the Gulf Coast, which the Santa Fe, by and large, was not involved in. Then, BN bought out the Frisco for what trackage they needed and sold off the rest.
While I don't know why this is so important to you, what I do know is that you said that nothing can convince you not have it happen. I feel like you want someone to write the particulars of that merger for you. That someone is not me. I'm really not interested in discussing it any further.
On another subject, I thought of another idea for preserved steam:
Southern PS-4 Pacific #1398 is preserved at the NCTM in Salisbury. Eventually displacing 4501 as the main star of the Steam Excursions Program ITTL.
Meanwhile, the Chessie of my TL and EL merge to create a bigger C&O. The B&O is spun off as it regains independence, and takes up the Reading and CNJ. Plus a Western Maryland line to connect themselves better with the two.
Rio Grande meanwhile takes up the Western Pacific, and enters merger talks with Missouri Pacific and Rock Island. However, the former is bought up by the Milwaukee Road alongside the CNW.
Southern PS-4 Pacific #1398 is preserved at the NCTM in Salisbury. Eventually displacing 4501 as the main star of the Steam Excursions Program ITTL.
Meanwhile, the Chessie of my TL and EL merge to create a bigger C&O. The B&O is spun off as it regains independence, and takes up the Reading and CNJ. Plus a Western Maryland line to connect themselves better with the two.
Rio Grande meanwhile takes up the Western Pacific, and enters merger talks with Missouri Pacific and Rock Island. However, the former is bought up by the Milwaukee Road alongside the CNW.
To help us get away from treaded waters, a new topic could be what I was thinking could be done with the Rio Grande narrow gauge. Helped by @TheMann and @Lucas.
Basically, I could see the tourist potential of the narrow gauge being founded earlier than OTL. With plenty of Hollywood studios coming out to film Westerns and other films on the area around their lines.
Of course, the DRG realizes the need to upgrade freight where possible to keep the line further afloat. That new chance comes with the rise of natural gas in the 1950s and 60s. With a crude oil plant in Farmington, NM formed. The DRG NG soon is equipped with diesels and new freight cars to handle the natural gas boom. Transporting it from the largely isolated areas of New Mexico and Colorado.
Eventually, further freight traffic returns in the 1970s with another plant being built in Durango. As well as the DRG having most of its revenue freights run by diesels, with steam mostly relegated to the tourist trains.
Further down the line, ALCO and the DRG create a 3ft version of the Swiss Glacier Express. Which is a bonafide success with its excellent services.
Basically, I could see the tourist potential of the narrow gauge being founded earlier than OTL. With plenty of Hollywood studios coming out to film Westerns and other films on the area around their lines.
Of course, the DRG realizes the need to upgrade freight where possible to keep the line further afloat. That new chance comes with the rise of natural gas in the 1950s and 60s. With a crude oil plant in Farmington, NM formed. The DRG NG soon is equipped with diesels and new freight cars to handle the natural gas boom. Transporting it from the largely isolated areas of New Mexico and Colorado.
Eventually, further freight traffic returns in the 1970s with another plant being built in Durango. As well as the DRG having most of its revenue freights run by diesels, with steam mostly relegated to the tourist trains.
Further down the line, ALCO and the DRG create a 3ft version of the Swiss Glacier Express. Which is a bonafide success with its excellent services.
I'm thinking maybe I should just write another idea for a Teddy Roosevelt 3rd TL. Perhaps then I could get further ideas regarding railroads in not just the US but the world.
1941-1950
- Wartime requirement prevent entirely new designs. Leading to Lima attempting to sell various standardized designs based on their C&O locomotive designs.
- Every locomotive possible is given a new job. Large steamers are placed on freights, fast engines on troop trains, and smaller engines in the yards and as helpers.
- Many people with autism are sadly unable to fight in the war. Though many are able to instead work on the railroads. Which also helps fuel autism awareness in the post-war years.
- After the war, the railroad are worn out, and often look for ways to restrengthen itself.
- The Marshall Aid Plan comes dangerously even closer to WW3. So the Truman administration makes a plan to have every transportation sector up to snuff in case it happens again.
- Railroads under this new plan would use government support primarily to strengthen their physical infrastructure first. Steam is naturally phased out, though in some western parts of the railroad, electrics replace them and not diesels.
- Wartime requirement prevent entirely new designs. Leading to Lima attempting to sell various standardized designs based on their C&O locomotive designs.
- Every locomotive possible is given a new job. Large steamers are placed on freights, fast engines on troop trains, and smaller engines in the yards and as helpers.
- Many people with autism are sadly unable to fight in the war. Though many are able to instead work on the railroads. Which also helps fuel autism awareness in the post-war years.
- After the war, the railroad are worn out, and often look for ways to restrengthen itself.
- The Marshall Aid Plan comes dangerously even closer to WW3. So the Truman administration makes a plan to have every transportation sector up to snuff in case it happens again.
- Railroads under this new plan would use government support primarily to strengthen their physical infrastructure first. Steam is naturally phased out, though in some western parts of the railroad, electrics replace them and not diesels.
This is one that especially appeals to me due to me being on the higher functioning end.
In the meantime, I am contributing some RR ideas for the More Perfect Union TL by @HeX. I suggest you check the TL out as it is.
https://www.alternatehistory.com/fo...rnate-history-of-the-land-of-the-free.468109/
https://www.alternatehistory.com/fo...rnate-history-of-the-land-of-the-free.468109/
Here are some locomotives ideas I will likely use in the revised TL if I didn't use it in the original TL:
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/top-locomotives-never-built.454388/
https://www.alternatehistory.com/forum/threads/top-locomotives-never-built.454388/
@Andrew Boyd
I Have been make some ideas for Southern Pacific and Pacific Electric in my Timeline, i will shared for you take some ideas, since i see your latest updates are from SP
During the New Deal program of President Roosevelt, many works occur along the US infrastructure systems. On railroads side, on West Coast, the Southern Pacific came if project of new mainline link L.A. to San Francisco and Sacramento, and extended the L.A. – San Diego Air Line. This route became the Ventura Corridor express mainline, use part of San Joaquin Valley Line and based on Boston & Western mainline Northeast Corridor on Eastern Megapolis.
egin the construction in 1933, the route are entire complete just before WW2 in 1939, and make one of great engineering projects at the time. On Bay Area, the new massive Bay Terminal Station based on Bauhaus style are built on South Park, on site of old Transbay Terminal from Key System and became the main station for Southern Pacific, Union Pacific, A.T.S.F. and for the Key System, together if a new link of Key over the recently-built Golden Gate bridge.
The Ventura Corridor are built in a very modern standart, as trains could run up to 180 kph by late 40s, have concrete ties, C.T.C. and electric sinalization. As way to compete if Union Pacific City of San Francisco and A.T.S.F. Streamliners, the Southern Pacific launch a new higher speed DMUs DSL-30 use on introduce California Vista link San Diego – L.A. and San Francisco, as together if existing Daylight that pass to use the corridor. The trainsets are built in cooperation if GE, Pullman and ALCO.
After WW2, the Southern Pacific pass to electrific the entire Coast Division and bought 40 units EP-300 from GE, later know as "Little Joes". 20 units receive the daylight scheme and the rest pass to use the Black Window scheme.
By 1954, Southern Pacific upgrade the routes L.A. - Phoenix - El Passo / Sacramento - Ogden / Sacramento - Portland and introduce they higher speed DMUs DXP trainsets on them. These lines are now entire duplicated, if bypass for freights and passenger and permit speeds of 200 kph, make intercity travel common.
- Another plans i have been thinking are
- ACL, Missouri Pacific and Seaboard introduce higher speed turbine trainsets by late 50s (OTL UAC Turbotrain from 70s, but if minor modifications);
- Union Pacific goes ahead if GTEL units until 70s and bought a new generation of GTEL-IV;
- City of NYC, P.R.R., New York Central begin the building of a new Hudson 4x tracks tunnel link direct over Pennsylvania Station and Grand Central and goes back to NEC. Building between 60s and 70s;
- Milwaukee Road introduce in 1964 a higher speed trainset on Hiawatha service between Chicago and Minneapolis, and use part of Lake Shore lines.
- By 50s and 60s, mostly of passenger traffic on american roads became by the streamliners or higher speed DMUs or EMUs between main cities.
And here´s a link from my fictional Boston & Western Timeline i have been make for sometime.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YmeCH5ZZilCNprT-dLzzMtKonDS3MuIS/view?usp=sharing
@Andrew Boyd, i have make some ACE Modern Steamers in some paint schemes. Did you have planning use them on your TL?
I Have been make some ideas for Southern Pacific and Pacific Electric in my Timeline, i will shared for you take some ideas, since i see your latest updates are from SP
During the New Deal program of President Roosevelt, many works occur along the US infrastructure systems. On railroads side, on West Coast, the Southern Pacific came if project of new mainline link L.A. to San Francisco and Sacramento, and extended the L.A. – San Diego Air Line. This route became the Ventura Corridor express mainline, use part of San Joaquin Valley Line and based on Boston & Western mainline Northeast Corridor on Eastern Megapolis.
egin the construction in 1933, the route are entire complete just before WW2 in 1939, and make one of great engineering projects at the time. On Bay Area, the new massive Bay Terminal Station based on Bauhaus style are built on South Park, on site of old Transbay Terminal from Key System and became the main station for Southern Pacific, Union Pacific, A.T.S.F. and for the Key System, together if a new link of Key over the recently-built Golden Gate bridge.
The Ventura Corridor are built in a very modern standart, as trains could run up to 180 kph by late 40s, have concrete ties, C.T.C. and electric sinalization. As way to compete if Union Pacific City of San Francisco and A.T.S.F. Streamliners, the Southern Pacific launch a new higher speed DMUs DSL-30 use on introduce California Vista link San Diego – L.A. and San Francisco, as together if existing Daylight that pass to use the corridor. The trainsets are built in cooperation if GE, Pullman and ALCO.
After WW2, the Southern Pacific pass to electrific the entire Coast Division and bought 40 units EP-300 from GE, later know as "Little Joes". 20 units receive the daylight scheme and the rest pass to use the Black Window scheme.
By 1954, Southern Pacific upgrade the routes L.A. - Phoenix - El Passo / Sacramento - Ogden / Sacramento - Portland and introduce they higher speed DMUs DXP trainsets on them. These lines are now entire duplicated, if bypass for freights and passenger and permit speeds of 200 kph, make intercity travel common.
- Another plans i have been thinking are
- ACL, Missouri Pacific and Seaboard introduce higher speed turbine trainsets by late 50s (OTL UAC Turbotrain from 70s, but if minor modifications);
- Union Pacific goes ahead if GTEL units until 70s and bought a new generation of GTEL-IV;
- City of NYC, P.R.R., New York Central begin the building of a new Hudson 4x tracks tunnel link direct over Pennsylvania Station and Grand Central and goes back to NEC. Building between 60s and 70s;
- Milwaukee Road introduce in 1964 a higher speed trainset on Hiawatha service between Chicago and Minneapolis, and use part of Lake Shore lines.
- By 50s and 60s, mostly of passenger traffic on american roads became by the streamliners or higher speed DMUs or EMUs between main cities.
And here´s a link from my fictional Boston & Western Timeline i have been make for sometime.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1YmeCH5ZZilCNprT-dLzzMtKonDS3MuIS/view?usp=sharing
@Andrew Boyd, i have make some ACE Modern Steamers in some paint schemes. Did you have planning use them on your TL?
@Lucas
Thank you. Depending on what happens, Ill either re-start the original TL with that update. Or I could save it for use if I make a new TL beginning in the 1910s.
Thank you. Depending on what happens, Ill either re-start the original TL with that update. Or I could save it for use if I make a new TL beginning in the 1910s.
For people take a look, some drawings i have make that could help for some visualization as alternative trainsets
ACE-5000 Santa Fe
Amtrak DXP-55 Higher Speed Diesel power (Imagine what a BR HST 125 would be if make by US).
DXP-55 D&RGW
DXP-55 IC
DXP-55 A.T.S.F.
DSL-30 Milwaukee Road
DSL-30 Southern Pacific
Littel Joe IC
Turbotrain in ACL
GTEL Southern
GTEL D&RGW
ACE-5000 Santa Fe
Amtrak DXP-55 Higher Speed Diesel power (Imagine what a BR HST 125 would be if make by US).
DXP-55 D&RGW
DXP-55 IC
DXP-55 A.T.S.F.
DSL-30 Milwaukee Road
DSL-30 Southern Pacific
Littel Joe IC
Turbotrain in ACL
GTEL Southern
GTEL D&RGW