WI: Harsher Treaty of Versailles, independent East Prussia?

[fasquardon]

But people in Germany don't want to their country to be dismembered, there were two types of nationalism in Germany and most Germans would fall into one of those schools (1848-style liberal unification and militarist Prussian-style unification)

Well 1) that's what happens when you lose wars - people make you do things you don't want to. 2) Some Germans did want to break Germany up - as far as I know only in Bavaria did secessionists have anything like serious numbers though.

Most Germans wanted to keep Germany together, but have more independence for their region within the Reich. Making it more of a loose federation than a Prussian tool.

fasquardon

 

[Raunchel]

The problem is that you can say that they should be different countries, but especially if you install a democratic government, these German states will converge towards reunification again. And then you have to start over. Splitting countries without the people wanting it is really difficult.

 

[Hashoosh]

Well 1) that's what happens when you lose wars - people make you do things you don't want to. 2) Some Germans did want to break Germany up - as far as I know only in Bavaria did secessionists have anything like serious numbers though.

Most Germans wanted to keep Germany together, but have more independence for their region within the Reich. Making it more of a loose federation than a Prussian tool.

fasquardon

They could certainly try, but the divisions would be artificial (except MAYBE for Bavaria, but even then I'm doubtful) and as soon as anyone stops enforcing the peace (as happened OTL with Rhineland) they'll just re-unify again. Only something on the level of North Korea, which is AFAIK the only case of a nation-state actually being successfully split into two artificial constructs, could succeed. And North Korea probably couldn't happen in Germany.

 

[oreocruncher]

They could certainly try, but the divisions would be artificial (except MAYBE for Bavaria, but even then I'm doubtful) and as soon as anyone stops enforcing the peace (as happened OTL with Rhineland) they'll just re-unify again. Only something on the level of North Korea, which is AFAIK the only case of a nation-state actually being successfully split into two artificial constructs, could succeed. And North Korea probably couldn't happen in Germany.

As I read somewhere, the basis with Korea is that the Koreans are more loyal to their race than to their country...

 

[deathscompanion1]

There was some support for succession in Bavaria. This could be encouraged by the occupying allies as they spend a decade ensuring that their puppets don't get lynched in the streets and then watch it all get undone about twenty seconds after the last foreign soldier leaves.

 

[yulzari]

How long before East Prussia votes for reunification with Germany? Then you have a scenario where Poland moves into East Prussia to out a stop to it and you can build a scenario from there. An early German war with Poland? What would the Soviet Union do? I don't see France going to war with Germany to stop them stopping Polish aggression. there is room for a massive AH here.