A Tale of Vietnam: The Dragon and the Phoenix Mk 2

For my readers do you have any requests from what you would like to see i.e. more scene building such as greater background information on the political and economic scene?

Alternatively do you want to plunge into the first Laotian emergency and then add in a political or economic filler later on?
 
Don't you think you under estimate the will of the French to be involve in independent Vietnam? The French need, for the sake of their Empire, to show that they with a good deal politically and economically. The Colonial lobby is very strong and a government which doesn't take this in account will fall in the hour.


First, France need to be reassure that his nationals (between 50 and 100 000) won't be just expropriates (especially without compensation).

Second, France need cheap raw materials for the reconstruction of the country. Commercial deals might be a good idea.

Third, France still considers itself a global power and so want to keep some political influence in the region. So the French can propose that some civilian and military advisors to the new state, but no materials.

Fourth, i think the ITTL Vietnam pass to quickly from an "French colony" to an "US protectorate". It will come but not that quick : the French can't compete with the US in the long term. With a Communist China and the Korean War, Vietnam can only come closer to the US. This "competition" can only be a good thing for Vietnam and will give them more choices, at least before 1950.

Last but not least, it's a great time line. Easy to read and great story.

PS : sorry about my bad english.
 
First of all welcome to the site and thank you for commenting on my TL. I have responded to your post, as there may be more people that have similar questions.

Don't you think you under estimate the will of the French to be involve in independent Vietnam? The French need, for the sake of their Empire, to show that they with a good deal politically and economically. The Colonial lobby is very strong and a government which doesn't take this in account will fall in the hour.
France wants to maintain their influence / involvement with the now independent Vietnam, however the VNQDD consciously attempts to limit their involvement in the new state. Accordingly there may be some face saving projects that I will need to consider (open to suggestions here), but as a whole the majority of the French are quick to exit. In the future there are several French-Vietnamese projects such as a High – Speed rail network.

Like several post war governments Vietnam is initially wary of accepting FDI because of the inherent risks to their independence. So in the immediate post WW 2 era you have a government that relies on taxation receipts to fund their programs.

The Laotian and Cambodian governments have stronger ties with France compared to Vietnam as per OTL.

First, France need to be reassure that his nationals (between 50 and 100 000) won't be just expropriates (especially without compensation
Second, France need cheap raw materials for the reconstruction of the country. Commercial deals might be a good idea.

Third, France still considers itself a global power and so want to keep some political influence in the region. So the French can propose that some civilian and military advisors to the new state, but no materials.

That is a good idea about the commercial deals and one that I will explore further. As discussed above, the Vietnamese are not going to sell the fruits of their independence cheaply. If a French company wishes to sign a commercial agreement then there are restrictions attached such as establishing infrastructure and expanding schools.

However, a point I haven't expanded on and intend to is one of the first Acts of parliament legislated by the VNQDD the ‘Vietnamese Citizenship Act.’ The Act limits citizenship to ethnic Vietnamese, Khmer, Lao, Cham, Hmong, Chinese and Eurasians. The second part of the Act limits land ownership to citizens of Vietnam and if you are not a proscribed person than you cannot be a citizen and as such you cannot own land.

So this means that a foreign national (read French) cannot own land directly, they may hold up to a 50% interest in a Vietnamese company that owns land. The Act is implemented one year after independence, which encourages agreements to be made by either forming companies or realising the land. In the event the land is not realised or a company not formed, than the property defaults to the government.

The joint venture if formed, then provides leases to the tenant farmers, whom have the option of purchasing their interest after five years either individually or in a cooperative. Particularly in the north of Vietnam around the Red River delta there is a tradition of communal farming so forming a cooperative works. It would also allow greater availability to credit which is important when we begin to industrialise agriculture from the 1950’s onwards.

The Vietnamese land holders particularly in Cochin china are provided with the option of purchasing a license for a specific light industry. The cost of the license is reduced by the value of their landholdings they have surrendered to the tenant farmers. The landholders in the South are unhappy, but after several examples have been made then they acquiesce fairly rapidly.

Fourth, i think the ITTL Vietnam pass to quickly from an "French colony" to an "US protectorate". It will come but not that quick : the French can't compete with the US in the long term. With a Communist China and the Korean War, Vietnam can only come closer to the US. This "competition" can only be a good thing for Vietnam and will give them more choices, at least before 1950.

What you have from 1945 to 1949 is a government that is focused internally on land reform, addressing domestic unrest, balancing a budget and repairing a devastated country. Overall VNQDD Vietnam at this stage is closer to Nationalist China than the Americans or the French. There is certainly US and French influence but their biggest influence is Nationalist China. A great comparison would be Burma from OTL post 1946. As it becomes apparent the Nationalist Chinese are on the wane, they strengthen their ties with the West as a whole.
 
Chapter 11: Foreign Investment
Foreign Investment


After independence the Kingdom of Vietnam lacked entrepreneurs, bankers and businessmen. The decision to allow restricted foreign investment was to produce dividends for the country. As the education standards were quite low, investment was focused on consumer and industrial goods such as textiles, cement, glass and paper.

It was the spur of the economic crisis of 1948 that prompted a greater amount of government involvement in the economy. The Vietnamese name for the government role in the economy was huong dan or ‘to guide’, and was based on the French policy of Dirigisme. The actual concept was inspired by Nguyen van Thien a French trained economist who had retained close relationship with the French bureaucracy. These ideas were suggested by the newly created Ministry of Economy Development and Trade (MEDT). Through the support of patrons such as the Rockefeller Institute, MEDT attracted such luminaries as Peter Drucker and William Deming to review their industrial policy and to conduct an annual lecture at the Saigon Business School.

Huong Dan in its practical form meant smaller companies in key industries were urged to merge and create larger companies that could become competitive on an international level. Several leading economic scholars have suggested the Vietnamese model inspired the Berkley Mafia under the Suharto government and later industrialisation in Malaysia.

MEDT also induced certain public and private corporations to respond to mandated government reforms. This meant using various incentives such as tax holidays and government subsidies to expand key industries. An example of this was the expansion of light industry within Vietnam, which was used to subsidise land reform. Absentee landlords had two options: they were allowed a tax loss equal to the value of the land acquired over a twenty year period or they were provided a manufacturing license in textiles, cement, or glass. Those landlords that accepted were provided access to low interest loans, with the ability to have their interest capitalised or to have a repayment holiday of one year after construction had been completed.

Tarrifs were established by the Government, which contributed to a economic development fund earmarked to provide subsidies to companies in key industries. An example of this would be if a project was deemed to be in the national interest the company would be provided a tax holiday for two years after construction had completed. This provision was contingent upon due diligence checks being conducted and construction indicators being met. If they were not met then the government reverted to the original plan of only the interest of the loan being eligible for a tax holiday.
 
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Maybe I overlooked it somehow . . . But did this situation with Vietnam have any effect on the Korean War? Like, at all?
 
Maybe I overlooked it somehow . . . But did this situation with Vietnam have any effect on the Korean War? Like, at all?

For the sake of my sanity at the moment - no. But I have looked at various scenarios involving Communist China invading TTL's Vietnam in 1949 (They can exceptionally close in OTL). Now if this occured does Dear Leader still attack South Korea in 1950 and if the war proceeds as per OTL can the Chinese be involved in two conflicts simultaneously? Can the U.S. defend South Korea if they are involved in Vietnam at the same time and how does that impact on the Berlin Airlift? There are several reasons why China shouldn't invade, the first being the poor logistical state of Southern China at that time and the terrain both armies would be fighting in. For all of these scenarios I am happy to receive thoughts on.

At the moment I have implemented a butterfly net around Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos and Thailand to make things easier for myself.

In answer to your question Vietnam provides a battalion of soldiers to fight in Korea in TTL and deploys several vessels to participate in the maritime operations.

I hope that has answered your question.
 
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A Vietnamese timeline? This is interesting! I subscribed!

By the way, will you include the media history (broadcasting included) of Vietnam in this timeline?
 
By the way, will you include the media history (broadcasting included) of Vietnam in this timeline?

Media isn't my forte, I do however have a brief passage about the Ao Dai and its popularity due to the popularity of V - Pop. So if you have any more ideas in relation to media / cinema history, happy to hear them.
 
Media isn't my forte, I do however have a brief passage about the Ao Dai and its popularity due to the popularity of V - Pop. So if you have any more ideas in relation to media / cinema history, happy to hear them.
I'm thinking of an early introduction of television in Vietnam (either 1961-62, four to five years earlier than in OTL South Vietnam), which is owned by the Vietnamese Broadcasting Corporation, with studios in Hanoi and Saigon...

By the way, is Hue still the capital of Vietnam in this TL? Is quoc ngu is the official script of the Vietnamese language in this TL? (Because I'm thinking of its co-official status with a standardized chu nom, by the way)
 
I'm thinking of an early introduction of television in Vietnam (either 1961-62, four to five years earlier than in OTL South Vietnam), which is owned by the Vietnamese Broadcasting Corporation, with studios in Hanoi and Saigon...

By the way, is Hue still the capital of Vietnam in this TL? Is quoc ngu is the official script of the Vietnamese language in this TL? (Because I'm thinking of its co-official status with a standardized chu nom, by the way)

Excellent points about chu nom and quoc ngu btw... Honestly chu nom still being used would make sense particularly with the Chinese influence on the Vietnamese in TTL. My only query would be how to integrate the two into daily use... my thoughts are that it would be similar to how the OTL PRC has approached characters and pinyin.

Having television with a VBC would be interesting... I am already have a rough idea about a national soccer competition - the V League. That may play an important path to creating an early market for television.

Hue remaining as a capital has a certain elegance to me as it allows both Saigon and Hanoi to develop their own characters independent of being a capital.
 
Excellent points about chu nom and quoc ngu btw... Honestly chu nom still being used would make sense particularly with the Chinese influence on the Vietnamese in TTL. My only query would be how to integrate the two into daily use... my thoughts are that it would be similar to how the OTL PRC has approached characters and pinyin.
Hmmm.... Well, here's my idea, at least in television; the public broadcaster will use standardized chu nom, while commercial stations will use quoc ngu.

Hue remaining as a capital has a certain elegance to me as it allows both Saigon and Hanoi to develop their own characters independent of being a capital.
And Hue being the general headquarters of the Vietnamese Broadcasting Corporation
 
Hmmm.... Well, here's my idea, at least in television; the public broadcaster will use standardized chu nom, while commercial stations will use quoc ngu.

This is intriguing so... the State owning the VBC and the commercial channels being owned by those that perhaps still have French leanings?

How would that impact upon schooling?
 
So I am back after finding my muse.

I have my final professional accreditation exam for the year soon, however I am planning my next update and wanted to know if there were any requests?

Would my readers be interested in a post about a junior paratrooper officer and the Parachute Regiment's first drop into Laos? Alternatively continue with my historical piece about the continued evolution of Vietnam's political and economic structure? I am also considering a sports post regarding a professional football league.
 
Chapter 12: The Laotian Quagmire
The Laotian quagmire

7:16 a.m. over Eastern Laos, 4 November 1958

Thieu Uy (Second Lieutenant) Le Hung of the Vietnamese Airborne Regiment looked out of the Royal Vietnamese Air Force DC-3 and saw that the air was clear with stray shafts of sunlight gilding the paddy fields below, with scattered tiny figures littering the fields. Smoke from the myriad of village fires rose vertically, which he quietly gave a blessings that at least today for his unit there no heavy crosswinds over the drop zone today.

He looked down the fuselage at his platoon and envied the ability of his subordinates to lightly doze or to chat with their comrades. In contrast, he was attempting to remember his objectives and to commit the small map to memory. The paratroopers of the Airborne Regiment wore American helmets and webbing, and most still had a Model 43 submachine gun or Duck strapped to their thigh rather than the M – 1 carbine.

His reverie was rudely interrupted by the order to ‘Stand up and Hook up.’ Figures lurched against each other, snapping the spring hooks of their webbing static lines over the cable running down the fuselage roof and jerking to make sure they were secure.

‘Equipment check!’ Each man focused on the parachute pack of the man in front, particularly the static line attachment. The red light flicked on and an icy blast accompanied by a deafening noise through an open cargo door went through the fuselage. 2LT Le stood in the doorway and composed himself waiting for the green light. The green light buzzed and simultaneously he was slapped on the shoulder by the jumper master, reacting on instinct he pushed himself out of the door and into the blue sky.

One one thousand

Two one thousand

Three one thousand

Four one thousand

Five one thousand

With a physical jolt his parachute deployed and he looked at the other canopies covering the morning sky. Now where was the form up point again…

Background:

The Vietnamese government had watched with trepidation as the precarious balancing act between the Neutralist, Pathet Lao and the Royalist faction had been destroyed with the untimely death of the Neutralist Prime Minister. Without his guiding personality the Neutralist faction disintegrated with their members joining either the Pathet Lao or the Royalists. At this moment the Laotian civil war was inevitable, it was waiting for the right cause, which was to occur with the Royalist Leader Prince Boun Oum recognising the looming conflict withdrew from the capital and unilaterally declared Champasak to be an independent state. The basis for his declaration was due to the increasing amounts of Communist Chinese advisors and although initially greeted with skepticism by many in the West, recent releases from the Chinese Politburo indicate that there was truth to his claim. Unfortunately he overestimated the ability of his forces and the estimates provided by the Vietnamese and Thai ‘advisers’ was that the Kingdom of Champasak would not survive without foreign intervention.

The Vietnamese General Staff had war gamed a similar situation several months earlier when a Laotian Civil War had emerged as a possibility. Vietnam did not relish a Chinese proxy state on their long porous border with Laos and the possibility of another safe area for the Viet Cong guerillas. Accordingly, the confluence of events was right for Vietnamese incursion. Their intervention was predicated on two goals the first to stop the Communist advance and the second to stabilise the front. Their recommendation was to intervene in the dry season to facilitate their advance due to lower temperatures and with rainfall. The logistical hub for the Vietnamese advance was a smaller output located at Khe Sanh the main arm would thrust into Lao Bao, Ban Dong with the Airborne Regiment used to secure the bridges at Xepon. The operation was dubbed ‘Gio Dong’ or ‘Eastern Wind.’ Ultimately the planning for ‘Gio Dong’ was assisted by American advisors, who also provided access to additional jump support with C – 119 Boxcars in concert with the venerable DC – 3.

For the most part the Gio Dong stabilized the southern kingdom and was largely achieved without bloodshed with the exception of the C Company 3rd Airborne Battalion at Xepon.

Xepon, Laos 4 November 1958

Charlie Company (C Coy) of the 3rd Airborne Battalion moved towards Xepon in a classic ‘two up, one back’ formation with 8 and 9 platoons leading and 7 platoon in support. As C Coy moved through the valley they were observed from the Pathet Lao force in the village and came under heavy machine gun fire and briefly indirect fire from mortars. Without any organic indirect fire support the OC of the Company Major Trinh launched an immediate attack.

8 platoon moved into a fire support position with 9 platoon performing a right hand flanking attack into the village with 7 platoon in support. The maneuver element then struck headlong into the Pathet Lao fighting positions and promptly stalled, due to the excellent layout and camouflage of the fighting positions.

The Platoon Commander of 9 Platoon 2LT Le identifying that he needed to keep the attack moving, crawled through the withering enemy fire and towards the fighting positions. He crawled up to the lip of the fighting position and threw a grenade. Afterwards the grenade exploded, he then personally led the attack on the remaining fighting positions. By 16:45 the village of Xepon and the bridges were in Vietnamese hands. During the fighting they had captured several prisoners to their horror, they realised one of the Pathet Lao officers was Chinese.

The following day C Coy was attacked by three T-34 tanks, one was incapacitated with a sticky bomb and at which stage the other two withdrew. The attack into fortified positions and the T-34 atack illustrated the need for organic fire support to be available for any Airborne operation. The Battle of Xepon is still celebrated in the Airborne regiment today.
 
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