WI: A Third Hittite Empire is established.

Tom_B said:
Judaism (by whatever name) still has their Temple so their development is going to be very different going forward.

That is very true. One interesting consideration is that the likely results of such changes probably guarantee that Yahwism never becomes a major world religion. The continued existence of the Temple will likely mean that Hebrews continue to consider Yahwism to be their NATIONAL religion, not a religion for the world at large. You almost certainly won't have Hebrew missionaries out there converting tribes like the Khazars (from which most of European Jewry probably arose in OTL) or the Himyarites in Arabia (which means possibly no Islam). Yahwism remains localized in Israel, and never becomes a world religion.
 
G.Bone said:
Thanks for answering my questions.

You're welcome. :)

G.Bone said:
More questions:

1) Have there been some people from Sicily immigrate to Uticia?

Probably. I would imagine that the Romans were not light-handed when they took over Sicily and that there would have been refugees fleeing from Sicily as a result. Probably some of those ended up in Hellas and Hatti as well.

G.Bone said:
2) Does Uticia accept them or was their relations tenous at best?

I would imagine they probably accept them...perhaps they recruit them as mercenaries into the Utican army. That would fit in with the old Carthaginian pattern.

G.Bone said:
3) How powerful were the court officials in the Chinese court?

Very. Indeed, by the end of the Han Dynasty, Emperors were being chosen by the eunuchs and court bureaucrats...who were choosing young, underage boys who could be controlled.

G.Bone said:
4) How come the map shows China united rather than the broken mess that it is at the end of the installment?

Because Han China is still united as of 200 AD. It is in the process of fragmenting, but the various warlords, as of this time, still pay homage to the Han Emperor and recognize his authority. This won't last much longer, of course.

G.Bone said:
5) Is Constantinople area/region heavily fortified with the Romans in Greek Territory?

The city of Byzantium probably is fortified, and I imagine the Romans are using it as a major naval base.

G.Bone said:
6) Has there been any efforts on a long range artillery thing to make use of the nearness of the Greek territory to Hittite territory? Has the Crimea turned into a Hittie lake?

Well, gunpowder hasn't been discovered, so there is not much potential for development of "long range artillery" at this time. Development of siege engines (catapaults, ballistas, etc.) has probably proceeded along the lines of OTL. As for the seas around the Crimea, they definitely are under Hittite control. As for the Black Sea as a whole, there is a rough balance of power between Rome and Hatti.

G.Bone said:
7) Is Constantinople the "new" capital of the Hittite Empire?

Byzantium (it's not Constantinople in this timeline) is under the control of Rome. So no, its not the Hittite capital. Azatiwataya and Hattusas are the two primary capitals of the Hittite Empire.
 
moaaa?

Wait a minute...Rome controls Byzantium? When did this happen? Doesn't this put a crimp :D in Hittite plans? Wouldn't that result in that region being heavily militarized? If Byzantium is gone, where is the naval focus within that region located?
 
G.Bone said:
Wait a minute...Rome controls Byzantium? When did this happen? Doesn't this put a crimp :D in Hittite plans? Wouldn't that result in that region being heavily militarized? If Byzantium is gone, where is the naval focus within that region located?

Byzantium is on the European shore of the Bosphorus. The Hittites occupy the Asian shore of the Bosphorus. Rome has controlled the European shore since the Macedonian wars of the Second Century, BC. I would assume the Hittites have naval bases at a port or ports on the Asian shore of the Bosphorus, but I don't know what it or they are called.

The Hittites have never held Byzantium, with the exception of a brief time in the 5th Century BC during the Graeco-Hittite War. So the fact the Romans have it is not putting much a of crimp in their plans.
 
DominusNovus said:
The Hittites probably have Troy, so its all good.

That's very possible...although Troy isn't actually on the Bosphorus itself like Byzantium is. Troy was actually on the Dardanelles...
 
It's me Phaeton

Hey Robert, It me Phaeton....I had to register a new account becausr I could log back on with my old one. Anyways...good to see it back up and running, again and great job on the latest installment. Keep it comming
 
You toy with me, G. Bone! Phaeton/Historico posting means its probably just a bump. But you, you ask questions! You don't bump!

I'd pester Robert, too, but people might start asking about the Roman Timeli-
hmmm...

Get back to work, Rob! :cool:

Damn, I'm slick.
 
THE THIRD HITTITE EMPIRE, 200-300 AD

c. 200 AD onward--The various clans (uje) of Japan are beginning to unite into small
states. Beginning of the process which will lead to a unified Japan.

c. 200 AD onward--Economic crisis in the Roman Empire. In the Third Century A.D.,
the Roman Empire begins to experience an economic crisis which will have dramatic
effects on the empire’s future. Although the development of the governmental system of
the Republic, where civilian Dictators instead of military Emperors hold sway, has
resulted in somewhat wiser economic policies...such as the gradual reduction of slavery
as the basis for labor within the empire...the Dictators and Senate have not, for the most
part, been markedly better at managing the economy of the empire than the OTL
emperors. Many of the factors which lead, in OTL, to the beginnings of decline of the
Roman Empire in the Third Century A.D. are still present in this timeline, and in some
cases, worse than in OTL. Financially, Rome is in a worse position than in OTL, as they
never acquired the rich provinces of Asia Minor, Egypt, and the Levant which, in OTL,
provided much of the tax base of the empire. Also, the Hittites are controlling the trade
in silks, pepper, frankincense, myrrh, and other exotic products from China, India, and
Arabia, and Rome’s trade deficit is thus even greater than in OTL. Heavy
taxation...necessary to fund the large Roman military establishment...has forced men of
commerce to hoard their money rather than invest it. To pay soldiers, the Dictators have
debased the money, and government has began paying its debts in money that it does not
accept from citizens as payment of taxes. Prices skyrocket as a result, forcing much of the
middle class into bankruptcy and even beggary. Much of the agricultural land is unused,
as the families which own the land are forced to abandon their farms, and cities and
towns begin shrinking as the people there begin migrating into the rural countryside in
search of food. In some cases, these displaced people form into roaming bands of
brigands, which leads to another important development...the beginnings of what would
be called feudalism in OTL...as owners of large agricultural estates threatened by roving
bands of brigands protect themselves by fortification and by raising their own private
armies, and their neighbors surrender their holdings to them in exchange for protection.

200-300 AD--Religious Developments. At this point, a brief discussion of religious
development up to this time is in order.
--Development of Christianity. Christianity is continuing to grow in Rome, Hatti, and
Parthia (and later Persia). The church is not as well organized as in OTL to stamp out
heresy, however, and distinct variations of Christianity are thriving in the various regions
(the Hittite empire itself is home to three...one based in Palestine and Egypt, one in
Anatolia, and one in Mesopotamia). Disagreements about things such as the nature of
Christ (was he human, was he divine, or a combination of the two), the nature of the
Trinity (all manifestations of one entity, or three separate entities?), and other major
issues divide the various churches from one another. In addition, there are major
differences in the liturgy of the various churches, the type of baptism performed, and even
which books of the New Testament are considered to be canonical.
--Zoroastrianism: Has continued much as in OTL, but has been limited in large part to
Persia itself. The Parthians have been half-supporters of the faith, but have also been
promoting Mithraism.
--Mithraism: Mithraism has spread from Parthia into the Hittite and Roman Empires,
where it has gained many followers and is a major competitor of Christianity.
--Hinduism and Buddhism: Hinduism remains extremely intolerant of other religions in
this timeline, a legacy of the attempted suppression of Hinduism by the Zoroastrian
Persians several hundred years ago. When the apostle Thomas went to India in 52 AD,
for example, he was almost immediately murdered by an angry Hindu mob and
Christianity never gained a foothold there as a result. Buddhism, although promoted by
some kings such as the Mauryan Emperor Ashoka and the various emperors of the
Kushans, has remained a very small and embattled sect in India. Buddhism has, however,
gained many converts outside of India, in places like southeast Asia, Ceylon, China, and
of course, among the Kushans.
--Yahwism: The national faith of the Hebrews continues to be practiced by the Children
of Israel in Palestine. Small communities of Hebrews also live outside of Palestine, and
they practice their faith in those distant lands. But Yahwism is very much looked on as
the Covenant between God and the Hebrews...and not as a faith that can be inclusive of
foreigners (Gentiles). The local religious authorities in Palestine are much more powerful
than in OTL, and they quickly stamp out all dissent from the theological “party line.†In
part this is because the Hebrew Temple in Jerusalem, unlike in OTL, has not been
destroyed. Partly because of the retention of northern Israelite influence on the religion,
in the ATL Yahwism, unlike it’s offshoot, Christianity, does not deny the existence of
other gods...it simply declares that Hebrews are not to worship any other gods save
Yahweh.
--Other religions: The Hittite, Egyptian, and Babylonian religions are still being practiced
in their own homelands. At least one major religion...Manichaeism...has never gotten
started because it’s founder, Mani, was never born in this timeline. The Graeco-Roman
pantheon is still worshipped around the Mediterranean, as is the Phoenician/Canaanite
pantheon (primarily in the lands governed by Utica and in the original Phoenician
homeland ruled by the Hittite Empire). Celtic and Germanic tribal religions in lands
under Roman rule are gradually fading into obscurity as these lands are increasingly
Romanized. However, Germanic religion still survives in Scandinavia and Celtic religion
survives in northern Britain and Ireland.

203 AD--Death of King Hantili IV of Hatti. He is succeeded by Tuwanuwa VI.
Tuwanuwa is a relatively strong king, and under his rule Hatti will prosper. He will have
a mainly peaceful reign, and will conduct numerous public works projects throughout his
realm. Among the most magnificent of these are huge aqueducts to bring mountain water
to many of the cities of the realm. He also expands on the royal library at Hattusas,
increasing it’s importance as a center of learning.

205 AD--Sextus Quintilius Rufinius is elected to a second term as Dictator of Rome.

208 AD--The Battle of Red Cliffs is fought in China. Three powerful warlords...Cao
Cao, Liu Bei, and Sun Kwan...have pretty much defeated their rivals and are fighting for
supremacy in the country (while still nominally acknowledging the overlordship of the
Han Emperor, Hsien Ti). Cao Cao has the largest army and fleet, but is defeated by the
use of fire ships by the allied fleets of Liu Bei and Sun Kwan. Cao Cao does not succeed
in uniting the country under his own rule.

211 AD--Having reached his statutory limit of two terms, Sextus Quintilius Rufinius
steps down as Roman Dictator. The Senate selects Titus Claudius Severus as his
successor. Severus will be an active Dictator, and will conduct campaigns against
raiding Germanic and Celtic pirates from Scandinavia and Ireland. No permanent
conquests will be added to the empire as a result of these campaigns, however.

213 AD--Death of Kushan Emperor Vasudeva. At his death, the empire is divided into
eastern and western halves. Emperor Kanishka III rules the eastern empire from the city
of Mathura in northern India.

217 AD--Titus Claudius Severus does not run for a second term as Roman Dictator. The
Senate selects Gaius Octavius Suetrius as his successor. Suetrius will continue his
predecessor’s campaigning in the north.

220 AD--Beginning of the Three Kingdoms Period in China. In the aftermath of the
Battle of Red Cliffs, three feudal states....Shu Han in the southwest, Wei in the north, and
Wu in the southeast...have gradually formed within the Han Chinese Empire. Up until
now, the warlords in control of these states have nominally acknowledged the authority of
the Han Emperor, but in this year the last Han Emperor, Hsien Ti, abdicates his throne,
ending the Han Dynasty. Shu, Wei, and Wu assume full independence. Liu Bei, who is
distantly related to the old Han Dynasty, rules in Shu under the name Chao-lieh Ti; Cao
Pei, son of Cao Cao who was defeated at the Battle of Red Cliffs and himself a former
general under the Emperor Hsien Ti, rules in Wei under the name of Wen Ti; and Sun
Kwan, another former Han general, rules in Wu under the name of Wu Ti. In terms of
manpower, Wei is by far the strongest, retaining more than 660,000 households and
4,400,000 people within its borders. Shu has a population of 940,000, and Wu 2,300,000.
Thus, Wei has more than 58% of the population and around 40% of territory. With these
resources, it is estimated that it could raise an army of 400,000 whilst Shu and Wu could
manage 100,000 and 230,000 respectively: roughly 10% of their registered populations.
The kingdoms of Wu and Shu will, within a few years, form an alliance against Wei that
will prove itself to be a militarily stable configuration, and the basic borders of the Three
Kingdoms will be almost unchanging for more than forty years.

223 AD--Gaius Octavius Suetrius is re-elected to a second term as Roman Dictator. In
this year, the Roman Senate passes legislation abolishing slavery. It is the first major
power in the world to do so.

224 AD--Rebellion in Persis. One of the Persian noble houses, the House of Sassa, rebels
against the rule of the Parthian Neo-Arsacid Dynasty. King Orodes II of Parthia is killed
in battle with the forces of the Sassanian King Ardashir I. Ardashir claims the imperial
throne shortly afterward, and the Neo-Arsacid Dynasty comes to an end. He is a devout
Zoroastrian, and immediately declares Zoroastrianism to be the official State religion.
Under his sponsorship, the collection of Zoroastrian texts known as the Zend Avesta will
be assembled.

225 AD--Death of King Tuwanuwa VI of Hatti. He is succeeded by Tuwanuwa VII.
Tuwanuwa VII will prove a weak king, and will rule shakily on his throne for fifteen
years. Meanwhile, various factions are positioning themselves for the inevitable power
struggle when he dies...

227-250 AD--Wars of the Sassanian Persian kings Ardashir I and Shapur I against the
Kushans. The Persians, taking advantage of temporary Hittite weakness, gradually
conquer most of the Western Kushan Empire. The strongly Zoroastrian Persian kings
begin suppressing Buddhism in those regions.

229 AD--Since Gaius Octavius Suetrius is not eligible to run for another turn, the Roman
Senate selects Appius Claudius Julianus as his successor. Appius Claudius Julianus will
be remembered because he initiates the Second Great Persecution of Christianity in
Rome.

230-235 AD--The Second Great Persecution of Christianity--Alarmed by the growing
influence of Christianity within the Roman Empire, which is rapidly gaining converts as
disaffected people are spurred by the growing economic crisis to seek comfort in religions
that promise them well-being (as Christianity does), Roman Dictator Appius Claudius
Julianus pushes through the Roman Senate a law outlawing Christianity and making
annual sacrifice to the official Roman deities a requirement of citizenship in the Roman
Empire. Julianus justifies this by claiming (falsely) that the Christians are engaging in
cannibalism (a perverted interpretation of the rite of communion) and that they are
responsible for the economic decline of the empire. Once again, Christians are rounded
up in large numbers and imprisoned, tortured, and killed in many imaginative ways, but,
as before, the faith emerges stronger and gains more converts despite the persecution.

c. 230 AD onward--Shift of power in the state of Wei as rivalry between the royal family
(Cao clan) and the powerful Sima clan erupts. By the end of the 230s, the Sima family
will displace the Cao family as the de facto rulers of Wei, even though the Cao family
still technically holds the throne.

232 AD--Emperor Kanishka III of the eastern Kushan Empire dies, and is succeeded by
Vasishka II.

235 AD--Increasing disgust at the persecution of Christians by Appius Claudius Julianus
leads to his defeat in his bid for a second term as Roman Dictator. Instead, the Senate
selects Gnaeus Cornelius Paternus as his successor. Paternus immediately pushes through
a bill to rescind the anti-Christian act of Julianus, removing the requirement of sacrifice
to the Olympian gods as a condition of citizenship and ending the persecutions. End of
the Second Great Persecution of Christianity.

239 AD--First recorded visit by a Japanese envoy to China.

240 AD-249 AD--Death of King Tuwanuwa VII of Hatti. Beginning of a period of civil
war as Tuwanuwa’s sons, Anitta and Warpalawa, vie for the throne. Anitta sets himself
up at Hattusas and declares himself to be Anitta IV, Great King of Hatti. Meanwhile, his
brother sets himself up at Damascus and declares that he is Warpalawa IV, Great King of
Hatti. The war which rages between them is very destructive, and does not end when
Anitta is killed in battle in 245 AD. Anitta’s faction instead rallies around Prince
Wasuruma, who is a scion of the old royal family of the city of Kanesh who is also related
to the current imperial family from Azatiwataya. Wasuruma finally defeats and kills
Warpalawa IV at the Battle of Aleppo in 249 AD. Warpalawa’s faction is completely
destroyed, and Wasuruma is acclaimed as the new Great King of Hatti, founding a new st
Hittite Dynasty, the first of a family from a city other than Azatiwataya.

241 AD--Gnaeus Cornelius Paternus is re-elected to a second term as Roman Dictator.
Also in this year, Shah Ardashir I of Persia dies, and is succeeded by Shapur I.

241-245 AD--Dictator Gnaeus Cornelius Paternus of Rome takes advantage of
opportunity provided by the civil war raging in Hatti to invade Hellas and Utica. Despite
valiant resistance by both, without Hittite support, Roman armies conquer Hellas and
Utica by 245 AD, incorporating both into the Roman Empire.

244 AD--The Chinese kingdom of Wei conquers the Kingdom of Koguryo in Korea.

245-255 AD--The Great Plague ravages the Roman Empire. In 245 AD, Roman soldiers,
returning from the campaign against Utica, bring back with them a mysterious malady
which rapidly spreads along the excellent Roman road system and leaves thousands dead
in cities throughout the empire. As much as 1/10 of the entire population of the Roman
empire perishes in this first outbreak. Repeated outbreaks of the plague will occur again
over the next ten years, but will be much less severe than the first outbreak. When all is
said and done, the Roman population has been reduced by 1/6 from where it stood in 245
AD. Labor shortages caused by the Plague will accelerate the economic crisis within the
Roman Empire.

Neighboring states and peoples like the Hittite Empire will also be affected, but to a much
lesser degree, by the Great Plague.

246 AD--Emperor Vasishka II of the Eastern Kushan Empire dies and is succeeded by
Vasudeva II.

247 AD--Roman Dictator Gnaeus Cornelius Paternus is not eligible for re-election, so the
Senate selects Marcus Acilius Aviola as his successor.

253 AD--Marcus Acilius Aviola is re-elected to a second term as Roman Dictator.

255-260 AD--War between Hatti and Persia. In 255 AD, King Shapur I of Persia invades
Mesopotamia. A series of bloody see-saw campaigns which will consume the next five
years results. Finally, in 260 AD, Shapur’s forces completely defeat the main Hittite
army outside of the city of Nippur. King Wasuruma I of Hatti barely escapes capture, and
sues for peace soon afterward. The war has been very exhausting for Shapur as well, and
he agrees. Hatti cedes all of Mesopotamia and Elymais to Persia.

256 AD--Emperor Vasudeva II of the Eastern Kushan Empire dies and is succeeded by
Kanishka IV.

259 AD--Marcus Acilius Aviola is not eligible for re-election as Roman Dictator, so the
Senate selects Licinius Naevius Aquilinus as his successor.

263 AD--In China, the kingdom of Wei conquers the Shu Han kingdom.

264-271 AD--Revolts in Egypt, Kush, and Axum. Sensing the weakness of the Hittite
regime after the devastating war with Persia, and secretly financed by Rome, rebellions
break out in Egypt, Kush, and Axum. The Hittite garrisons are thrown out, and King
Wasuruma I is unable to restore Hittite rule. Indeed, Wasuruma himself will be killed in
271 AD while campaigning in Egypt.

264 AD--A new native Dynasty establishes itself in Egypt, the 27th Dynasty. The
Dynasty is based in Thebes, under the rule of Pharaoh Nekhtnebef I.

265 AD--Licinius Naevius Aquilinus does not seek re-election as Roman Dictator. The
Senate selects Publius Licinius Valerianus as his successor. Valerianus tries to arrest the
growth of semi-feudal statelets within the empire by passage of laws forbidding private
individuals from raising their own military forces, but given the continuing economic
decline in Rome, he does not have the military power to fully enforce these laws. In
China, Sima Yan, head of the powerful Sima family, deposes the last of the kings of the
Cao family, the Emperor Yuan Ti of Wei, and usurps the throne of Wei. He establishes a
new dynasty, the Tsin Dynasty, and reigns under the name of Wu Ti.

c. 270 AD--Hindu resentment at rule by the Buddhist Kushan Emperors has been
growing, and at this time a coalition of native princes under the leadership of Prince Sri
Gupta of Magadha defeats and kills Emperor Kanishka IV and expels the Kushans from
the entire region of the Gangetic Plain. Fall of the Eastern Kushan Empire. However, the
victorious coalition soon falls to fighting among itself, and no new empire immediately
establishes itself in northern India.

271 AD--Death of King Wasuruma I of Hatti in battle against Egyptian rebels. He is
succeeded by his son, who reigns as Wasuruma II. Wasuruma II recognizes the
independence of Egypt, Kush, and Hatti. Also in this year, Publius Licinius Valerianus is
re-elected to a second term as Dictator of Rome. Also in this year, the magnetic compass
is invented in China.

271-301 AD--Period of dynastic struggle in Persia. In 271 AD, King Shapur I of Persia
dies. At his death, civil war in Persia begins as his sons, Hormizd and Bahram, each
declare themselves to be the new Shah of Persia. This will continue for the next 30 years,
preventing the Sassanids from engaging in military adventurism outside their own
borders.

272 AD--Roman Dictator Publius Licinius Valerianus orders an invasion of the Egyptian
province of Cyrenacia. The Romans defeat the Egyptian garrison and capture the region.

273 AD--Bahram I defeats the forces of Hormizd I to become the sole Shah of Persia.
Hormizd is captured and executed.

276 AD--Bahram I, Shah of Persia, dies. He is murdered by his son, Bahram II, who
takes the throne for himself. Bahram will spend most of his reign putting down revolts
within his own empire, and will be too occupied to engage in military activity outside his
own borders. Also in this year, Pharaoh Nekhtnebef I of Egypt dies, and is succeeded by
his son, who reigns as Pharaoh Nefaarud I.
.
277 AD--Since Publius Licinius Valerianus is ineligible to run for another term as Roman
Dictator, the Senate selects Titus Pomponius Bassus as his successor. Bassus will try to
restore Rome’s economic fortunes by an old method...military conquest. Roman armies
will advance northward in Britain and will also land in Ireland, bringing those regions
under Roman rule. But unfortunately, these are relatively poor regions, and their
conquest does little to improve the economic standing of Rome.

280 AD--Emperor Wu Ti of Wei conquers the Kingdom of Wu. All of China is once
again united under the Tsin Dynasty. It will be only a temporary situation, however. Also
in this year, attacks by the Sarmatians force King Wasuruma II of Hatti to abandon the
Greek cities of the Crimea.

283 AD--Tiberius Pomponius Bassus is defeated in his bid for a second term as Roman
Dictator. The Senate selects Junius Verius Lupus as his successor.

285-291 AD--Roman Dictator Junius Verius Lupus sends troops to annex the Crimean
Greek cities which have been recently abandoned by Hatti. Roman forces also conquer a
large area of the region known today as the Ukraine, subduing the turbulent Sarmatian
peoples who live there.

287 AD--Death of King Wasuruma II of Hatti. He is succeeded by Hili I. Unlike his two
rather undistinguished predecessors, Hili is a strong and militarily gifted king, who comes
at a critical time in Hittite history.

289 AD--Junius Verius Lupus is re-elected to a second term as Roman Dictator. He
begins making plans for war with Hatti.

290 AD--Shah Bahram II of Persia persecutes Christians in the Persian Empire.

291-306 AD--War of the Eight Princes in China. Upon the death of Tsin Dynasty
Emperor Wu Ti (Sima Yan), civil war breaks out between eight princes of the imperial
Sima family...some sons of Emperor Wu Ti, others from more distantly related branches
of the family. The war will be devastating, and will leave China’s borders open to
renewed attacks by the Hsiung Nu and other nomadic, non-Chinese tribes from the north
(collectively known as the Wu Hu tribes).

292-298 AD--War between Rome and Hatti. In 292 AD, Roman Dictator Junius Verius
Lupus declares war on the Hittite Empire. However, his expectations of an easy victory
over the much-weakened Hittite Empire prove to be ill-founded. Rome’s own military
power has been greatly reduced over the course of this century by the continuing
economic crisis, and the brilliant King Hili I of Hatti proves to be a very troublesome
opponent. The Hittite fleet virtually annihilates the Roman fleet in the Aegean, which
allows Hili to take an invading force into the Balkans. Meanwhile, strong Hittite
defenses in the Caucasus region prevent a Roman invasion from the Ukrainian regions
which they occupy. Hili is aided by popular revolts in many of the Greek cities, who look
on Hili as a potential liberator from oppressive Roman rule. Hili skillfully defeats every
Roman army sent against him, and liberates much of Macedonia, Epirus, and Hellas from
Roman rule. When Dictator Lupus steps down in 295 AD, his successor will seek to end
the war. A peace treaty is finally signed in 298 AD in which Rome is forced to relinquish
control of the Greek cities, which are formed into an alliance of city-states aligned with
Hatti. Hatti itself occupies Thrace. Macedonia and Epirus remain Roman provinces.

293 AD--Shah Bahram II of Persia dies, and is succeeded by his son, Bahram III.
However, Bahram III is soon murdered by a general named Narses...who is also a
member of the royal family...who usurps the throne. Narses, like his predecessors, is soon
involved in more dynastic infighting, and so in unable to intervene in the Romano-Hittite
War.

295 AD--Junius Verius Lupus is ineligible to run for another term as Roman Dictator, so
the Senate selects Gaius Annius Anullinus as his successor.

298-330--The recent defeat in the war with Hatti has caused much political turmoil in the
Roman Empire. Rebellions break out in many regions as powerful, semi-feudal local
lords rise up and attempt to shake off the rule of the Roman central government. This
period of instability in Rome will last for over 30 years, and Rome will be much changed
by the chaos which results.

c. 300 AD--The Kidarites, also known as the Red Huns, begin moving southwest from
their former homes in the region of Mongolia. They will soon come into contact with the
northern frontiers of the Sassanian and Kushan Empires. The Kushans will not survive.

hittitemap17.gif
 
Dear Sweet Bejesus!

It is alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Questions:

To pay soldiers, the Dictators have
debased the money, and government has began paying its debts in money that it does not accept from citizens as payment of taxes

-> So they borrow money from other avenues? Could you clarify this for me?

Warpalawa’s faction is completely
destroyed, and Wasuruma is acclaimed as the new Great King of Hatti, founding a new start of a Hittite Dynasty, the first of a family from a city other than Azatiwataya

-> At this point of history, are there major cities that are "Hittite" in culture and history? With the release of Egypt and the other regions, has these cities that are traditionally Hittite in origin been developed more as major cities within the Empire? Has the issue of kings been whacked off in battle been addressed yet or has it not come to awareness yet?

The church is not as well organized as in OTL to stamp out
heresy, however, and distinct variations of Christianity are thriving in the various regions...

-> So has the Christian Faith been kicked up a notch as they have been in Rome, given the latest round of civil wars that happened?

Neighboring states and peoples like the Hittite Empire will also be affected, but to a much lesser degree, by the Great Plague.

-> I assume this stems from not having
the excellent Roman road system
or is it from other means?
 
G.Bone said:
Dear Sweet Bejesus!

It is alive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But of course it is. I did say after my last installment that I am going to take it at a relaxed, leisurely pace from now on. Plus I am working on several projects right now...this timeline, the black Confederate timeline, as well as another ancient timeline based on my "Rome Destroyed in 450 BC" thread, and a timeline based on the Inca Empire (the later two have not yet been posted on this board, but will be eventually), as well as helping another poster here with a Civil War timeline. So I have a lot that is keeping me busy right now. Please have patience and expect long delays between postings on this timeline.

G.Bone said:
Questions: So they borrow money from other avenues? Could you clarify this for me?

Well, they would pay their taxes with old, undebased money if they have it, or "in kind" (i.e. with produce of equivilent value), if they don't have it. The Roman central government is not accepting the new, debased money it is issuing for taxes. A lot of people don't have either old money or produce to give for "in kind" taxes. These people are being forced into poverty.

G.Bone said:
At this point of history, are there major cities that are "Hittite" in culture and history? With the release of Egypt and the other regions, has these cities that are traditionally Hittite in origin been developed more as major cities within the Empire?

The cities of Syria and Anatolia are, at this period, almost completely Hittite in culture. These regions have been heavily settled by Hittites over a period of centuries, and the various local peoples have been pretty much absorbed into the Hittite mainstream. Cities in other regions retain their own local cultures, and Hittite settlement there is much less.

G.Bone said:
Has the issue of kings been whacked off in battle been addressed yet or has it not come to awareness yet?

That was a relatively common thing in the ancient world, as Kings were generally expected to lead their nation's armies in battle. So I guess the answer is no, it has not been addressed as they don't see the need to address it.

G.Bone said:
So has the Christian Faith been kicked up a notch as they have been in Rome, given the latest round of civil wars that happened?

If you mean in Hatti, the answer is no. Christianity is definitely increasing there as it is in Rome, but it faces stiffer competition from Mithraism and Zoroastrianism (both of which are practiced in the Hittite Empire) than it does in Rome. The fact that Christianity is itself a divided religion, with three distinct sects operating in Hittite Territories at the beginning of the century, has made it's competition with other faiths somewhat less effective.


G.Bone said:
I assume this stems from not having "the excellent Roman road system" or is it from other means?

That is partly the reason. It could be a number of different regions...a generally healthier population because the Hittites are not undergoing the economic upheavals being experienced in Rome at this time, possibly because of genetic differences between the Romans and Hittites, etc.
 
Some More questions:

1. Who are ruling the former-Hittite regions? Is there an emphasis on "native" type customs or have they borrowed elements of their former "mother" country?

2. How's that spec of land in Southern Arabian Penninsula? Are they eying Axum as a provence?

3. The Hittites have evolved that much? I thought it was simply based on different regions having different characteristics- not necessarily an entire race of their own.

4. How the hell do you have th' time for all those projects? I'm really amazed at your fortitude in this genre-
 
It feels good to see this ol' Timeline started back again.

1. With loss of some Major Territory for the Hittite Empire, will this give it a chance to consilidate it core-States and let the people of Hatti trust their King again, Before Expanding (northwards.) I hope.

2. How are The African states of Egypt, Kush and Axum are affected fiancially since their Independence from Hatti? Is Egypt/Kush still controlled by an Pharoh? Have their been in attempts to find the gold mines in south Africa?

3. Should't the Greeks be angry at Hatti for not Intervening in The Roman Invasion? Will the Hellas become an Solid unified country again, or will it be forced to form another type of Grecco Leauge?

4. I sense the return of The Latin Kings and The Republic of Rome. Will The Romans survive the onuslaught of The hunnic Hordes?
 
G.Bone said:
Some More questions:

1. Who are ruling the former-Hittite regions? Is there an emphasis on "native" type customs or have they borrowed elements of their former "mother" country?

In Egypt, Kush, and Axum, native noble houses have re-asserted themselves. They are emphasizing their own native cultures, but they have borrowed useful things from the old Hittite administration, such as military tactics, administrative ideas, etc.

G.Bone said:
2. How's that spec of land in Southern Arabian Penninsula? Are they eying Axum as a provence?

The Himyarites probably are eyeing Axum. And Axum will no doubt be eyeing the Himyarites. In OTL Axum actually conquered the area for a while...will probably happen in this TL as well. Unless, of course, the Hittites come back...

G.Bone said:
3. The Hittites have evolved that much? I thought it was simply based on different regions having different characteristics- not necessarily an entire race of their own.

Their philosophy, as stated a long time ago, has been to "Hittitize" their old imperial home regions (northern Syria, Anatolia) while remaining tolerant of old cultures in regions which are not historically Hittite. So in Anatolia, they have made great efforts to absorb the Phrygians, Lydians, Cimmerians, Lycians, Mysians, and so on (most of these...except the Phyrgians and Cimmerians... were descended from the Luwians and spoke languages related to Hittite anyway, so it was not a hard thing to do in most cases), but in places like Phoenicia, southern Syria, Israel, Mesopotamia, and Egypt, they simply administered the places as provinces and pretty much let the local cultures be.

G.Bone said:
4. How the hell do you have th' time for all those projects? I'm really amazed at your fortitude in this genre-

It's like my old boss used to tell me...How do you eat an elephant? One bite at the time. You can do as many things as you want...you just have to realize that they aren't all going to get done at once, or right away.
 
Historico said:
It feels good to see this ol' Timeline started back again.

Historico said:
1. With loss of some Major Territory for the Hittite Empire, will this give it a chance to consilidate it core-States and let the people of Hatti trust their King again, Before Expanding (northwards.) I hope.

I am not sure I understand your question. The people of Hatti have never stopped trusting their king. All the loss of territory has done is to seriously weaken Hatti. It now no longer directly controls the frankincense and myrrh trade, it has a lot less population to draw on for its military, and it has less defensible borders in the east especially. The upcoming century is going to be tough for Hatti unless it can retake some of these territories. Possibly King Hili will be able to do that. Or maybe not.

Historico said:
2. How are The African states of Egypt, Kush and Axum are affected fiancially since their Independence from Hatti?

Well, Axum and, to a lesser extent, Kush and Egypt are going to profit mightily from being the new "middlemen" in the frankincense and myrrh trade. Plus Axum and Egypt are the homeports of the "Pepper Route" sea trade with India. So they are going to be very wealthy. The Hittites still have a port at Ezion Geber in Israel on the Gulf of Aqaba where they can conduct trade with the Himyarites and India, but now they have to deal with competitors and possible interference with Hittite ships at sea by Egypt and Axum.

I
Historico said:
s Egypt/Kush still controlled by an Pharoh?

Egypt is ruled by a Pharaoh of the new 27th Dynasty from Thebes. Kush is ruled by a native King, but not a Pharaoh.

Historico said:
Have their been in attempts to find the gold mines in south Africa?

No. Pharaoh Necho's fleet passed Ophir by, and there have been no return journeys.

Historico said:
3. Should't the Greeks be angry at Hatti for not Intervening in The Roman Invasion?

Well, they probably were. But since the Hittites were involved in their own civil war at that point, there was nothing they could do. Of course, Hatti did liberate the Greek cities before the end of the century.


Historico said:
Will the Hellas become an Solid unified country again, or will it be forced to form another type of Grecco Leauge?

Hatti doesn't want them to be a unified country again. Unified countries tend to get minds of their own, and become unreliable allies. So a league of independent Greek cities was established, allied to Hatti.

Historico said:
I sense the return of The Latin Kings and The Republic of Rome.

The Republic never died in this timeline. It was saved by Mark Antony, who established the current governmental system (modified by later Dictators) in the 1st century BC.

Historico said:
Will The Romans survive the onslaught of The hunnic Hordes?

That's hard to say. Rome is in some ways stronger, and in some ways weaker, in this timeline. Rome holds more territory, including much European territory containing vigorous barbarian peoples (Germans, Celts, Dacians, others) who make good recruits for the army. It has a shorter and more defensible border (although the addition of the Ukrainian region has somewhat injured that). It has a much more stable government, since the new Republic established by Mark Antony and his successors has established a system of succession for the Dictator, ended slavery, successfully distanced the army from the political process, and found ways to include the provinces in decision-making, breeding more loyalty toward the central government. But economically, it is quite weak, as the rich provinces of the east never became part of the Roman empire, and the handling of the economy by the Roman government has not been significantly better than OTL. And these economic problem are now contributing to instability in the empire as well, with the formation of quasi-feudal statelets within the empire by rich landowners.

Of course they do have about 150 years to recover before the Huns show up at the gates. A lot can happen in that time.
 
My favorite returns

This is my favorite ongoing TL on this Board and confession time I was a bit slow to get into it.

Sort of echoing G. Bone, most of of what we have been getting about the Hittites is their royal family, some wars and a few economic opportunities and some vague thoughts about their different Christian factions. Their society underneath the apex remains something of a blur. Surely they have their own tensions and struggles but they seem to be lumbering in an extended cultural stasis. For a while this made sense the Hittites were stodgy almost drab in their way but its now a long way from Tipperary and so I would expect more lower level transformation and tension.

Speaking of Tipperary you have Roman Ireland. Interesting to see what you are doing there.

You addressed and partially answered the question of the long term religious influence of the Persian invasion on India. I think though while you are in the right direction you don't go quite far enough. For instance I think the Mahabharata would've been deeply influenced the memory of the Persian invasion and that there would be a wholly seperate Indian epic dealing with the Persians more directly.

The relationship between Zoroastrianism and Mithraism is a matter of considerable dispute anongst religious historians. You side with those who believe M was an offshoot of Z and not a wholly new creation spun either from the imagination of a pirate and/or Roamn astrology.

Maybe more comments later. Once again you are to be commended.

Tom
 
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