What Would Movies in a Monarchy-Dominated World Look Like?

Skallagrim

Banned
The one thing that occurs to me is that for explicitly non-oppressive but actually-in-charge monarchs to be the norm, the clear majority of people must support that kind of thing. This means, almost certainly, that we are looking at an ATL where a considerably more conservative view of the proper societal order has prevailed. Note that I do not necessarily say "more conservative about social issues in general". That may be the case, and is indeed more probable than not, but it doesn't have to be the case. The main point is that the whole OTL arch-modernist attitude that a hereditary, God-given right to rule is an outdated idea must be erased from the ATL. And it can't be via an oppressive police state where the Ancien Régime uses the bayonet to crush any would-be repeat of 1848 ad infinitum. So the attitudes that informed 1848 -- and indeed 1789 -- must simply be... not there.

Chances are, we're either looking at a "French revolution averted" scenario, or a "French revolution led to an insane genocidal tyranny that became this world's Hitler and Stalin combined, forever tarnishing all radicals to the extent murderous neo-nazis are seen in OTL" scenario.

Either way, I'd expect most media to reflect a leading social attitude that rests on the implicit assumption that the good and proper authorities are right and just, whereas subversive and radical elements are the baddies by default. Instead of there being neo-nazis or Muslim extremists plotting to take over the world or bomb the capital or whatnot, you'll see neo-Robespierre types in this role forever. Instead of "the evil scientist's beautiful daughter", the hero will quite often fall in love with the fiery young lady who has fallen in with radical revolutionaries. (Naturally, she will see the error of her ways and become a useful member of society by the end.)

All in all, the assumptions are not that different from OTL. But their presence would be more pronounced, while certain (more recent) OTL tendencies to portray rebels as heroes would be almost entirely absent. In an ATL analogue to Star Wars, the Empire would be the heroic faction (and genuinely benevolent, more King Arthur in space than anything else), while the Rebels would be the psychopathic terrorist villains who fire-bomb hospitals and stuff like that.
 
The one thing that occurs to me is that for explicitly non-oppressive but actually-in-charge monarchs to be the norm, the clear majority of people must support that kind of thing. This means, almost certainly, that we are looking at an ATL where a considerably more conservative view of the proper societal order has prevailed. Note that I do not necessarily say "more conservative about social issues in general". That may be the case, and is indeed more probable than not, but it doesn't have to be the case. The main point is that the whole OTL arch-modernist attitude that a hereditary, God-given right to rule is an outdated idea must be erased from the ATL. And it can't be via an oppressive police state where the Ancien Régime uses the bayonet to crush any would-be repeat of 1848 ad infinitum. So the attitudes that informed 1848 -- and indeed 1789 -- must simply be... not there.

Chances are, we're either looking at a "French revolution averted" scenario, or a "French revolution led to an insane genocidal tyranny that became this world's Hitler and Stalin combined, forever tarnishing all radicals to the extent murderous neo-nazis are seen in OTL" scenario.

Either way, I'd expect most media to reflect a leading social attitude that rests on the implicit assumption that the good and proper authorities are right and just, whereas subversive and radical elements are the baddies by default. Instead of there being neo-nazis or Muslim extremists plotting to take over the world or bomb the capital or whatnot, you'll see neo-Robespierre types in this role forever. Instead of "the evil scientist's beautiful daughter", the hero will quite often fall in love with the fiery young lady who has fallen in with radical revolutionaries. (Naturally, she will see the error of her ways and become a useful member of society by the end.)

Or at the very least "Long Live the Monarch! Down with their Bad Advisors!" would be a major thing.
 
The one thing that occurs to me is that for explicitly non-oppressive but actually-in-charge monarchs to be the norm, the clear majority of people must support that kind of thing. This means, almost certainly, that we are looking at an ATL where a considerably more conservative view of the proper societal order has prevailed. Note that I do not necessarily say "more conservative about social issues in general". That may be the case, and is indeed more probable than not, but it doesn't have to be the case. The main point is that the whole OTL arch-modernist attitude that a hereditary, God-given right to rule is an outdated idea must be erased from the ATL. And it can't be via an oppressive police state where the Ancien Régime uses the bayonet to crush any would-be repeat of 1848 ad infinitum. So the attitudes that informed 1848 -- and indeed 1789 -- must simply be... not there.

Chances are, we're either looking at a "French revolution averted" scenario, or a "French revolution led to an insane genocidal tyranny that became this world's Hitler and Stalin combined, forever tarnishing all radicals to the extent murderous neo-nazis are seen in OTL" scenario.
Despite 1789 and 1848, world of 1913 was still dominated by monarchies (and making films). What you need is to avert 1917-1918.
 

Skallagrim

Banned
Or at the very least "Long Live the Monarch! Down with their Bad Advisors!" would be a major thing.
Most assuredly! See also how in traditional stories with princes and kings etc. as the good guys, there is often a designated evil price or count or something. And his existence only stresses how the "rightful, proper" highborn heroes are supposed to deal with such villains. (The true king protects the people from rebels, usurpers and evil corrupt tax collecters. Long live the King!)

Despite 1789 and 1848, world of 1913 was still dominated by monarchies (and making films). What you need is to avert 1917-1918.
I am not at all certain this would suffice, but more importantly: now that the OP has been clarified as "the monarch must acually rule", pre-Great War Britain literally doesn't even qualify. Even if you ignore that, though, I stress again that I don't really believe that averting the Great War would be more than a delay in the process of eroding monarchical power in the West. A significant delay, to be sure, but still. Keep in mind that even in arch-reactionary(-by-post-facto-reputation) Germany, the progressives were the ones on the rise before the war. The Ancien Régime was dying a slow death ever since France had unleashed the spectre of radical revolution upon Europe. (Note that the American revolution did no such thing: it was a pretty conservative affair, and also not in Europe.)

If you want monarchs in charge (and really in charge), and you want this to be non-oppressive? Then the ideas of 1789 must not be allowed to gain currency in the ATL.
 
If you want monarchs in charge (and really in charge), and you want this to be non-oppressive? Then the ideas of 1789 must not be allowed to gain currency in the ATL.
This. I can name the monarchical dynasties which didn't have at least one bad apple on one hand. Sooner or later the people would rise up. Literally right now I can only think of are the Kirat Dynasty and the Lo-Manthang Dynasty.
 
It occurs to me that there would be many, many, many times more Disney Princess(TM) type films in such a world. Of all types - from the damsel-in-distress type, all the way to the action-princess type, and everything in between.
 
Either way, I'd expect most media to reflect a leading social attitude that rests on the implicit assumption that the good and proper authorities are right and just, whereas subversive and radical elements are the baddies by default. Instead of there being neo-nazis or Muslim extremists plotting to take over the world or bomb the capital or whatnot, you'll see neo-Robespierre types in this role forever. Instead of "the evil scientist's beautiful daughter", the hero will quite often fall in love with the fiery young lady who has fallen in with radical revolutionaries. (Naturally, she will see the error of her ways and become a useful member of society by the end.)

One of my old history teachers had read a lot of Nationalist-era Spanish novels (strictly for research purposes, you understand...). Apparently most of them were James Bond-esque thrillers, wherein muscular, square-jawed Francists heroically foiled Communist plots to destroy civilisation.

All in all, the assumptions are not that different from OTL. But their presence would be more pronounced, while certain (more recent) OTL tendencies to portray rebels as heroes would be almost entirely absent. In an ATL analogue to Star Wars, the Empire would be the heroic faction (and genuinely benevolent, more King Arthur in space than anything else), while the Rebels would be the psychopathic terrorist villains who fire-bomb hospitals and stuff like that.

Not necessarily; the Emperor could be a usurper, with the Rebellion seeking to restore the rightful monarch. (So instead of WW2 in space, it would be the Jacobite Rebellion in space.)

I wouldn't expect any Han/Leia romance, though, at least not unless Han ITTL is Robin Hood-type impoverished nobleman who turned to smuggling after the Empire stole his estates or whatever.

I am not at all certain this would suffice, but more importantly: now that the OP has been clarified as "the monarch must acually rule", pre-Great War Britain literally doesn't even qualify. Even if you ignore that, though, I stress again that I don't really believe that averting the Great War would be more than a delay in the process of eroding monarchical power in the West. A significant delay, to be sure, but still. Keep in mind that even in arch-reactionary(-by-post-facto-reputation) Germany, the progressives were the ones on the rise before the war. The Ancien Régime was dying a slow death ever since France had unleashed the spectre of radical revolution upon Europe. (Note that the American revolution did no such thing: it was a pretty conservative affair, and also not in Europe.)

At the risk of getting a bit OT, I wonder if having generally much more decentralised governments (like Switzerland, basically) would help in this regard. If the head of the country doesn't actually do much to impact your day-to-day life, it doesn't matter so much how he's chosen. Or where he comes from -- it's probably not a coincidence that Switzerland was one of the few multi-ethnic states to survive the age of nationalism intact.
 
How does the popular culture of Thailand comment on their King (off-limits for critizism) and monarchy in general?
What are the storylines in popular Saudi films?
 

Skallagrim

Banned
Not necessarily; the Emperor could be a usurper, with the Rebellion seeking to restore the rightful monarch. (So instead of WW2 in space, it would be the Jacobite Rebellion in space.)
Certainly possible, although I still wouldn't expect to see "hero rebels" in any significant way. The good guys aren't rebels, they are legitimists.

I wouldn't expect any Han/Leia romance, though, at least not unless Han ITTL is Robin Hood-type impoverished nobleman who turned to smuggling after the Empire stole his estates or whatever.
As The Courtship of Princess Leia (which also gave is the song "The Virtues of King Han Solo", as composed by C-3PO) tells us: Han actually descends from Berethron e Solo, who was King of Corellia, and who himself descended from the very founder of the monarchy, Prince-Admiral Jonash e Solo.

The book's original cover, incidentally, totally fits with the "princesses yay!" theme:

Courtship2.jpg


Ah, the old Star Wars expanded universe -- how I do love it and its wonderful fits of madness!

At the risk of getting a bit OT, I wonder if having generally much more decentralised governments (like Switzerland, basically) would help in this regard. If the head of the country doesn't actually do much to impact your day-to-day life, it doesn't matter so much how he's chosen. Or where he comes from -- it's probably not a coincidence that Switzerland was one of the few multi-ethnic states to survive the age of nationalism intact.
I agree with the assessment. Also note that centralism was immensely boosted by the French revolution. Averting it means that localism remains far more the norm for longer. The HRE survives, even!
 
There would be a lot of media revolving the "Pretender on the Throne" trope, or that a King goes missing and a usurper must be dethroned, which is good because it means Disney's the Lion King would likely still be made. Assuming the American, French and Russian Revolutions failed, there would naturally be no pop culture concerning those events, or at least not depicting them victorious.
 
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There would be a lot of media revolving the "Pretender on the Throne" trope, or that a King goes missing and a usurper must be dethroned, which is good because it means Disney's the Lion King would likely still be made. Assuming the American, French and Russian Revolutions failed, there would naturally be no pop culture concerning those events, or at least not depicting them victorious.

Yeah, the Eeeeeevil Usurper would probably be "Scar with the serial numbers filed off", or maybe "Richard III, the Sir Ian McKellan fascist version".

Also, there will be the obligatory Eeeeeevil Grand Vizier, which is basically "Jafar with the serial numbers filed off".
 

raharris1973

Donor
Monthly Donor
Ukogbai - really, we need to go there, we need a Japanese-looking nickname for the the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland? There goes five minutes of my life I'll never get back decoding that little bit of cleverness. :rolleyes:
 
To realize - you just need to read your classics.
Anything printed before the start of 20th century, except the few that were printed abroad or whose writers actually got in trouble.
If Richard III could be played and printed in James I-s Britain then it could have been filmed once the technology was there, even in a world where Dutch conquest of Britain was defeated and James II imposed absolute monarchy.
 
An ATL Gladiator movie would not have the OTL anachronistic theme of restoring the Roman Republic after Emperor Commodus' death, but of returning to the age of the five good emperors, which would make a lot more sense. But a majority of feature films wouldn't either be affected at all or far less than one would expect. A Wallander series ITTL e.g. wouldn't likely be all that different from their OTL versions (both BTW produced in monarchies - Sweden and the UK).
 
An ATL Gladiator movie would not have the OTL anachronistic theme of restoring the Roman Republic after Emperor Commodus' death, but of returning to the age of the five good emperors, which would make a lot more sense.
It did. Who expected Year of Six Emperors? Yes, there had been Year of Four Emperors. But Domitian had also been a bad apple inheriting the throne of his father and brother... and when he had been assassinated, Nerva and Traianus stayed in power. Legions did not march on Rome against Nerva as they had against Galba and Otho. A reasonable observer could simply expect Pertinax to last, as Nerva had. Problem solved!
 
It should be noted not every movie in OTL is even about politics. We have Western Movies, and I don't see why those can't exist. There are disaster movies and while Independence Day (one you actually mentioned) had the President be a prominent figure, it would have been the same plot if we wrote the plot around him to get rid of his screen time or even replaced him with a king. Almost all the Disney movies could fit perfectly into this world.
 
Certainly possible, although I still wouldn't expect to see "hero rebels" in any significant way. The good guys aren't rebels, they are legitimists.

In the words of Monsieur de Villefort from the Count of Monte Cristo (a work I could still see being written since the tale is pretty "universal" even if the events of 1815-1830 provide the frame of the story): treason (or rebellion in this case) is simply a matter of dates. When the emperor returns, the royalist shall be the traitor [or rebel] and I, the patriot.
 
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