Two WWI Questions

[Highlander]

There are two questions I have about an alternate Great War, each of which is unrelated.

Could Germany win the war in 1914/early 1915? If so, what would the effects be of this, both in Europe and worldwide?

Second, in one of our recent threads about this topic the question of a partitioned Germany came up. Another poster pointed out how countries may not want to have their forces tied down in Germany, but is there any way to make this possible? And what would the effects be?

 

[MrP]

I think we've had a few threads on the former. I suspect it's possible, but requires a few large changes to the way the Germans and French ran the war. It'd alter the landscape a lot, since France and Russia (and to a lesser extent Britain) would get the smackdown, and Germany would be pre-eminent.

On the second, I tend to think no, but it just struck me that something might be made of the post-war political turmoil - part of Germany remaining in the hands of the pre-war elites, and part of it becoming a communist nation. I have no idea how feasible that is - as I say, it just occurred to me.

 

[Kome]

For the second the Kaiser did suggest this crazy plan where he would remain king of Prussia while the rest of Germany was separated into a state controlled by France. Completely stupid but you would be totally awesome if you could do that.

 

[The Byronic Hero]

The first is questionable. Maybe if the Germans hadn't shipped troops east to meet the Russians the Germans could have taken Paris in 1914. That may have been enough to bring an end to the war with France. Ludendorff admitted that the troops sent arrived after Tannenburg and were useless.

The second part I call BS on. To invade Germany proper and force the partition would have cost more casaulties than Wilson would have been willing to give. Neither France nor Britain had the resolve for the losses that would have entailed so it would have been an American affair alone.

 

[David S Poepoe]

There are two questions I have about an alternate Great War, each of which is unrelated.

Could Germany win the war in 1914/early 1915? If so, what would the effects be of this, both in Europe and worldwide?

Second, in one of our recent threads about this topic the question of a partitioned Germany came up. Another poster pointed out how countries may not want to have their forces tied down in Germany, but is there any way to make this possible? And what would the effects be?

1. The Germans could not have won the war in 1914. There are several instances where they could have along other fronts, but the Western Front is highly unlikely.

3. The British Government in 1919 and thru into 1922 came under tremendous pressure at home to demoblize and recall troops from abroad. Neither Britain or France had the finances to continue any major occupations.

 

[Solomaxwell6]

What if assistance was given to the Munich Commune or whatever it was called? Could we see some sort of socialist Bavarian nation? Seems to me it's a bit too early for the USSR to have the power to step in, though, and I can't see any other nation providing much help.

 

[Wolfpaw]

It was more than possible for Germany to win WWI in 1914. The reason the Schlieffen plan failed is because Russia mobilized way earlier than anybody (including Russia) expected. This caused the Germans to move several divisions to the eastern front and weaken their thrust into France.

If Russia had not mobilized ahead of schedule, or if the German high command had believed Hindenberg when he said he didn't need them, the Schlieffen Plan would most likely have been successful, quickly knocking Britain and France out of the war. After that, Russia would feel the full might of the Kaiser's army and, as in OTL, be defeated.

 

[Zimmerwald1915]

What if assistance was given to the Munich Commune or whatever it was called? Could we see some sort of socialist Bavarian nation? Seems to me it's a bit too early for the USSR to have the power to step in, though, and I can't see any other nation providing much help.

Red Bavaria is inevitably doomed without a Red Germany. End of story.

 

[Solomaxwell6]

Red Bavaria is inevitably doomed without a Red Germany. End of story.

How long would it be able to last?

I mean, "inevitably doomed"? Certainly. But I'd say, if it lasts long enough to at least gain official recognition internationally, that'd fit OP's criteria of "partitioned Germany." Could it do that?

 

[Zimmerwald1915]

How long would it be able to last?

I mean, "inevitably doomed"? Certainly. But I'd say, if it lasts long enough to at least gain official recognition internationally, that'd fit OP's criteria of "partitioned Germany." Could it do that?

Define "internationally". Historically, not even the RSFSR recognized the Bavarian Soviet Republic in its brief history, which means it'll have to last much longer than it did IOTL. The USSR itself didn't gain international recognition (as measured by League of Nations membership, though an earlier date can be arrived at by other methods) until 1934. Personally, I doubt the BSR could last that long, isolated as it is. So unless, for some reason, the BSR can get international recognition prior to 1934, despite the lack of Great Power status and the fact that Germany has claims on its entire territory, it will not fulfill said requirement.

 

[Riain]

The fact that WW1 was a coalition war meant that it would not have ended quickly under realistic circumstances. Even if the Schliffen plan was logisticaly sound the French would not surrender because they would be expecting Russia and Britain to do something to save them, and hoping for some later development such as Italy or the US entering the war. Hope was as persistent as a weed in WW1 and it only ended when all hope was lost for Germany, when they couldn't win themselves and knew they could expect no help.