Tokugawa Bounce

1607 - A Japanese rebellion places Manila firmly in the hands of adventurers who proclaim an independent republic. Tokugawa Ieyasu claims dominion over them and the whole of the Philippines upon hearing of this as Bakufu terrritory.

1608 - Spain declares war on Japan and hopes to take them over as a base, sending a large flotilla of warships in hopes of capruting this rich Asian prize. Tokugawa organizes owners of Red Seal ships to begin taking over isolated Spanish outposts, starting with Mexico.

1609 - Upon learning that Spain is involved in yet another foreign adventure, England and France declare war. Tokugawa ships reach Bay of Juan de Fuca and establish a military outpost deemed Nobunari after a Japanese lord. England moves troops into the Netherlands while the Austrians see as potential threat should Paris and London come to dominate Europe. France agitates Italian city-states by trying to create a land route to Tyrol but are beaten back by a combined Austro-Italian army. Poland and Sweden join France and England after Russia joins the Hapsburgs with the promise of Poland and large chunks of Baltic territory.

1610 - Spain's fleet is decimated by foul weather in Asian high seas while Japanese forces boldly enter Mexico. With the help of native forces they begin a guerilla war that quickly forces out the Europeans. All Spanish posessions in the New World are suddenly under threat as word spreads about strange-eyed forces from the East who hate the Spaniards. English forces seize Menorca and Sardinia though they dare not land on the Spanish mainland as yet. Spanish land forces win a smashing victory at Perpignan and have de facto control of most of Aquataine and Languedoc beyond Lyons, Bordeaux, and Marseilles. French forces overrun Milan as Polish-Swedish forces take Moscow but are driven back by the harsh winter. Shakespeare premieres "The Tempest" while being asked to write more political works.

1611 - Japanese forces announce the reestablishment of the Aztec and Inka Empires after Spanish forces are driven from them. In this case the Aztec are recognized as ruling all of Spanish North America while the Inka rule all of South America, though the areas of true control are not nearly so large. Both Emperors agree to allegiance (on paper) with the Bakufu but in reality they are quite independent. Portugal declares independence and begins a guerilla war against the Spanish while the French enter Mantua. They are having difficulty containing Spanish forces to zones south of Bordeaux and east of Marseilles. A large French force decimates the Austrians just outside of Heidelburg, Germany though the victory is pyrrhic at best: neither army is in any shape to move anywhere. Tokugawa officials begin producing ships like the Red Seal ships and experimenting with heavier designs based on captured and recovered Spanish ones.

1612 - Spain accidentally discovers a new continent in the southern ocean and makes notes on their maps, naming it Atlantica after the fabled lost continent. They are captured by an English ship near Malacca which sends the maps to London. Henry IV dies at the Battle of Arles fending off a large Spanish force, leaving the line of control running from Montpelier to Toulouse to Bordeaux. Austria regains the initiative after the English/ French/Dutch army is ambushed at Ulm and routed piecemeal. Japanese forces fail to secure Recife after a naval battle sees five Red Seal ships and two Spanish Men-of-War sink, giving the Spaniards unquestioned control of the southern Atlantic. Sporadic fights continue across Europe for another 8 months.

1613 - Europe realizes a new peace in the Treaty of Freiburg with Spain gaining most of the territory it holds in southern France while England gains Sardinia and the Dutch gain recognition of their existance from Spain in writing. Philip III is busy with Portugal and Japan with little time to worry about the rest of Europe. Bakufu officials report the deployment of five new warships with seven more under construction.

1614 - Japanese officials capture Panama City and begin fortifying it as a base while moving peasents from overcrowded cities to new outposts in California, Nobunari, the Philippines, and other locations as a preemptive colonization program. Tokugawa Hidetada signs a pact in December recognizing Japanese control over all of the Pacific coast of North America north from the tip of Baja California, the Philippines, Taiwan, Goa, and outposts of Atlantica along with the independence of the Aztec and Inka Empires. Spain retains the entire Caribbean and its territory north of the Rio Grande along with Recife, Rio de Janiero, Buenos Aires, the Malvinas, and all territories in between. Otherwise Panama City is the dividing line of the empires.
 
I don't think the Japanese at this time have the naval ability to pull this off, nor the troop numbers.

I could imagine them taking the Phillippines considering how the colony was actually largely Chinese (there were very few actual Spanairds or Spanish troops there) and perhaps raid Spanish possessions in the New World (though that would be a long shot).
 
I concur.

How do you describe a -wank involving Japan? I remember Japwank and Nipwank were ruled out because they were possibly offensive.

Doesn't really make sense overall in my opinion. Poland at this time was actually pretty weak, the elective monarchy not helping. Sweden wasn't a great power yet, you'd have to wait a wee bit longer (okay, several decades). And Japan invading North America? Did they even know of the continent at this time? Would they have maps for a land invasion?

Not sure about the rest of Europe though.
 
Actually Poland and Sweden took Moscow around this time in OTL.

And Japan had Red Seal Ships, they allowed for transcontinental voyages by licensed merchants. Gather enough of them and Japan suddenly gets real military capacity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasekura_Tsunenaga
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokugawa_Hidetada
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Seal

It's so far off the mark that I thought no one would have done it yet, but Japan or people from it became involved in several plots around Southeast Asia during this time. Also, there was a Japanese ambassador to Mexico around this time...
 

Sargon

Donor
Monthly Donor
How do you describe a -wank involving Japan? I remember Japwank and Nipwank were ruled out because they were possibly offensive.

Yamatowank. Yamato being the old poetic name for Japan.

This is very interesting, but I am not sure if it is plausible that so much could be accomplished in so short a time. The manpower issues would be problematic. I could certainly see Japanese domination of the Philippines, and possibly expeditions to the Americas providing they know of the existence of those places, however I think it would take part over a longer period. Even established maritime powers such as Spain, Holland, Portugal and England would have trouble achieving so much in so short a time over such a large area. However, that is not to say there aren't possibilties here.


Sargon

A Timeline of mine: The Roman Emperor Who Lost His Nose
 
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It's close to implausible for Japan to take the whole of Philippines in that time frame, that is of course, if you meant Spanish Philippines, which is everything but Mindanao and the Luzon mountains. The Sultanates in the south escaped Spanish control up until a year after the Americans replaced Spain.

Otherwise, I don't see much in the way of colonization unless there is no Sengoku period, when the population would have been larger.
 
I'd be happy to edit the time frame, and the Japanese certainly knew of those areas by the time mentioned. I was unaware of the Davao/Soutern Philippines being beyond Spanish control, thanks for the heads up. Looks like Japan can at least try for Luzon if nothing else. The other point here was to show what Japan might do if it were open to the world instead of sealed off from it as Hidetada did.
 
I'd be happy to edit the time frame, and the Japanese certainly knew of those areas by the time mentioned. I was unaware of the Davao/Soutern Philippines being beyond Spanish control, thanks for the heads up. Looks like Japan can at least try for Luzon if nothing else. The other point here was to show what Japan might do if it were open to the world instead of sealed off from it as Hidetada did.
Luzon could work, they did manage to control the Cagayan River valley for a period of time. They could break their promise of not invading the rest of the island, as they were bribed to do by the Spanish, but I don't know how that will progress. Luzon (especially the North) is also one of the earliest places to rebel, the Ilocano peoples manage to do that about 60 years later for a period of time, so have the Japanese maybe help the rebellion.
 
Indeed. Good call, Sleep.

I'll work out the rest of kinks *somehow* after Thursday when I get back from an interview.
 
Damn! I just realized, 1607 would have been too late for this to happen, it's during Hideyoshi's rule that the Philippines was in the Japanese sphere of influence. So don't use that, but even Yamatowank is too much for me, especially soon after losing a war with the Koreans/Ming Chinese.
 
1) Yamatowank?

2) This coincides with the Japanese revolt near Manila in OTL as the POD...
 

NapoleonXIV

Banned
This is really extremely interesting. Could I use elements of this in a story or stories I might write in this area?

One severe problem I see with it, however, is how much overseas adventurism, and particularly lots of contact with the Spanish and the Portugeuse, might exacerbate the Tokugawa's problems with its daimyo.

The whole idea of the Sakoku, IIRC, was to end the Segoku, to break the military power of the daimyo while keeping them as administrative entities. Japan was, IIRC, very war weary after nearly 150 years of almost constant warfare and this was one of the reasons they accepted the Sakoku so readily.

It might work temporarily to send all your young Samurai overseas but they're going to come home sometime, with their European guns and even friends they won't be easy to control.
 
Feel free to use elements from here (citations welcome), I've already cooked up other bizarre and less traveled timelines that could be cited as well...
 
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