The Legacy of Saint Brendan: A History of the Western Hemisphere, 512 to 1400

[Cheer]

Just caught up on this timeline after reading obsessively for a whole day. Loving it so far! It’s one of the first timelines I’ve really enjoyed in a long time. At one point I even forgot this was all fake, you have such an engrossing world and a way to draw the reader into it @Rognvald and I really appreciate it.

I for one love the realistic pace of expansion and the constant changing of hands of the “colony” rather than new ones being founded. I do look forward to exploratory parties, but I love the area-focused style of this timeline.

Keep it up!

 

[Vuu]

What about through Russia?

Overland trade was prohibitively expensive until recently. Tolls, bandits, taxes, vast distances etc etc. Ismailis are not as big as Islam, they'd have to carry the goods by land to the Caspian, and via the Volga, carry overland again into the north Dvina and then go around Scandinavia. Way too complicated and unprofitable, plus they go through Christian Russia anyway

 

[wolfhound817]

This is a great tl! I was wondering though if you could talk more about Meathan (most definitely spelled wrong) culture and how it was impacted by "Skin People" and Confederation culture.

 

[Rognvald]

This is a great tl! I was wondering though if you could talk more about Meathan (most definitely spelled wrong) culture and how it was impacted by "Skin People" and Confederation culture.

Oh Meascthan culture?

So Meascthan culture was subsumed into the greater Fanaithe culture by the time there was contact with the Afonbren Confederation. The Meascthans were heavily influenced by Irish Catholic culture (their earliest ancestors raised as they were by monks), with a few traditions (such as hand gestures, masks in religious ceremonies, etc.) coming from the Skin People.

 

[wolfhound817]

Oh Meascthan culture?

So Meascthan culture was subsumed into the greater Fanaithe culture by the time there was contact with the Afonbren Confederation. The Meascthans were heavily influenced by Irish Catholic culture (their earliest ancestors raised as they were by monks), with a few traditions (such as hand gestures, masks in religious ceremonies, etc.) coming from the Skin People.

ok thanks

 

[HonestAbe1809]

1. Could there be a few people deciding to go on expeditions to try to find a land where they could escape the Ostman's yoke?
2. Since they've reconnected to Europe when will some other group, like the Franks, decide that they want a piece of this new continent?

 

[Cheer]

Since they've reconnected to Europe when will some other group, like the Franks, decide that they want a piece of this new continent?

I think people are missing the big picture here. The only thing this “new continent” seems to offer is furs.

In return, there is an extraoridnarily dangerous sea voyage to get there, violence between people there, very little information in Europe about the land and society, and a prohibitive Irish-based church structure holding authority, as far as they know.

Right now, only individuals have been interested in the area, no states, especially considering that states as we know them (centralized polities with a national foreign policy) don’t even exist yet.

So, the question becomes, why would any kingdom be interested to begin with?

 

[Wolttaire]

I think people are missing the big picture here. The only thing this “new continent” seems to offer is furs.

In return, there is an extraoridnarily dangerous sea voyage to get there, violence between people there, very little information in Europe about the land and society, and a prohibitive Irish-based church structure holding authority, as far as they know.

Right now, only individuals have been interested in the area, no states, especially considering that states as we know them (centralized polities with a national foreign policy) don’t even exist yet.

So, the question becomes, why would any kingdom be interested to begin with?

yah the system is very.... primative in a way there governing structures is to pay them money and after that do what you want

 

[DanMcCollum]

I think people are missing the big picture here. The only thing this “new continent” seems to offer is furs.

In return, there is an extraoridnarily dangerous sea voyage to get there, violence between people there, very little information in Europe about the land and society, and a prohibitive Irish-based church structure holding authority, as far as they know.

Right now, only individuals have been interested in the area, no states, especially considering that states as we know them (centralized polities with a national foreign policy) don’t even exist yet.

So, the question becomes, why would any kingdom be interested to begin with?

Uh, Furs AND maple syrup/sugar!!!

But, yes, you're general statement holds. Although this land is known for being pretty rich in furs, sugar (and fish? I'm assuming they have discovered the Grand Banks by this point), that's probably not enough to draw a huge amount of interest yet.

Basically, you have a small state forming which certainly has a fair amount of wealth. But when compared to the other European states, its hardly drowning in gold. It's also in a far away land across a dangerous sea and surrounded by possibly hostile locals and also riven with internal divisions. Furthermore, all of the other powers who COULD send some people out to investigate are in the wrong place (I'm not sure the land is reachable with the technology of the time with any route save for tge fsr northern one) AND have more pressing matters close to home.

Really, the two peoples who are in the right place to investigate and exploit the knowledge are 1) the Norse and the 2) Anglo-Saxons.

 

[Wolttaire]

˙ave they discovered how great fishing is out here because if yes then they will need to improve there boats over time

 

[vandevere]

˙ave they discovered how great fishing is out here because if yes then they will need to improve there boats over time

If they improve their boats enough, maybe they'll go exploring down the East Coast, all the way down to Florida?

 

[Wolttaire]

If they improve their boats enough, maybe they'll go exploring down the East Coast, all the way down to Florida?

maybe... I think they might just be rerouted toward selling in europe

 

[P L Richards]

I think people are missing the big picture here. The only thing this “new continent” seems to offer is furs.

In return, there is an extraoridnarily dangerous sea voyage to get there, violence between people there, very little information in Europe about the land and society, and a prohibitive Irish-based church structure holding authority, as far as they know.

Right now, only individuals have been interested in the area, no states, especially considering that states as we know them (centralized polities with a national foreign policy) don’t even exist yet.

So, the question becomes, why would any kingdom be interested to begin with?

And now probaly maple sugar. But this is profoundly true. We must avoid getting into the modern OTL mind-set of 'This is America, so people will want to come here'. They won't, unless they have extremely persuasive reasons to do so.

 

[Wolttaire]

what the environment like in there territory has it been degraded a lot exc

 

[P L Richards]

Olchobar, who had been watching from the read, fled into the Confederation (as many would later do). Unfortunately for him, the Confederation did not take kindly to his movement’s disruption of trade; he was captured, clubbed to death, and his head was sent to the Gorfodi to show the Confederation’s desire for trade.

I throw this in as a suggestion. Your chronical is of course what actually happened, but monks who supported Olchobar spun it differently. After the battle, they said, he went on a mission to preach the Christian Faith to the Confederation, and was martyred for his faith by hostile pagans there. Christianity needs its martyrs to spread, and many believed this; the story spread widely. Hagiograhers can be very inventive, and to future generations he became St Olchobar, Apostle to the Afonbren.(!) Of course Brendan must be the first saint canonised from The Island, but here is a possible ready-made second.

 

[Christory]

If you're still looking for a mapper, I can do a QBAM 1400 map once the timeline gets that far.

 

[Wolttaire]

I was re-reading the timeline and I thought it was funny that you thought people at AH.com would be handing out pitchforks seeing your POD

 

[Southern pride]

Just read the entire timeline but I have a question if Irish people came over to the new world would they be able to understand the language spoken by there distant cousins as you've said the two have separated but to the extent of a dialect or separate language?

 

[Bison]

What are the demographics like? Ethnicity and class are tied, it seems, with Measctha at the bottom, then the Irish, the Bretons, and the Norse the top.

How close are the Old World and New World Irish, ethnolinguistically?

Is there a blending of culture, like in England after the Roman, Saxon, Norse, and, most prominently, Norman invasions. The situation in Talbeah seems to mirror that highly.

What are the biggest cities, how is population growing in general, and is it more urbanized than say in Europe?

How come there hasnt been some independent exploration down the Eastern Seaboard and into the Carribean, after 400 years of colonization?

Could we see another map of Talbeah as it is right now?

 

[Gabingston]

What are the demographics like? Ethnicity and class are tied, it seems, with Measctha at the bottom, then the Irish, the Bretons, and the Norse the top.

How close are the Old World and New World Irish, ethnolinguistically?

Is there a blending of culture, like in England after the Roman, Saxon, Norse, and, most prominently, Norman invasions. The situation in Talbeah seems to mirror that highly.

What are the biggest cities, how is population growing in general, and is it more urbanized than say in Europe?

How come there hasnt been some independent exploration down the Eastern Seaboard and into the Carribean, after 400 years of colonization?

Could we see another map of Talbeah as it is right now?

Race didn't become a huge deal until the 1500s IOTL, before that it was more about religion.