Napoleon IV

Whanztastic · Jun 23, 2012

What sort of Emperor would Napoleon IV would've been?

I imagine he would be somewhat like Wilhelm II, but perhaps a little more stable.

Any thoughts?

Barnstaple · Jun 23, 2012

Does Napoleon IV take the throne after his father abdicates during the Franco-Prussian War, or is there no war and the Bonaparte dynasty continues? Or is there a Bonaparte restoration sometime after 1871 (assuming the Prince Imperial isn't killed in the Zulu War)?

Whanztastic · Jun 23, 2012

My assumption is that the Franco-Prussian War would be avoided, or goes better for France, and Prince Louis inherits without the throne without problem but any sort of situation which involves him coming to power would work.

RogueBeaver · Jun 23, 2012

My guess: Somewhere between moderately liberal autocrat and tepid democrat, Anglophile and perhaps suspicious of Russia. Maybe the AN gets a proper PM with control over daily domestic affairs while foreign policy is entirely in his hands? Less brash and impulsive than his old man but definitely smarter if his Sandhurst performance IOTL was any indication.

Whanztastic · Jun 23, 2012

RogueBeaver said:
My guess: Somewhere between moderately liberal autocrat and tepid democrat, Anglophile and perhaps suspicious of Russia. Maybe the AN gets a proper PM with control over daily domestic affairs while foreign policy is entirely in his hands? Less brash and impulsive than his old man but definitely smarter if his Sandhurst performance IOTL was any indication.

That was always what I expected. I imagine that France would do rather well under Nappy IV, remaining the dominant Continental Power, if demographic trends or Germanic unification can be quelled.

Despite a surviving Napoleonic Empire being a continual AH trope, I do not recall any specific examinations of his reign.

RogueBeaver · Jun 23, 2012

Joho has a great TL, but that's an initially successful Commune turned 4-way civil war ending in Bonapartist victory and Nappy IV's enthronement. Not what you're looking for. Nor Robertp1865's TL which has among other things, US intervention on France's side in the FPW.

TBH I don't think anyone's ever written a straight "French victory FPW" or "FPW avoided" TL. I remember asking about this last year.

Xgentis · Jun 24, 2012

RogueBeaver said:
Joho has a great TL, but that's an initially successful Commune turned 4-way civil war ending in Bonapartist victory and Nappy IV's enthronement. Not what you're looking for. Nor Robertp1865's TL which has among other things, US intervention on France's side in the FPW.

TBH I don't think anyone's ever written a straight "French victory FPW" or "FPW avoided" TL. I remember asking about this last year.

I don't like his timeline he made Napoleon IV look like some fool.

Elfwine · Jun 24, 2012

Xgentis said:
I don't like his timeline he made Napoleon IV look like some fool.

Are you saying he wasn't?

I kind of like the Prince Imperial, in a "he was young and inspired and a little short on common sense" sort of way, but I don't know if he would have made a good ruler.

I don't think he'd be like Wilhelm II though - his problems seem mostly being young (23 when he died), not being that kind of person.

But if we're going to say he wasn't a fool, some elaboration would be nice, if only to hear more.

DanMcCollum · Jun 24, 2012

Elfwine said:
Are you saying he wasn't?

I kind of like the Prince Imperial, in a "he was young and inspired and a little short on common sense" sort of way, but I don't know if he would have made a good ruler.

I don't think he'd be like Wilhelm II though - his problems seem mostly being young (23 when he died), not being that kind of person.

But if we're going to say he wasn't a fool, some elaboration would be nice, if only to hear more.

Well, honestly, I don't know of many 23 year olds who aren't fools at heart. It's called growing up. You take those ideals of youth and grow into them.

Elfwine · Jun 24, 2012

DanMcCollum said:
Well, honestly, I don't know of many 23 year olds who aren't fools at heart. It's called growing up. You take those ideals of youth and grow into them.

That's my point, speaking as a twenty-six year old. I think Louis at forty would have been a much more mature person - probably very driven - unlike how Wilhelm was basically not a very mature guy for reasons that didn't get any better with age.

But if we're going to assert that him being a fool later in life is wrong, we need some basis to say that other than being fond of him as a plucky chap, which is why I wrote my post as confusingly as I did.

Whanztastic · Jun 24, 2012

Elfwine said:
That's my point, speaking as a twenty-six year old. I think Louis at forty would have been a much more mature person - probably very driven - unlike how Wilhelm was basically not a very mature guy for reasons that didn't get any better with age.

But if we're going to assert that him being a fool later in life is wrong, we need some basis to say that other than being fond of him as a plucky chap, which is why I wrote my post as confusingly as I did.

I believe he'd be 17 when taking the throne in an avoided F-P War scenario, quite young and probably very impetuous, at first. I can see some foreign affair errors and he might even end up with a Franco-Prussian War not long after OTL's if things go terribly wrong.

Who would he marry? Certainly not Princess Beatrice if he was Emperor, although that'd be quite a twist!

King of Rome · Jun 24, 2012

I think the little guy would do all right. If the habits and characteristics of his parents meld well in his adult life he would be a benevolent dictator of sorts.

Max Sinister · Jun 28, 2012

Did you read DoD?

Xgentis · Jul 23, 2012

RogueBeaver said:
Joho has a great TL, but that's an initially successful Commune turned 4-way civil war ending in Bonapartist victory and Nappy IV's enthronement. Not what you're looking for. Nor Robertp1865's TL which has among other things, US intervention on France's side in the FPW.

TBH I don't think anyone's ever written a straight "French victory FPW" or "FPW avoided" TL. I remember asking about this last year.

Do you have a link to robert timeline?

Daztur · Jul 23, 2012

Male Rising has a French victory in the Franco-Prussian War and is now into the reign of Napoleon IV.

Xgentis · Jul 24, 2012

Daztur said:
Male Rising has a French victory in the Franco-Prussian War and is now into the reign of Napoleon IV.

Yes but it is not successfull second empire timeline.