How quickly can Nazi Germany defeat The British Empire after the Fall of France?

Germany cannot defeat the British Empire per se. The closest POD is Lord Halifax takes over after Chamberlain resigns and sues for a separate peace with the Reich. However, the British Empire won't be knocked out of the picture per se. Germany won't usurp them as the next superpower since Britain had her colonies at this point.
 
The Mediterranean strategy may "work", as far-fetched as it is (even though it's easier to pull off than the Sea Mammal). If Britain is defeated in Egypt (and loses Malta) I really can't see them not seeking peace in some form.
If there's no Barbarossa there may be even a way to pressure Spain into invading Gibraltar to deal a finishing blow, I guess ...
Why does the UK need to seek a peace settlement in this situation? It is already supplying the ME armies from India or the US/UK via the Cape of Good Hope. It can maintain an army in Palestine, East Africa and elsewhere easier than Germany can supply one in Egypt. British submarines can be based in Palestine or Lebanon and with its aircraft make it expensive to ship fuel etc. to Alexandria - even assuming the docks aren't wrecked.

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The Mediterranean strategy may "work", as far-fetched as it is (even though it's easier to pull off than the Sea Mammal). If Britain is defeated in Egypt (and loses Malta) I really can't see them not seeking peace in some form.
If there's no Barbarossa there may be even a way to pressure Spain into invading Gibraltar to deal a finishing blow, I guess ...
Why, by that point they know any deal with AH is worthless so simply know they cant really do any deal, losing none core areas (ie anything outside the ASB Sea Mamma) doesn't stop them fighting on with unlimited US support?
 
In my view, there are a few factors that especially made war with Britain unwinnable for Germany:
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3. Germany's military buildup was entirely land-based. Plan Z was basically dead by 1939, and for the rest of the war there were insufficient resources for the Kriegsmarine.
..
7. Perhaps most importantly in my view, Hitler was never particularly interested in war with the UK. His strategic aim from the very beginning was Russia. For the entirety of the war, the UK was a sideshow in German planning and production. Germany did not want to fight the UK and was making no serious efforts to tip the scales in their favor.
8. Finally, time was never on Germany's side. The UK could always fall back on US arms and equipment, and the Battle of the Atlantic was unwinnable for the Kriegsmarine. US intervention becomes more and more likely as the war drags on, and as soon as the US is in the fight, the chances for an attack on Britain are gone.
The issue is that all the above are basically linked and can't without near ASB efforts be changed, why be interested, plan and build for something that will be almost certainly impossible?
 
The issue is that all the above are basically linked and can't without near ASB efforts be changed, why be interested, plan and build for something that will be almost certainly impossible?
Indeed, which is why the lack of consideration for British participation in a European war was perhaps the Nazi regime's most fundamental mistake. The German buildup for war was beset by wishful thinking and willful ignorance from the very start. One could say Germany was setting itself up for defeat the very moment Hitler assumed power.
 
The Mediterranean strategy may "work", as far-fetched as it is (even though it's easier to pull off than the Sea Mammal). If Britain is defeated in Egypt (and loses Malta) I really can't see them not seeking peace in some form.
If there's no Barbarossa there may be even a way to pressure Spain into invading Gibraltar to deal a finishing blow, I guess ...
Again, just not possible , it all comes down to logistics. Simply the Germans/Italians just cannot supply a big enough Army in Egypt. Look at 1st El Alamein, the battle that stopped the drive, the Axis 96k vs 150k men , 50 vs 179 tanks, 500 vs 1500 aircraft. Once Rommel had to fight through a position ( El Alamein could not be flanked, its why the stand was made there ) , numbers count. Once he was stopped, as history shows, he does not have a the supplies to do anything but pull back. His slowness in doing so is what aids an Allied Advance across Libya.
 
Valid points and it's certainly feasible that Churchill and Westminster could mishandle things. But, why are conditions worsening in India? War spending will help the Indian economy, volunteers for the Indian Army will be well paid and send money home to their families. OTL the British defeated the "Quit India" movement even with the Japanese on the frontiers after conquering Burma. IF there's no Japanese attack on SE Asia conditions should be better, not worse.

I also doubt that the Indian example would lead to the rest of the Empire revolting, let alone those being successful. And the scenario posits US support, which OTL made up for the loss of Malaysia and Burma in any case.

So, I'm sceptical but it is a possible way that the UK has to quit.
In OTL, Quit India protests were peaceful and gandhian, which is why British were able to defeat them by just ignoring them

Things were worsening in India due to droughts and famines in India due to Churchill's prioritization of Soldiers of Indian civilians, If Bose is able to incite a violent rebellion, which is not impossible in a scenario in which British are in much more dire situation, it can no doubt cripple war efforts of Britain as their most valuable colony would be gone
 
What if the Colonies Rebel in Asia and Africa, could it tip scale in favor of Nazi ?
Possibly but British were really at keeping their leaders loyal to them
In addition these was hardly any grassroots political movement strong enough to wrest controlfrom the traditional elements
 
No ,, to beat Britain needs a certain Sea Mammal that cannot be named. As there are no circumstances where that can work, the best Germany can do is a Cold War, However Germany will collapse in on itself just like the USSR did as its economy is only functioning by robbing Peter to pay Paul and so eventually the plates come crashing down.
That sea mammal is a fictional character
 
Possibly but British were really at keeping their leaders loyal to them
In addition these was hardly any grassroots political movement strong enough to wrest controlfrom the traditional elements
British were not keeping thecleaders loyal, other than muslim league which was still minuscule, most leaders protested against the war and were jailed or house arrested, it would only take a one charismatic violent revolutionary to tip the balance
 
Thanks for the responses so far.

Does anyone think that Nazi Germany could force the British Empire to make peace under these conditions?

The reason I ask is that they are the OTL conditions that Hitler and the Nazis faced in mid-1940. And they sensed that was the case.

IMHO IF the replies above are unchallenged, then the conclusions explain the decision to launch Barbarossa.

And render moot any attempts to make the Atlantic/Mediterranean strategy work.
IMO there's no chance that Germany can force the UK to sign a peace. And even if the UK considers a peace there's two factors which would prevent it:
1) they didn't trust Hitler (or Germany for that matter)
2) Hitler(/Germany) would make demands that weren't acceptable to the UK. What the UK may want to consider is if Germany retreats out of France (they might want to give A-L to them, so to 1914 borders), and out of Norway, Denmark, Netherlands, Belgium and Luxemburg, without any restrictions on the military in any of those countries or the UK, since they don't trust the Germans. And there's no way the Germans would accept that.
 
Didn't the sea mammal get war gamed and it was determined that even with every advantage known to man given to the Germans that the sea mammal would have been deemed a colossal failure and that even in GB did nothing to prevent the invasion all it would have taken was as semi bad storm and the army gets sunk on its way over?
 
Why, by that point they know any deal with AH is worthless so simply know they cant really do any deal, losing none core areas (ie anything outside the ASB Sea Mamma) doesn't stop them fighting on with unlimited US support?
All I can think of is a Treaty of Amiens type scenario. Not a peace, just a short pause because both side think they would benefit from a ceasefire and a chance to re-arm and prepare ready for round 2. But I struggle to imagine what that could look like in practice, if it leaves Germany in effective control of Europe then the UK cannot agree (it leaves Germany too strong) but if just cannot see Germany accepting anything less with AH and co in charge.
 
Didn't the sea mammal get war gamed and it was determined that even with every advantage known to man given to the Germans that the sea mammal would have been deemed a colossal failure and that even in GB did nothing to prevent the invasion all it would have taken was as semi bad storm and the army gets sunk on its way over?
Indeed. Even with an unopposed initial landing it's going to fail.
 
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it can no doubt cripple war efforts of Britain as their most valuable colony would be gone
Not really, none of the empire is sufficiently important if GB has US supplies it can simply ignore the empire as OTL most of the empire (-Canada) stuff was used in eastern Med/Far East and the European theatre was mostly supplied from the USA/South America due to distance and to save shipping anyway.... Almost all the shipyards and spitfire factories are in UK proper so fighting a Sea/Air dominate war (ie west post FoF to D day) is perfectly possible without the colonies.
 
Not really, none of the empire is sufficiently important if GB has US supplies it can simply ignore the empire as OTL most of the empire (-Canada) stuff was used in eastern Med/Far East and the European theatre was mostly supplied from the USA/South America due to distance and to save shipping anyway.... Almost all the shipyards and spitfire factories are in UK proper so fighting a Sea/Air dominate war (ie west post FoF to D day) is perfectly possible without the colonies.
That is true, however if India did break away you could have a ripple effect of all British colonies doing the same which would be disastrous to British atleast in terms of morale
 
The impossibility of forcing Britain out of the war in any sensible timeframe (or at all!) really shows just how catastrophic Germany's strategic sitation was after the fall of France.

Stuck fighting an unwinnable war, blockaded and with inadequate resources to run her own economy, let alone the captured industry of Europe, while the rising powers of the USA and USSR looked on ever more belligerently. The Med is a political pain, a logistical black hole and a strategic irrelevancy; the only solution that offers any hope is to turn east, to knock the USSR out and use her resources and strategic depth to build the ability to survive the British/American air onslaught.
 
Germany had one chance in 1940: to bluff the UK into acepting an armistice. And it's a very small chance, specially with Churchill in charge. After that, I really don't see how. Without a navy (and air force, btw) large enough to carry out and support an invasion, it becomes a waiting game, specially with Lend Lease (and does the US join?). Since it appears sooner or latter Stalin comes knocking...
 
Again, just not possible , it all comes down to logistics. Simply the Germans/Italians just cannot supply a big enough Army in Egypt. Look at 1st El Alamein, the battle that stopped the drive, the Axis 96k vs 150k men , 50 vs 179 tanks, 500 vs 1500 aircraft. Once Rommel had to fight through a position ( El Alamein could not be flanked, its why the stand was made there ) , numbers count. Once he was stopped, as history shows, he does not have a the supplies to do anything but pull back. His slowness in doing so is what aids an Allied Advance across Libya.
TBF, it might just about be possible IF the British army had fallen back in such disarray it could not form a line across the gap. AND the Germans had sufficient reserves and supplies to push on before the British could reorganise. Even then, getting beyond Alexandria will be a problem. (Unless the Egyptian army revolts?)

OTL neither condition held true. ITTL it is barely feasible,
 
British were not keeping thecleaders loyal, other than muslim league which was still minuscule, most leaders protested against the war and were jailed or house arrested, it would only take a one charismatic violent revolutionary to tip the balance
So what is the British response? Can they defuse the situation by handing over the Civil government to a Congress Leader as Viceroy and the cabinet all Indian? Provided India stays in the war, with independence effective immediately after the end?
 
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