AH challenge:more liberal america

Derek Jackson · Feb 8, 2004

This has gone WAY off topic.

I am a left Liberal. I am VERY glad that Barry Goldwater was NOT elected in 1964.

On the other hand I accept the statement that he was a wholly honorable man.

I accept that he was not personally racist. However I believe that if his view of the Constitution and of States Rights had prevailed racism would be a lot stronger.

Derek Jackson · Feb 8, 2004

This has gone WAY off topic.

I am a left Liberal. I am VERY glad that Barry Goldwater was NOT elected in 1964.

On the other hand I accept the statement that he was a wholly honorable man.

I accept that he was not personally racist. However I believe that if his view of the Constitution and of States Rights had prevailed racism would be a lot stronger.

Straha · Feb 8, 2004

a cold war against a rightwing conservative empire would help make america far more liberal. Imagien if we had a theocratic revolution in russia and the nazis had christian taliban overtones along with their ideology.

DominusNovus · Feb 8, 2004

Michael E Johnson said:
Sorry but I cherish every momnet of my life. So when I chose to confront the same tired recycled apologism with 1 word instead of the multi-word response I used previoulsy about the same thing its about me saving my moments.

This coming from the guy who has posted probably more posts to this thread than anyone else.

David Howery · Feb 8, 2004

my... I go away for a day and find that this thread has grown by three pages (!)... and all of it is ranting remarks about racism. I stand in awe....

DominusNovus · Feb 8, 2004

David Howery said:
my... I go away for a day and find that this thread has grown by three pages (!)... and all of it is ranting remarks about racism. I stand in awe....

Heh, I know what you mean, I checked the board, went out to do some errands, got on a bus, got back to campus, and blam, the thread has practically doubled.

MerryPrankster · Feb 8, 2004

(horrified @ sight of a profanity-spewing argument between Michael and Walter, Matt breaks into a...)

DEAN SCREAM

YAAAAAARRRRRGGGHHH!!!!

Grey Wolf · Feb 8, 2004

Matt Quinn said:
(horrified @ sight of a profanity-spewing argument between Michael and Walter, Matt breaks into a...)

DEAN SCREAM

YAAAAAARRRRRGGGHHH!!!!

I missed that...what was the point of it ? Gotta pin my hopes on Al Sharpton now unless want Bush Lite or Military Hero, neither of which I am partial to

Grey Wolf

DominusNovus · Feb 8, 2004

Grey Wolf said:
I missed that...what was the point of it ? Gotta pin my hopes on Al Sharpton now unless want Bush Lite or Military Hero, neither of which I am partial to

Grey Wolf

Oh, Dean didn't handle losing the Iowa Caucus very well, and kinda screamed like a madman on television.

Beck Reilly · Feb 8, 2004

Grey Wolf said:
I missed that...what was the point of it ? Gotta pin my hopes on Al Sharpton now unless want Bush Lite or Military Hero, neither of which I am partial to

What's wrong with Clark, Edwards, or Kerry? Kerry may be a little boring but that's certainly better than being, well, stupid. As for the scream, he got a little too enthusiastic trying to bolster confidence in his followers...

Mako-Chan · Feb 8, 2004

Grey Wolf said:
I missed that...what was the point of it ? Gotta pin my hopes on Al Sharpton now unless want Bush Lite or Military Hero, neither of which I am partial to

Grey Wolf

Oh, I'm hoping that Sharpton gets the nomination too. I would love to see a Sharpton/ Kucinich ticket, unlikely as that might be. Albeit for very different reasons than yours...

Beck Reilly · Feb 8, 2004

POTUS P.Diffin said:
Oh, I'm hoping that Sharpton gets the nomination too. I would love to see a Sharpton/ Kucinich ticket, unlikely as that might be. Albeit for very different reasons than yours...

LOL. That'd be about the worst combination possible. But I assume that's your point. In the end, no matter how bad it would be, I would vote for Sharpton. At least he, no matter how nutty, is intelligent.

Mako-Chan · Feb 8, 2004

Walter_Kaufmann said:
LOL. That'd be about the worst combination possible. But I assume that's your point. In the end, no matter how bad it would be, I would vote for Sharpton. At least he, no matter how nutty, is intelligent.

Oh, I think Bush is intelligent, just disoriented (at least, that's the impression I've gotten from him post-9/11). He reminds me of Dan Quayle in that, while he may say stupid things, he isn't anywhere near as buffoonish as the media makes him out to be.

Anyway, I would love to see the Dems go off the deep-end and nominate a far left candidate, and subsequently decline in popularity (maybe even collapse). Then maybe we could have a new party that's more in touch with Americans arise (possibly a new populist movement) instead of the establishment-liberal/moderate left party we have now.

DominusNovus · Feb 9, 2004

POTUS P.Diffin said:
Oh, I think Bush is intelligent, just disoriented (at least, that's the impression I've gotten from him post-9/11). He reminds me of Dan Quayle in that, while he may say stupid things, he isn't anywhere near as buffoonish as the media makes him out to be.

Anyway, I would love to see the Dems go off the deep-end and nominate a far left candidate, and subsequently decline in popularity (maybe even collapse). Then maybe we could have a new party that's more in touch with Americans arise (possibly a new populist movement) instead of the establishment-liberal/moderate left party we have now.

I agree with you 100%
My view of Bush is that his brain is running in 5th gear, while his mouth is running in 2nd (or some such combination).

Michael E Johnson · Feb 9, 2004

---This coming from the guy who has posted probably more posts to this thread than anyone else.----

Your partly correct. I probably have more posts on here than anyone else in regard to correcting the apologist bullshit about African -Americans in the United States . But when it comes to sheer numbers I definitely dont have the most as there are usually only a handful of threads on here that interest me ( due to subject matter and authors)

Michael E Johnson · Feb 9, 2004

---I am a left Liberal. I am VERY glad that Barry Goldwater was NOT elected in 1964.

On the other hand I accept the statement that he was a wholly honorable man.

I accept that he was not personally racist. However I believe that if his view of the Constitution and of States Rights had prevailed racism would be a lot stronger.----

You are right about the result of his being president Derek. But how honorable does that make him ? If he had a scrap of intelligence he also knew that his policies would have left segregation in place. Thats tells me that the he,the GOP and the millions of white voters who voted for him didnt have a problem with that. Maintaining segregation and Jim Crow is many things but its definitely not honorable.

DominusNovus · Feb 9, 2004

Michael E Johnson said:
---This coming from the guy who has posted probably more posts to this thread than anyone else.----

Your partly correct. I probably have more posts on here than anyone else in regard to correcting the apologist bullshit about African -Americans in the United States . But when it come to sheer numbers I definitely dont have the most as there are usually only a handful of threads on here that interest me ( due to subject matter and authors)

Well, in regards to the entire board, I'm pretty sure Straha has us all beat by a longshot (~600).

Michael E Johnson · Feb 9, 2004

---Barry Goldwater, who, in my opinion, is one of the, if not THE, most honorable politician of the second half of the 20th Century---

I waited on this one to see if anyone else would respond,but I wasnt to shocked to see that no one did.So let me get this straight, Barry Goldwater, Republican candidate for president in 1964 who earned the voters of millions of racist southern whites because he wanted to keep segregation in place by allowing for "states rights", is MORE honorable than Harry Truman,Adlai Stevenson, Dwight Eisenhower, Winston Churchill,John F Kennedy,Martin Luther King, Robert Kennedy,Golda Meir, Anwar Sadat,Nelson Mandela,Mikhail Gorbachev and a host of others ??? !!! Give me a freaking break.

Michael E Johnson · Feb 9, 2004

---I would love to see the Dems go off the deep-end and nominate a far left candidate, and subsequently decline in popularity (maybe even collapse). Then maybe we could have a new party that's more in touch with Americans arise (possibly a new populist movement) instead of the establishment-liberal/moderate left party we have now.----

The reason that the Democratic party is liberal/ modearte left is because millions of Americans ( and based on 2000 a majority of the electorate- ie people who actually vote) fit into the category. So this means that the Democrats are in no danger of collapsing. If they actually did the people that vote for them would go to other parties but there is no way in hell they would go to the GOP.

Beck Reilly · Feb 9, 2004

Michael E Johnson said:
Harry Truman,Adlai Stevenson, Dwight Eisenhower, Winston Churchill,John F Kennedy,Martin Luther King, Robert Kennedy,Golda Meir, Anwar Sadat,Nelson Mandela,Mikhail Gorbachev and a host of others ??? !!! Give me a freaking break.

Actually, two of those are, in my opinion, the LEAST honorable politicians of the 20th Century. I am, of course, talking about the Kennedy's, arguably THE least honorable men to serve in Washington. Not only did JFK have absolutely NO moral standards (whether good or bad), but he was a horrible President as well. His brother, was no better, although he, obviously, was never President.

To further narrow the field, I meant Americans, as this entire thread is about America. That leaves us with Truman, Stevenson, Eisenhower, and King. I don't like Truman. He fired MacArthur, my favorite military officer of American history (I don't care whether it was warranted or not. In the end, MacArthur will be proved right). Stevenson was, although a nice man, a little too "red" for my liking. He was a good person, but he would have ruined this country had he been President. Eisenhower was a politician, pure and simple. He was a master politician and administrator and a relative do-nothing as President.

As for King, the last man on your list, I have only a tiny inkling of respect for him. He was made of the same moral fiber as the Kennedy's. You're talking about a man who slept with white prostitutes and plagarized his doctoral thesis. His constant criticizing of the US government's foreign policy, especially during the Vietnam War, really got on my nerves. The best thing about King: the day off from work.

There you go. Out of the Americans on that list, it is my opinion that Barry Goldwater is the most honorable.