Map Thread VI

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...thus I and the expedition chartered ship from the rebuilt New Orleans to Durban, and thus to the fold of the Commonwealth.

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Yery nice and wonderful attention to detail as usual, Nugax. So the Commonwealth would be most likely South Africa+Australia+New Zealand+Recolonized Britain [1]+whatever bits of the third world they could hold onto..?

(What's the Yellow Hetmanate? Russian Cossacks fleeing south and East and merging with the greatly reduced population of North China?)

You know, I'd pay actual money to see a world map eventually... :)

Bruce


[1] Even if it has the climate of OTL Iceland, I'd expect they'd retain it for sentiments sake...
 
BTW, here's my entry for the latest map contest. It's from on of those "British Federal Empire" dealie timelines - a bit of an extension onto the Cape-Cairo rail, completed circa 1950 in this timeline...

Bruce

CapeToSingapore.png
 
Yery nice and wonderful attention to detail as usual, Nugax. So the Commonwealth would be most likely South Africa+Australia+New Zealand+Recolonized Britain [1]+whatever bits of the third world they could hold onto..?

[1] Even if it has the climate of OTL Iceland, I'd expect they'd retain it for sentiments sake...

You are close, but with the climate changing the Commonwealths main population centres might not be where you expect ;). The Commonwealth does still 'own' the ice bound British isles but their actual presence amounts to a few hundred thousand people at Cardiff Station (the new gulf stream keeps the estury free from ice, and the nearby Valleys make it a useful coaling supply centre for Atlantic trade) and perhaps ten thousand hunters and trappers ranging the forests and broken cities. The British are often forced to pay attention to happenings in Asia over Europe (like the messes they get up too in India every decade or so), and several powers of strength nearly that of the Commonwealth lie between them and the Isles. They have so little control that they currently can't put a stop to the Louisiane's sailing over from their bases in the Netherlands and raiding Kent and the Thames Valley for supplies.

(What's the Yellow Hetmanate? Russian Cossacks fleeing south and East and merging with the greatly reduced population of North China?)

Maybe...Though less so on the fleeing part.

You know, I'd pay actual money to see a world map eventually... :)

The problem is its hard to find nice basemaps for most of the world. I suppose I could sketch something on that annoying standard map (no offence to those like yourself that can make it sit up and do tricks, its just I tend to work with paths rather than pixels).
 

Krall

Banned
...thus I and the expedition chartered ship from the rebuilt New Orleans to Durban, and thus to the fold of the Commonwealth.

In concluding the narrative of my report, we now must turn to the strategic analysis of the following section and a series of monographs on each of the American nations to be found in the appendices, as well as a number of maps and statistical tables compiled by Mr Bellows and Dr Lorgat.

Before anything else, I wish to impress on the right honourable members the importance of treading carefully in the wording of any negotiations or diplomacy with the Anglophonic Americans. Since all four nation states claim to be direct inheritors of the Old Republic [Though it must be said the Monterreans are rather less serious about it than the other three] and all its lands and powers, addressing any of them as the United States of America would cause outrage amongst the others. I have throughout my report adopted the convention of referring to the polities by a demonym derived from their capital cities, and in correspondences with the various leaders referred to them by their given name and 'Mr President', and I humbly suggest that this parliament does likewise.

I also caution that we must approach these nations unencumbered with any prior bonds of amenity or preconceptions. Although after the Second Philippine War the man in the street in the Commonwealth might feel a certain fondness for the Californian Franciscans, I do not feel the Franciscan common man has a counterbalancing love for us, and I know for certain that the Franciscans are entering into ever deeper trade bonds with the Yellow Hetmanate and the Viet, and the Nusantaran ambassador confided in me that even Nipponese diplomats were being entertained at the Governors Palace some eight months prior to my expeditions arrival in San Francisco bay. I also contend with the prevailing view of Mr Murdoch's papers that the Atlanteans are the last bastion of civilised manners and propriety on the continent, and the only bulwark against the ravening hordes of the Louisianans. Whilst the inhabitants of the Mississippi basin were often raw, militaristic and barely intelligible, in their faith in the rule of law and freedom of trade and industry they are far more like the men of the commonwealth than the Atlanteans, who hide a stifling theocratic caste system under the pleasant face they present to Durban...

A great map with great background. Definitely one of the best I've seen in here for a long time!
 

Goldstein

Banned
A quick map I just made, inspired by a challenge in the AH forum (Baathism as a major terrorist ideology), and with a lot of elements based on the Call of Duty: Modern Warfare setting... hopefully, with less insanity. And with a twist.

The POD for this timeline is that Israel fell into Soviet influence in the fifties. The greater vissible consequences came during the Six Days War (that ITTL are known in the West as the First Arab War of Agression.), with an Egyptian vitcory and the consolidation of the United Arab republic and Arab Socialism as a minor Cold War player.

The American abandonment of Israel derived in an almost universal European repulse, and culminated in the split of the NATO (which reformed into the broader, much more hawkish International Defense Protocol, an a bitter Anglo-European Split. America, holding the grip in much of the Middle East and considering the third-worldist leaning UAR as a lesser evil, the United States and the British are much more prone to support Islamist regimes and guerrillas, as a valuable ally against communism.

The Chinese diplomatic openness to the West never happened, and though it still reformed eventually, it never distanced itself from the conventional Socialist agenda as much as IOTL. Communism, now led by China, is doing much better, in spite of the Cold War coming to an end (with a nastier result for Russia). Peru is under the Shining Path control, as as Cambodia IOTL (and until today ITTL), had to suffer a significant purge and reform with time, and now it's not nearly as nasty as it used to be. North Korea is still what it is IOTL, and it mantains a strategical association with China (which is growing icreasingly unconfortable about it), but it's pretty much a wild card by every account.

Europe is much more integrated and hawkish, bound by a common defense program since the sixties, though this has led some European countries to adopt a more pacifist-defensive position than the Core nations of the European Defense Pact. Europe and America have been throwing very negative propaganda on each other for decades, and French is the European lingua franca. None the less they still see each other as the lesser evil, and an all-out conflict between them is as unlikely as their mutual collaboration, though proxy fighting in remote fronts is not to be discarded... after all, it has already happened before.

In this much more tense and unstable world, Indhira Ghandi (and his son later on) effectively assumed dictatorial powers in the mid 80s and permanently reformed India on those lines, eventually taking over a war-torn Burma and starting a full Sikh genocide.

The end of the cold war was less nasty for Yugoslavia, where a full European intervention took place, but leaving a very nasty"rump" Serbia as a legacy. Russia, stripped from much of its influence over Eastern Europe, became even more volatile than OTL, and by the late 2000's, the ultranationalist guerrillas had successfully orchestrated a coup d'etat, with a great popular support.

The United Arab Republic has turned our to be one of the greatest menaces to the global stability. When El-Sadat stepped out, leaving the way clear for Saddam Hussein (who ITTL rules from El Cairo), the regime turned much more anti-Western, and tried to make its ideology more exportable outside the Arab world, presenting themselves as a mix of secular nationalism and economic third-positionist option, and as the heralds of the oppressed stateless nations (the Kurds use to think this is some sort of a grim joke on them).

Apart from being the main sponsor of the IRA, the Tamil Eelam Tigers and ETA, as well as an alternate crypto-mesianic Japanese cell, they have managed to create a neo-bolivarian net in Latin America (outside of Colombia, for the FARC don't like competitors), and secular nationalist groups related to the Iranian, Pashtun, Aceh and Sikh peoples... not to tell the own Arab Nationalist guerrillas. ITTL, Baathism is the Big Bad Wolf as much as Islamism is IOTL.

Brazil pretty much falls in the EuroSphere, but suffers from the same problems of drug traffic as Mexico does IOTL... actually, it's even worse, with large areas of Southern Brazil effectively controlled by the Brazilian Militia, a unified narco-terrorist syndicate. Though they have no political allegiances, they suppy weapons to the Ultranationalist Ukrainian cells, wich makes Europe think about a military intervention.

The world is extremely polarized and unstable, and though this world is militarily much more advanced, it is less advanced in many other fields (notabily, there is no Internet at all, though interactive television is a big deal ITTL). The multiple defensive shields prevent an eventual nuclear exchange to have global consequences, but all in all, the world has assumed for the most part, that it's just a matter of time until a miscalculation sparkles the war the world has tried to avoid since 1945...

1000 Battlefronts.png
 
Dominion of Southern America, 1840
The self-government provinces have the Dominion province coloring, while New Mexico and California get the Dominion territory coloring (I think that's the old Dominion coloring) to show that they are Texan. Australasian colonization may be slightly off.
View attachment 102384

I don't see the French in Western Australia. Australia in the 1800s was a no-go area for European powers, exclusively colonised by Britain. Britain made it its mission to take all of Australia and the British have the Royal Navy to hammer in the fact that they aren't ones to be messed with or have their plans ruined.
 
BTW, here's my entry for the latest map contest. It's from on of those "British Federal Empire" dealie timelines - a bit of an extension onto the Cape-Cairo rail, completed circa 1950 in this timeline...

Bruce

Cape to Singapore? That is just beautiful. I love it. :D
 
You know, I'd pay actual money to see a world map eventually... :)


That'll be 50p please!


longwinterworld.png


Notes:
Not shown - New Siberian Lakes, how much bigger the deserts are, several minor states.
The Commonwealth is weaker than it appears as large portions of its territory is desert and scrub land.
The Commonwealth is considered first among equals in a seven poled Great Power system, but the current international order is dependent on the continued support of Nusantara and the Imperial Federation of Bharat (luckily both are rather economically and politically dependent on the commonwealth dispite their sheer populations).
With the changes in Climate Old Mozambique and Queensland are now the agricultural and population backbone of the Commonwealth.
The Subdivisions of China are seperate states.
World population is back to nearly a billion.
 
That'll be 50p please!


Notes:
Not shown - New Siberian Lakes, how much bigger the deserts are, several minor states.
The Commonwealth is weaker than it appears as large portions of its territory is desert and scrub land.
The Commonwealth is considered first among equals in a seven poled Great Power system, but the current international order is dependent on the continued support of Nusantara and the Imperial Federation of Bharat (luckily both are rather economically and politically dependent on the commonwealth dispite their sheer populations).
With the changes in Climate Old Mozambique and Queensland are now the agricultural and population backbone of the Commonwealth.
The Subdivisions of China are seperate states.
World population is back to nearly a billion.

Most interesting! 5 Pounds for a more detailed version... :D

Which state is Nusantara? And what sort of state is Bharat?

Japan, Bharat, the Commonwealth, the Brazilian and Indonesian states, the Omanlis...are the north Chinese/Russians/whatever the seventh power?

Bruce
 
Something for a map series I've been making (1841-present).


The world in 1905;

Following the 2nd Ottoman-Egyptian War when the Great powers intervened a different end to the conflict was decided leading to Egypt gaining full independence.
Egypt has developed to the point where it's comparable to Europe politically and economically, though the Provisional Government has recently called for elections following the 1901 Revolution that deposed the Khediv and established the Egyptian Republic, which many are now watching keenly to see how the country will move forward.

The Second Mexican Empire continued on with a mixture of active French support and Maximilian I siding with the Liberals (rather than being in-between, pissing off both sides).
Mexico is now a prosperous, Liberal nation allied with France and closer to Europe than the rest of the America's.

The rest of the world has developed more or less as per OTL.

1905.PNG
 
Most interesting! 5 Pounds for a more detailed version... :D

Which state is Nusantara? And what sort of state is Bharat?

Japan, Bharat, the Commonwealth, the Brazilian and Indonesian states, the Omanlis...are the north Chinese/Russians/whatever the seventh power?

Bruce

Bharat is a federal constitutional elective monarchy, the Commonwealth King as a pretty powerless Emperor and a Premier Prince taken from the states (the British chopped up the old presidencies when they restored order in India some thirty years after the Fall and installed loyal locals as new Princes). Note the deserts of western India have expanded and the rivers of the Ganges plains have seen a lot of their flow locked up in the new Himalayan ice cap.

Nusantara is the Indonesian state, the attempts of the Dutch to maintain long term control with the relatively small population of a few million that ended up there after the Fall were ridicilious, and the Commonwealth forced a transistion to native/mixed rule (since the Javan agri products are crucially important to feeding the world), and repatriated the hardliner Dutch to Australia. Quite similar to what happened in the French republic that relocated to Indochina, though the resultant state had very different opinions on the Commonwealth to the Malays.

Brazil is the small green state, the light blue one is something else entirely ;). Whilst the Hetmanates are strong an tough, they're not exactly involved in global politics.

A more detailed version will take weeks and weeks unfortunately.
 
What created the lakes near Deseret and that huge lake in the north?

The lake in Nevada (the return of Lake Lahontan) expanded due to it being colder and therefore less evaporation occurring. The crudity of the lines conceal how in actuality it has a considerably higher fractal dimension and is smaller than it appears here.

The Lakes in the north (including a new Agassiz) and their counterparts in Siberia are from the ice cap blocking the mouths of north flowing rivers.
 
A more detailed version will take weeks and weeks unfortunately.

Christ. Why do you have to be so ridiculously talented? I want more of your "British Tartary" series, and then you come up with this! For all that is good and holy, please please PLEASE finish this! Make a super-detailed world map of this! We eagerly await!
 
Okay. So I'm thinking of doing a timeline this summer. I had an idea while reviewing for my AP European History exam, and traced a map for it (this is a scanned, digitally altered version).

If any German or Ottoman experts think this is too ASB...tell me now.

So, for the POD, I'm thinking of the Protestants having some better luck, and perhaps Wallenstein surviving his assassination attempt and defecting to the anti-Imperial/Protestant side.

After that, I imagine a group of Catholic princes looking to find a middle ground allying themselves against the emperor, and the combined anti-Imperial forces allying with the Ottomans to attack Vienna.

In the end, the Protestant/anti-Imperial side wins, with the Emperor refusing to accept the terms of the peace treaty and fleeing Austria for Italy. A junior Austrian Hapsburg line willing to accept the new order assumes the throne, with vastly reduced powers. The Ottomans administer Lower Austria and Styria more or less as vassals, and the new Imperial government does so with Carinthia and Upper Austria. Carniola becomes a tightly controlled Ottoman vassal. Fiume is an Imperial port.

As for what the "new order" is... the Imperial Throne is permanently vacated, and the Emperor's powers are given to a Crown Council, made up of the Electors, a few other representatives to balance the religious groups out, a representative for dissenting Christian groups (non-Trinitarians, Anabaptists), and a representative for the very, very few Muslims of the empire (required by the Ottomans in their agreements with the Empire after the fall of Vienna; they have a good amount of influence as the deciding factor in the war).

The new Imperial government is a compromise between absolute centralization and full independence. The principle of Cuius regio, eius religio remains, and states may still go to war with one another and with states outside the empire. However, the imperial government plus other concerned German states may intervene to prevent a war that may endanger the whole empire. The Imperial Government levies a light tax on all classes of society across the empire, as well as gaining revenue from tariffs and taxes in imperially controlled lands. Otherwise, the states may make their own economic policies.

A couple of cities have been designated as havens for dissenter Christians, Jews, and Muslims, who may worship in private residences with no more than 20 people at a time. Otherwise, people who do not share their rulers’ religion must leave the state or convert.

The Catholic Church is absolutely forbidden from interfering in German affairs, and the Pope, while frustrated with the compromising Catholics, has to let them operate as they wish or risk losing them to Protestantism. France takes a more active military role in the war and is given France-Comte and a bit of OTL Belgium. The Netherlands is rewarded for their military role with a few scraps of land, too. The Empire’s name is changed from “Holy Roman” to “Holy German” to emphasize its independence. The claim to the throne of Italy is given up.

Oh, and the Ottomans get imperial Hungary. And Venice becomes a buffer between the Ottomans, HGE, and the Catholic League.

It's really all very messy and subject to change...


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I’m thinking of in the future (~1690) having a Napoleon-esque figure who centralizes the government and whose son continues his work and reinstates the monarchy (with himself as emperor). Maybe in the late 1700s there could be a German revolution. Oh, yeah, in the late 1600s the HE goes to war with the Ottomans and gets lots of land. And they’ll probably face a war with France, too, as Germany will likely get too centralized for France’s tastes. And I think the Spanish Hapsburgs will give the deposed Austrian Hapsburgs Milan. I don’t know what will happen when/if the Spanish Hapsburgs go extinct. Probably the deposed Austrians will inherit. And I don’t know what’s going on in the British Isles…it would be more interesting if the civil war went differently. Lastly, Trent secedes from the empire, coming under strong Papal influence. Italy will likely be more centralized in this TL…
 

Susano

Banned
Well, Mahajrajh, that would require... uh, that would require a vasallisation of the HRE by the Ottomans, really. Two points:

1)Concerning the Ottoman Empire, it and Austria in the 16th and 17th century never even conducted peace treaties, because there could be no peace between with the evil Muslims/Christians ;) Well, de facto of course they had years long truces, but this shows a great unwillingness to give the other any legal status at all. However, if the Ottomans are not given a legal status, how can they become legal vasalls of the Imperial throne for Styria and Austria? Only possible if the Ottomans were successful in such a way as the HRE ending up as vasall...

2) And as for the religious minorities, even the Protestants fought them, so why would they end up with a place in the Empire at the end? Thats only possible if somebody defends them and guarantees their place, like the Ottoman Empire. But that would again require a position of the HRE vis a vis the Ottomans thats as said that of a vasall.

So... yeah, under that condition its possible, I guess, but of course that would be a radical departure from OTL, and maybe not quite what you had in mind... as "compromise" with the Ottomans and the religious minorities it doesnt really work, I would say.
 
Well, Mahajrajh, that would require... uh, that would require a vasallisation of the HRE by the Ottomans, really. Two points:

1)Concerning the Ottoman Empire, it and Austria in the 16th and 17th century never even conducted peace treaties, because there could be no peace between with the evil Muslims/Christians ;) Well, de facto of course they had years long truces, but this shows a great unwillingness to give the other any legal status at all. However, if the Ottomans are not given a legal status, how can they become legal vasalls of the Imperial throne for Styria and Austria? Only possible if the Ottomans were successful in such a way as the HRE ending up as vasall...

2) And as for the religious minorities, even the Protestants fought them, so why would they end up with a place in the Empire at the end? Thats only possible if somebody defends them and guarantees their place, like the Ottoman Empire. But that would again require a position of the HRE vis a vis the Ottomans thats as said that of a vasall.

So... yeah, under that condition its possible, I guess, but of course that would be a radical departure from OTL, and maybe not quite what you had in mind... as "compromise" with the Ottomans and the religious minorities it doesnt really work, I would say.

Well, the non-persecution of Anabaptists isn't a huge aspect of the idea I had in mind. I guess I was thinking it was mostly so they wouldn't cause trouble in other princely states.

And I didn't actually mean that Lower Austria and Styria would be vassals, they'd just be...a sphere of influence, sort of. But I guess any such arrangement would require recognition. But I don't think it's impossible - the Ottomans tried to reach out to the Protestants of the Netherlands in the early 1500s, and France formed an alliance with the Ottomans.

EDIT: Oh, and the Muslim member of the crown council isn't an essential element, either.
 
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