WI — Mondale takes pass on running in 1984 against Reagan ? ?

[Dancing Fool]

And therefore, Gary Hart is probably the nominee. Let’s say he makes a semi-respectful 45 % showing against Reagan.

Hart runs on “new economy” instead of same-old, same-old.

Therefore, there’s more discussion on how the U.S. can compete against Japan and South Korea in manufacturing. But, there are not many good moves to make, to be honest about it and all.

There is raising the “salary threshold” which encourages companies to spread out available jobs.

But as far as creating new jobs which pay middle-class or above . . .

 

[Garrison]

It's not going to matter who the Democratic Party puts up in 1984. Reagan is a popular incumbent who survived and assassination attempt and unless the economy is suddenly going to nosedive he will win handily.

 

[Aisha Clan-Clan]

You get the corporate neoliberals trying and failing in '84 and '88. Hart flops in 1984, Clinton in 1988. Good ol' east coast liberal Mario Cuomo takes power in 1992.

 

[AlterKnacker]

It's not going to matter who the Democratic Party puts up in 1984. Reagan is a popular incumbent who survived and assassination attempt and unless the economy is suddenly going to nosedive he will win handily.

In 1984, a popular comic strip "Bloom County" had a story line about their "Meadow Party" running Bill the Cat for president. In one strip during the conventions, a Mondale delegate walks into the wrong conference room. On being informed, he says, "So who* are you guys running against Mondale in the Fall?"
"A dead cat," he's told. "Eh, what the heck," he says, and goes on in.

No one was expecting Mondale, or anyone else, to seriously challenge Reagan in '84.

*edit: typo

 

[Mynock]

You get the corporate neoliberals trying and failing in '84 and '88. Hart flops in 1984, Clinton in 1988. Good ol' east coast liberal Mario Cuomo takes power in 1992.

If there was going to be a southerner in '88 it would have been Gore.

 

[Dancing Fool]

Reagan is a popular incumbent who survived and assassination attempt and unless the economy is suddenly going to nosedive

or anyone else, to seriously challenge Reagan in '84

The economy didn’t nosedive, but neither was it all that great.

The economy was only very slowly coming out of the serious 1982 Recession which had had double-digit unemployment. In both Nov. 82 and Dec. 82, the unemployment rate had been 10.8 %. This is the number most commonly reported in the news. But it ignores discouraged workers, and it ignores people working part-time who are seeking full-time.

 

[Dancing Fool]

Address Accepting the Presidential Nomination at the Democratic National Convention in San Francisco | The American Presidency Project

www.presidency.ucsb.edu

July 19, 1984 —

“Let's tell the truth. It must be done, it must be done. Mr. Reagan will raise taxes, and so will I. He won't tell you. I just did.”

————————————

And that’s why Mondale only got 40 % of the popular vote in 1984.

40.6 percent to be exact.

 

[Dancing Fool]

Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

But President Bush signed the “Omnibus Budget . . ” early Nov. 1990, during the ramp-up to the Persian Gulf War. In January 1991, Operation “Desert Shield” would become “Desert Storm.”

And President Bush said 2 dollars of cuts for every 1 dollar of tax increase.

Some conversatives said No, we’ll backslide on the spending cuts.

But it looks like most cuts stuck.

https://www.cbpp.org/research/history-shows-spending-cuts-in-deficit-reduction-packages-stick

But not everyone agrees

Tax Foundation
page 4—
“Indeed, the administration's original pledge—that every dollar of tax increases be matched by two dollars in spending cuts—had been abandoned.”

==================


Just the sheer, frustrating . .

welter of complications!

It’s hard to tell what’s going on. People kind of have open-field to believe whatever they want,

I think it’s under-estimated how much people dislike politics in which the politician comes across as a car salesman or saleswoman throwing a bunch of numbers at you.

 

[raharris1973]

Just the sheer, frustrating . .

welter of complications!

It’s hard to tell what’s going on. People kind of have open-field to believe whatever they want,

I think it’s under-estimated how much people dislike politics in which the politician comes across as a car salesman or saleswoman throwing a bunch of numbers at you.

Not "Mathletes, eh?"

 

[Seandineen]

In 1984, a popular comic strip "Bloom County" had a story line about their "Meadow Party" running Bill the Cat for president. In one strip during the conventions, a Mondale delegate walks into the wrong conference room. On being informed, he says, "So who* are you guys running against Mondale in the Fall?"
"A dead cat," he's told. "Eh, what the heck," he says, and goes on in.

No one was expecting Mondale, or anyone else, to seriously challenge Reagan in '84.

*edit: typo

John Glenn might get the nod.

 

[Dancing Fool]

Not "Mathletes, eh?"

Yeah, it sounds ridiculous. So, the objection is just the effing math? ! ?

Well, it’s the fact that it’s imposed upon the citizen. Also the fact that the IRS can go back 5 or 7 years, unlimited in the case of fraud. Please don’t do it.

So, the idea that you’re being labeled as not good enough or not smart enough, or not organized enough. And the idea that someone else is getting a break but not you.

 

[Dancing Fool]

John Glenn might get the nod.

Did Senator Glenn have a reputation as a bit of a boy scout?

 

[Don Corleone]

Omnibus Budget Reconciliation Act of 1990 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

But President Bush signed the “Omnibus Budget . . ” early Nov. 1990, during the ramp-up to the Persian Gulf War. In January 1991, Operation “Desert Shield” would become “Desert Storm.”

And President Bush said 2 dollars of cuts for every 1 dollar of tax increase.

Some conversatives said No, we’ll backslide on the spending cuts.

But it looks like most cuts stuck.

https://www.cbpp.org/research/history-shows-spending-cuts-in-deficit-reduction-packages-stick

But not everyone agrees

Tax Foundation
page 4—
“Indeed, the administration's original pledge—that every dollar of tax increases be matched by two dollars in spending cuts—had been abandoned.”

==================


Just the sheer, frustrating . .

welter of complications!

It’s hard to tell what’s going on. People kind of have open-field to believe whatever they want,

I think it’s under-estimated how much people dislike politics in which the politician comes across as a car salesman or saleswoman throwing a bunch of numbers at you.

Read My Lips was the tagline in the 1992 campaign. The full context was even worse. HW said Congress would try to raise taxes and he would stand up to them. They did and he didn't.

 

[Dancing Fool]

The full context was even worse. HW said Congress would try to raise taxes and he would stand up to them.

Thank you. I did not know this.

However,

I’m still thinking a “2 for 1” deal is pretty good. And it was during the ramp-up to war time when it’s important to have your financial house in order.

 

[Seandineen]

John Glenn might get the nod.

The archtypical gentleman, who never seemed to put a foot wrong.

 

[Mark E.]

In 1984, inflation dropped. Fuel prices stabilized. Housing prices dropped or stabilized. The incumbent (Reagan) was a guaranteed winner. John Glenn was a good candidate, but he ran out of money. He had potential for 1988. To me, Mondale was a fall-back candidate when Reagan was guaranteed re-election.

 

[Dancing Fool]

Read My Lips was the tagline in the 1992 campaign. The full context was even worse. HW said Congress would try to raise taxes and he would stand up to them. They did and he didn't.

Address Accepting the Presidential Nomination at the Republican National Convention in New Orleans | The American Presidency Project

www.presidency.ucsb.edu

‘ . . And I'm the one who will not raise taxes. My opponent now says he'll raise them as a last resort or a third resort. When a politician talks like that, you know that's one resort he'll be checking into. My opponent won't rule out raising taxes, but I will, and the Congress will push me to raise taxes, and I'll say no, and they'll push, and I'll say no, and they'll push again, and I'll say to them, "Read my lips: no new taxes." . . ’

———————//————————

You’re right. Vice-President George H. W. Bush really, really , REALLY underscored this promise. And then as President, he didn’t follow it. even if I myself might be saying he got a good “2 for 1” deal.

song lyrics —

“If I was President
“And the Congress called my name
“I’d say ‘now who do . . .
“‘Who do you think you’re fooling?’”

— from “Loves Me Like A Rock,” Paul Simon, 1973

Okay, so a full decade and a half before the 1988 campaign. But still appropriate. Taxes are being viewed as a temptation & sin kind of thing. It’s assumed that the politician is not on our side, and that he’s seduced soon after reaching Washington.

 

[Dancing Fool]

So, what the hell happened between Governor Clinton being elected with high hopes in 1992, and Newt Gingrich and the Republicans retaking the House in 94 ? ! ?

Was it Clinton going the route of NAFTA instead of retraining middle-aged workers?


* Actually, I don’t think training middle-aged workers to be computer programmers will work all that well. For starters, the companies want younger workers without family responsibilities who’ll happily work 70+ hrs a week!

 

[Don Corleone]

So, what the hell happened between Governor Clinton being elected with high hopes in 1992, and Newt Gingrich and the Republicans retaking the House in 94 ? ! ?

Was it Clinton going the route of NAFTA instead of retraining middle-aged workers?


* Actually, I don’t think training middle-aged workers to be computer programmers will work all that well. For starters, the companies want younger workers without family responsibilities who’ll happily work 70+ hrs a week!

Several factors.

There were a number of unpopular policy initiatives in 1993 and 1994. Including the assault weapons ban and tax increases.

There were scandals like Rostenkowski.

There were debacles including Waco and Black Hawk Down.

The post 1990 redistricting created a number of black majority districts in the South, which made the remaining districts in those states more Republican. Bush's unpopularity delayed the effect. In addition you had longtime incumbents like Whitten in Mississippi who were keeping districts artificially blue. He retired that year.

Finally you had the Contract with America. The GOP was offering a coherent policy agenda.

 

[Dancing Fool]

There were a number of unpopular policy initiatives in 1993 and 1994. Including the assault weapons ban and tax increases.

There were scandals like Rostenkowski.

There were debacles including Waco and Black Hawk Down.

This mirrors real life! I can’t respond to all of them.

If I was a Democrat back in 1994 and my friend was a Republican . . . well, he or she would have their constellation of issues, and I’d have mine.

On raising taxes . . . I’m thinking this was on upper income taxpayers, I’m guessing above $120,000 maybe ? ? ? But that would be inside baseball kind of stuff, and I think we’d both agree that’s not enough.

What President Clinton should have done —

was to push a plan to reduce the 25 % bracket to 22 % for a goodly amount of travel distance. And that 3 % reduction would have been an actual middle-class tax cut. It also reduces this stupid and abrupt jump from the 15 % to the 25 % bracket.