AHC: Overthrow the Japanese monarchy
- Thread starter walmart
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Actually, a POD with the Shogunate surviving longer makes that possible.
Carter I'm Yog
Banned
Does OP insist on a POD in 1800? Because I have a friend who is working on a timeline that has Chiang Kai-Shek fleeing to Japan after losing intra-KMT power struggles, hires an army, and with Kita Ikki overthrows the Tenno in a Japanese civil war. I am still trying to have him give me the details though, but he works at nuclear plants at his day job so it ain't coming anytime soon.
Japanese emperor during shogunate was even weaker than nowadays if possible. They hardly see that being needful.
Yeah, but a longer surviving Shogunate makes something similar to that of Russia or France where the people depose the monarchy and the shogunate altogether a possibility especially if they lose a war.
Same could be said of a lot of monarchies historical
That wasn't always the case post Meiji, not to mention even powerless monarchies have been overthrown.
Deleted member 147978
The Imperial Family during the Shogunates from what all I know, was a figurehead family.
The Shogunates held the real power until the Meiji Restoration.
The Shogunates held the real power until the Meiji Restoration.
Paradoxer
Banned
Agreed, that’s second most likely way behind above. But it would be challenge even for shogun who power is largely unchallenged. But that turns Japan in stratocracy state instead
Paradoxer
Banned
I think none are fit comparison since without emperor Japanese likely become stratocracy and oligarch system. A napoleonic regime without emperor might be better comparison
The Shogunate persists for another 40 years. The Mikado remains a powerless figurehead, of little significance to the average Japanese. (The Emperor cult was largely invented and retconned by the Meiji genro.) Circa 1910, the incompetent Shogun is overthrown by a clever-dick imperial heir who manages to gain real power. He's a modernist who tries to follow the current European model of monarchy; instead of remaining a remote, semi-divine figure, he tries to be Edward VII-san. But due to greed and lechery, he ends up more like Carol II of Romania. Being a clever-dick, he overreaches, and loses a war, discrediting the monarchy before it can be built up into a cult.
The crown grossly mismanages the response to the Great Kanto Earthquake. A year later, popular discontent rises to a movement that overthrows him and abolishes the monarchy.
The crown grossly mismanages the response to the Great Kanto Earthquake. A year later, popular discontent rises to a movement that overthrows him and abolishes the monarchy.
I feel like first and foremost this would need the Kobu Gattai movement to prevail. Without the unification of the 2 courts the end of either would more likely result in the supremacy of the other rather than a complete abolition of both. Additionally it would help for the leaders to be more traditionalist (while western ideas keep flooding into the country). This weaker, more feudalistic Japan then gets beaten by a western power during a war, the reputation of the court and emperor is shattered, and they are overthrown, abolished, and replaced with a republic.
Paradoxer
Banned
I don’t think so because Japanese have much more militaristic culture and structure then China ever had especially by that time.
Also more homogeneous especially on home islands. I don’t think after Meji civil war you will see any large scale conflicts like that. But fast transitions to new regime by coup or revolution or both together
Most of what we think as Japanese culture was created during the Meji period, so if you avoid it you avoid alot of the things that keep the monarchy today. You won't have shinto as we know it today, you won't have the emperor cult, you won't have militarism and nationalism to the same extent.
If the Turks could dump the Khalif of Islam, the dynasty that created Turkey, and the Chinese could dump the Son of Heaven, then the Japanese could dump their god emperor. More so if they don't see him as a living god in the first place..
If the Turks could dump the Khalif of Islam, the dynasty that created Turkey, and the Chinese could dump the Son of Heaven, then the Japanese could dump their god emperor. More so if they don't see him as a living god in the first place..