Did Hitler/Stalin have any actual friends?
- Thread starter John Dusk
- Start date
Hitler only seemed to care about his dogs and Eva Braun. As far as Stalin goes, even those closest to him could become his victims. So no, I don't think Stalin had friends in the normal sense of the world.
TheSpectacledCloth
Gone Fishin'
Well, after the suicide of Nadezhda (Stalin's second wife), the only one the Soviet leader cared about was Valentina, his mistress. He abandoned all other social relations as a result of Nadezhda's death. As for Hitler, he did find great relationships with Ernst Rohm, Hermann Goering and Albert Speer, though each once had it's fatal decline. Hitler did care about Eva Braun, but his war and public position always surpassed any feeling he had for her. He also had a deep relationship with his niece before she committed suicide. Hitler probably loved Blondie, his most famous dog, the most.
Well. Define 'friend'.
Stalin by many accounts, was apparently a social animal. He liked talking to people and joking around, especially in the civil war days. He was also, you know, Stalin. So in a sense, he did have certain people he preferred socializing and going for drinks with, but would also not hesitate to betray them in a heartbeat. Bukharin wrote a note to Stalin before his execution which Stalin kept in his desk for the rest of his life.
Hitler, not as sure. He definitely had favorites, particularly those who corresponded to his world view. And Blondie. His preferred pastime was having people listen to him talk, and sometimes people would be invited to vacation with him for that purpose. He also liked telling jokes (but not as joker like Stalin).
And only slightly related, but the Braun sisters were total party girls. Hitler apparently wasn't a fan.
Stalin by many accounts, was apparently a social animal. He liked talking to people and joking around, especially in the civil war days. He was also, you know, Stalin. So in a sense, he did have certain people he preferred socializing and going for drinks with, but would also not hesitate to betray them in a heartbeat. Bukharin wrote a note to Stalin before his execution which Stalin kept in his desk for the rest of his life.
Hitler, not as sure. He definitely had favorites, particularly those who corresponded to his world view. And Blondie. His preferred pastime was having people listen to him talk, and sometimes people would be invited to vacation with him for that purpose. He also liked telling jokes (but not as joker like Stalin).
And only slightly related, but the Braun sisters were total party girls. Hitler apparently wasn't a fan.
Wallet
Banned
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/August_Kubizek
August Kubizek was friends with Hitler while they both lived in Vienna as artists. After Germany occupied Austria, Hitler invited Kubizek for a meeting. Hitler offered to pay for Kubizek's sons education in the arts.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_Moritz_Hess
Ernst Hess was Hitler's Jewish commander. He gave him special protection. During the war it was revoked and he was sent to a camp but it's not sure rather Hitler did it himself.
I think Hitler had friends as a young man and thought about them sometimes but things had changed
August Kubizek was friends with Hitler while they both lived in Vienna as artists. After Germany occupied Austria, Hitler invited Kubizek for a meeting. Hitler offered to pay for Kubizek's sons education in the arts.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ernst_Moritz_Hess
Ernst Hess was Hitler's Jewish commander. He gave him special protection. During the war it was revoked and he was sent to a camp but it's not sure rather Hitler did it himself.
I think Hitler had friends as a young man and thought about them sometimes but things had changed
Max Sinister
Banned
Ernst Röhm was on first-name base ("per Du") with Hitler, but with friends like these...
Redbeard
Banned
The higher you are in politics the more difficult is to have friends - or be friendly!
Democracy or dictatorships is not the main thing here, that is more about how far you can take not being friends, but getting power and keeping it simply requires a ruthlessness which is very difficult to understand for outsiders. That of course include having allies/friends - it after all is very important not to be enemy of too many at any one time, but you also have to be able and willing to discard alliances and stab friends in the back - if it serves you! The big question of course is judging what "serves you" - and the back-stab that serves you here and now might be very damaging tomorrow.
As the word itself indicate all this "back-stabbing" is worst among friends and I've heard many politicians say that the only friendships (in the private sense) they've had with other politicians were with persons from other parties. The persons from your own party are your daily rivals for all kinds of things whereas the rivalry with those from other parties is limited to relatively rare occasions and anyway relatively symbolic and highly regulated.
So no, Hitler and Stalin had no friends, but neither has the PM, the Kanzler nor the Statsminister. Power can have an incredibly high price!
Democracy or dictatorships is not the main thing here, that is more about how far you can take not being friends, but getting power and keeping it simply requires a ruthlessness which is very difficult to understand for outsiders. That of course include having allies/friends - it after all is very important not to be enemy of too many at any one time, but you also have to be able and willing to discard alliances and stab friends in the back - if it serves you! The big question of course is judging what "serves you" - and the back-stab that serves you here and now might be very damaging tomorrow.
As the word itself indicate all this "back-stabbing" is worst among friends and I've heard many politicians say that the only friendships (in the private sense) they've had with other politicians were with persons from other parties. The persons from your own party are your daily rivals for all kinds of things whereas the rivalry with those from other parties is limited to relatively rare occasions and anyway relatively symbolic and highly regulated.
So no, Hitler and Stalin had no friends, but neither has the PM, the Kanzler nor the Statsminister. Power can have an incredibly high price!
They were both demosntrably mentally unstable in a way that affected the formation and nature of interpersonal
relationships. However, to the best of my knowledge, neither ever had a formal diagnosis, so it's impossible
to answer the question definitively, but we can make educated guesses.
relationships. However, to the best of my knowledge, neither ever had a formal diagnosis, so it's impossible
to answer the question definitively, but we can make educated guesses.
Max Sinister
Banned
Nobody ever tried a diagnosis? Can't be.
Hitler at least left a book and many speeches to work with.
And Stalin was a paranoid bastard, to say the least. Given how many high-ranked Communists and officers he had killed or sent to the GULAG...
Hitler at least left a book and many speeches to work with.
And Stalin was a paranoid bastard, to say the least. Given how many high-ranked Communists and officers he had killed or sent to the GULAG...
The Psychopathic God, by Robert Waite. I believe he was an army psychologist during the war, maybe did a profile of Hitler.
The book is heavy on the psychoanalysis, perhaps extravagantly so, but avoids drawing sensationalist conclusions. For example, while Waite thinks that Hitler had latent homosexual tendencies, he concludes that he probably didn't engage in homosexual relations, and was basically heterosexual. Though he does present some sort of evidence that Hitler enjoyed having his niece urinate on him.
As for the less lurid stuff, Waite thinks that Hitler didn't have Jewish blood, but was paranoid that he did. (Not hard to believe, I guess, since you know what they say about those who scream against something the loudest...)
You can't have friends unless you can trust. While as young men Hitler and Stalin may have had friends (or not) as they advanced in their careers it was evident they trusted nobody. Partly that was because the systems they worked in made "Byzantine" look like a child care center, but probably for the most part it was due to their inherent personalities. There is no doubt that both of them were deeply disturbed mentally and had many psychopathic attributes.
One of the hallmarks of a full blown psychopath is a lack of empathy - they see other people not as humans who to one degree or another resemble themselves, but rather as objects to be manipulated. True psychopaths may torture or mistreat people directly, but are not sadists who derive sexual pleasure from this as in order to derive sexual pleasure from another person there needs to be some degree of empathy which psychopaths lack.
To the extent Hitler and Stalin were somewhere on the psychopathic scale, and I won't try and estimate where between 0 and 100%, their lack of empathy makes it possible for them to be very slick socially, a jolly companion at a party, but a friend - nope.
One of the hallmarks of a full blown psychopath is a lack of empathy - they see other people not as humans who to one degree or another resemble themselves, but rather as objects to be manipulated. True psychopaths may torture or mistreat people directly, but are not sadists who derive sexual pleasure from this as in order to derive sexual pleasure from another person there needs to be some degree of empathy which psychopaths lack.
To the extent Hitler and Stalin were somewhere on the psychopathic scale, and I won't try and estimate where between 0 and 100%, their lack of empathy makes it possible for them to be very slick socially, a jolly companion at a party, but a friend - nope.
Friends don't have friends shot. That's just under "Don't sleep with your friend's S.O." in the Friendship Rulebook.
thaddeus
Donor
thought Hitler was close to his pilot? or that may be post-war spin? Hans Baur https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Baur