"Play nice"...No way. An alternative Video Games History

nezza · Feb 28, 2013

BBC News December 1993

"The Christmas rush is in full swing with experts predicting a record season of profits.

No area is more hotly anticipated that the video console sector. Two alliances have been pushing their products with wall to wall media coverage and glamorous videos.

On one side is the X-3DO, the machine from Sega and Microsoft which can play games from Sega's extensive back catalogue as way as PC games.

On the other side is the i-Play from Nintendo and Apple. As well as backward compatibility with Nintendo's catalogue the system is also designed to be creative with integrated video and audio creation software.

Both machine will also play new CD based games featuring iconic characters
Mario and Sonic

Both machines are expected to retail for £250 to £300".

juanml82 · Feb 28, 2013

Shamelessly breaking the thread: X-3DO sounds too much like the 3DO, another videogame console made by Panasonic by 1993, which ended up as a commercial failure. And a console which can also plays DOS games sounds like a PC with a genesis/master system emulator (yes, it has to be an emulator, as the Genesis processor wasn't an X86 processor). I don't know if the computer power was there by 1993, at least for a consumer (ie, not too expensive) device, and it would also require keyboard and mouse, which wouldn't make it look like a toy. I dunno, it might work, assuming it can deal with emulating Genesis games, but I'm not sure about the MSRP and the whole "Boot, wait a while, and type DOS commands in your game console" marketing in that timeframe.

The 'iPlay' probably faces similar challenges, except for the typing command issues, as it would have an operating system with GUI. OTOH, there is no way a cheap computer can edit video by 1993 - it wouldn't have the power to digitize it and certainly not the processing power or storage space. Non linear video editing was expensive stuff for TV channels back then.

athleticsfan2kx · Feb 28, 2013

Good Work, On The Start of Your Timeline on Video Games, I Hope We Could See what will happen to the Playstation as we get to the 1990's and the 2000's in this Alternate Timeline of Video Games because Microsoft is Excited to See the X-3DO in action and maybe we can See the Madden NFL Video Games Existing ITTL for EA Sports along with NBA Live and Triple Play Baseball, Looking Forward to It!

Nivek · Feb 28, 2013

juanml82 said:
Shamelessly breaking the thread: X-3DO sounds too much like the 3DO, another videogame console made by Panasonic by 1993, which ended up as a commercial failure. And a console which can also plays DOS games sounds like a PC with a genesis/master system emulator (yes, it has to be an emulator, as the Genesis processor wasn't an X86 processor). I don't know if the computer power was there by 1993, at least for a consumer (ie, not too expensive) device, and it would also require keyboard and mouse, which wouldn't make it look like a toy. I dunno, it might work, assuming it can deal with emulating Genesis games, but I'm not sure about the MSRP and the whole "Boot, wait a while, and type DOS commands in your game console" marketing in that timeframe.

The 'iPlay' probably faces similar challenges, except for the typing command issues, as it would have an operating system with GUI. OTOH, there is no way a cheap computer can edit video by 1993 - it wouldn't have the power to digitize it and certainly not the processing power or storage space. Non linear video editing was expensive stuff for TV channels back then.

The N64 have a Art Studio, AN aUDIO editor and a polygon editor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Artist#Talent_Studio

but again the dates are too early, why 1993? i would belive you if was 2003, what happened to Sony? to Philips? to NEC?

Anyway nice idea, and how Nintendo and Apple work together?

Kalvan · Feb 28, 2013

It's probably an amalgamation of 3DO and MSX Turbo R.

nezza · Mar 3, 2013

Nivek said:
The N64 have a Art Studio, AN aUDIO editor and a polygon editor: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mario_Artist#Talent_Studio

but again the dates are too early, why 1993? i would belive you if was 2003, what happened to Sony? to Philips? to NEC?

Anyway nice idea, and how Nintendo and Apple work together?

Good point re the date.

Quick redux. It's December 2003. Everything else is the same.

New information

Both machines have internet content.

The X3DO markets itself as an arcade machine/hi end pc Gamestation. Its aimed at two markets. The casual gamer and the serious RPG fan.

It comes with both a joypad and keyboard/mouse combination

The i-Play is revolutionary in its content. It's connections include S-Video, composite video and VGA to connect up to a special monitor which is included with a Master Pack costing £400 (although a simpler Fun Pack is available sans monitor at £250).

With the Master Pack as well as a joypad there is a well specified video editing console unit.

The basic technical specs are as follows.

X-3DO
500 GB memory
4GB RAM

Cartridge slot for Master System and Megadrive games, CD Drive for Sega CD, PC-CD and Audio CD.

i-Play

750 GB (300 GB for Game saves)
8GB (6GB for video editing)

Cartridge slot for Gameboy games, (all variations with colour emulator) NES/Famicom, SNES/Super Famicom and CD drive for Nintendo CD games, blank DVD's

Preinstalled software.
i-Movie, i-DVD, i-tunes, Garageband.

Tallest Skil · Mar 3, 2013

nezza said:
…i-Play… …i-Movie, i-DVD, i-tunes…

*trembling with barely-contained rage*

Ahem.

OOC: Given that it's now December 2003, the iPlay would have ADC out to a specialized monitor, not VGA or anything else. And quite probably it would use FireWire for the controller, but you never mentioned those.

Of course, unless ADC is handled differently TTL (it most certainly would be), the iPlay is relegated to the backwater of history. In fact, the whole "specialized display" is going to do that in the first place; you'd probably want ADC as the port used for video out, a cable included to make it run to any television, but then you can use any ADC cable to connect to any ADC monitor for those extra features.

nezza · Mar 3, 2013

Tallest Skil said:
*trembling with barely-contained rage*

Ahem.

OOC: Given that it's now December 2003, the iPlay would have ADC out to a specialized monitor, not VGA or anything else. And quite probably it would use FireWire for the controller, but you never mentioned those.

Of course, unless ADC is handled differently TTL (it most certainly would be), the iPlay is relegated to the backwater of history. In fact, the whole "specialized display" is going to do that in the first place; you'd probably want ADC as the port used for video out, a cable included to make it run to any television, but then you can use any ADC cable to connect to any ADC monitor for those extra features.

Yes of course

Includes firewire and ADC

nezza · Mar 5, 2013

The two consoles have gone through several name changes over the last couple of years. The X-3DO was originally called the Phoenix and the i-Play was known as the Revolution

(NB-thanks to the original up loaders)

First the Phoenix

nezza · Mar 5, 2013

And the Revolution:

Nivek · Mar 5, 2013

Your timeline is interesting but you should explain the background elements better... what happened to both Nintendo and Sega, how they allign with Apple and Microsoft respectly, how those tech companies enter to console(were interested in OTL, the former with distrasous result and the later more bette performance), and what happened to Sony, SNK or NEC? those were in the market and what happened to those one?

The console uses DVD? so Sony is there somehow....

a background study will be nice(what happened to apple, to microsoft, SEGA, Nintendo)for the good of the timeline.

nezza · Mar 5, 2013

Many thanks for your response. A background study is a good idea...

1.Microsoft and Sega.

For Microsoft it was an image thing. There was no doubt at all that when it came to the computing world they were the masters of all they surveyed. Windows despite all the criticism over market domination and continual upgrades was THE name associated with home computing.

There was no doubt that the various GUI improvements from 3.1 upwards had made computing easier on the eye. Likewise the arrival of Windows 95 with their advertising campaign had led to an explosion in beige boxy PC's across the planet.

But it was the gaming sector that was the bugbear. Yes, PC's did play games but mainly simulators and RPG's and despite the company's obvious domination in Europe and the USA. it was the Far East where the serious interest lay and the epicentre of that was Japan.

The truth was Microsoft wasn't a well known name in Japan. The likes of Sony and NEC were the computer firms there while Sega and Nintendo were the big game firms.

Microsoft wanted in on Japan but they realised that they simply couldn't buy their way to success. Instead Bill Gates made a decision that some would say was totally against character. He sought an alliance...

In 1999, C+VG magazine in the UK were the first to reveal that Microsoft had sent a senior member of staff to Japan for a video game convention. The article ended with the rhetorical question:

"what does this new ingredient in the japanese mixture mean..."?

For Sega the alliance was the first step in the realisation that their domination of their home market was coming to an end.

The 1990's had not been a good decade for the big "S". There had been a series of flops and disasters from the Mega CD and the 32X to the Saturn which was briefly a ray of hope for them....That was until Sony and SNK shocked the world with the creation of the "Neo"

Sega were in trouble. They still had huge gaming strength but their days as a hardware producer were numbered.

Again C+VG postulated on this:

"Sega is at a crossroads. Its hardware division is demoralised. The question they are asking is 'could Sega cut it as a wholly software based company or will they throw in the towel and farm out their products to others...Sonic on Nintendo?..."

In September 2001 Sega and Microsoft announced they were working on a new hybrid machine which would use both cartridges and discs. There would have been more interest but they announcement was made on the 10th of September...

Nivek · Mar 5, 2013

nezza said:
Many thanks for your response. A background study is a good idea...

1.Microsoft and Sega.

For Microsoft it was an image thing. There was no doubt at all that when it came to the computing world they were the masters of all they surveyed. Windows despite all the criticism over market domination and continual upgrades was THE name associated with home computing.

There was no doubt that the various GUI improvements from 3.1 upwards had made computing easier on the eye. Likewise the arrival of Windows 95 with their advertising campaign had led to an explosion in beige boxy PC's across the planet.

But it was the gaming sector that was the bugbear. Yes, PC's did play games but mainly simulators and RPG's and despite the company's obvious domination in Europe and the USA. it was the Far East where the serious interest lay and the epicentre of that was Japan.

The truth was Microsoft wasn't a well known name in Japan. The likes of Sony and NEC were the computer firms there while Sega and Nintendo were the big game firms.

Microsoft wanted in on Japan but they realised that they simply couldn't buy their way to success. Instead Bill Gates made a decision that some would say was totally against character. He sought an alliance...

In 1999, C+VG magazine in the UK were the first to reveal that Microsoft had sent a senior member of staff to Japan for a video game convention. The article ended with the rhetorical question:

"what does this new ingredient in the japanese mixture mean..."?

For Sega the alliance was the first step in the realisation that their domination of their home market was coming to an end.

The 1990's had not been a good decade for the big "S". There had been a series of flops and disasters from the Mega CD and the 32X to the Saturn which was briefly a ray of hope for them....That was until Sony and SNK shocked the world with the creation of the "Neo"

Sega were in trouble. They still had huge gaming strength but their days as a hardware producer were numbered.

Again C+VG postulated on this:

"Sega is at a crossroads. Its hardware division is demoralised. The question they are asking is 'could Sega cut it as a wholly software based company or will they throw in the towel and farm out their products to others...Sonic on Nintendo?..."

In September 2001 Sega and Microsoft announced they were working on a new hybrid machine which would use both cartridges and discs. There would have been more interest but they announcement was made on the 10th of September...

So that is nice idea, Sony and SNK? that is new trend but very nice idea(in OTL Namco was the unofficial First party of Sony, them they buy Square) and that would put SEGA between a rock and a hard place, and them the SEGA & Microsoft Alliance was OTL

and them now Nintendo and Apple happen? and that how will affect Nintendo Handleds(an Ipod/GBA hybrid?)

nezza · Mar 6, 2013

2. Nintendo and Apple

This alliance was based again on a Japanese giant wanting to expand into other areas. Unlike Sega, Nintendo had been more successful in hardware with the NES and SNES ruling the roost.

Miyamoto and the rest had watched with glee and satisfaction at Sega's disastrous foray into CD technology.

Ninty wanted to expand from games into education possibly as a result of concerns that generations of kids were becoming addicted to Mario et al.

The problem was Nintendo didn't have any educational software ideas. The problem was you couldn't really paint a picture with a joypad.

It was developments across the Atlantic ocean that led to the alliance being formed.

Apple was still number 2 in the PC race behind Microsoft but its foray into art programs had attracted positive attention. Likewise the Apple Newton also garnered plaudits.

Its claimed in 2000 Steve Jobs received a message from Nintendo supremo Gunpei Yokoi asking him to enter into negotiations for a new machine.

Apple were intrigued, their attempt at a games machine the Pippin was a commercial and critical failure. Now here was the number 1 games company asking if they wanted to team up.

The talks were cordial but reserved at first. A major sticking point was the intellectual rights. Who would own what?

Jobs came up with the idea of a holdings company called "Harmony" of which Apple would own 49%, Nintendo would own 49% and the controlling 2% owned by Lloyds of London.

With the deal signed by courts in the USA, the UK and Japan. Work began on a new machine...

DStecks · Mar 6, 2013

OK, I have major issues with a lot of things here, so I'll touch on some of the biggest issues.

nezza said:
In September 2001 Sega and Microsoft announced they were working on a new hybrid machine which would use both cartridges and discs.

What? Why? OTL Sega CD wasn't a hybrid system, it was an add-on to the Sega Genesis. Same as the original conception for the Playstation and the CDi, which started their development as CD add-ons for the NES, if I remember correctly.

Having two formats in the same system doesn't make a great deal of sense, especially since this is before widespread adoption of the DVD, so it's not like there's one slot for game, one slot for movies; they're both just for games. It increases the cost of the hardware for no good reason. Furthermore, all of your ATL consoles have onboard hard drives. A console with both a HDD and cartridge games doesn't make a whole lot of sense, which is why nobody ever made one.

nezza said:
X-3DO
500 GB memory
4GB RAM

Cartridge slot for Master System and Megadrive games, CD Drive for Sega CD, PC-CD and Audio CD.

i-Play

750 GB (300 GB for Game saves)
8GB (6GB for video editing)

Cartridge slot for Gameboy games, (all variations with colour emulator) NES/Famicom, SNES/Super Famicom and CD drive for Nintendo CD games, blank DVD's

Preinstalled software.
i-Movie, i-DVD, i-tunes, Garageband.

750GB of hard drive in 2003 would have been insanely expensive, maybe even physically impossible for a console-sized device. 8GB of RAM in 2003, again, ridiculously expensive. Absolutely beyond the financial means of the average family. My family's old computer, purchased around 2002, had a 40GB hard drive, and 256MB of RAM. The consoles you are proposing would utterly dwarf even the most high-end computers of 2003.

Furthermore, you seriously overrate the desire of companies to support backwards compatibility. The PS2 was the first successful home console to be backwards compatible with the previous console iteration. Why would Nintendo decide that it will now support extensive backwards compatibility? Being the biggest game publisher on the console means that backwards compatibility cuts into its sales, because people don't have to buy new games.

nezza said:
Both machines have internet content.

I assume you mean connections. Digital distribution was still a decade from viability in 2003. Not many homes would have had fast enough internet to download full games in reasonable amounts of time.

nezza said:
The X3DO markets itself as an arcade machine/hi end pc Gamestation. Its aimed at two markets. The casual gamer and the serious RPG fan.

What? First of all, RPGs? That's pretty damn specific. Also, in 2003 "casual" gamers hadn't yet established themselves as a real market force. Nintendo played to them brilliantly, but nobody really knew that that was what was happening. Also, despite being marketed to casual gamers, its hardware probably would have put its price point in the multiple thousands of dollars.

nezza said:
With the Master Pack as well as a joypad there is a well specified video editing console unit.

I am seriously sceptical that anybody would have been interested in video editing on a console in 2003. YouTube was years off, so there's no amateur video editing market, and the professionals already have high-quality tools.

I would say that the biggest problem with this TL is that you seem to be assuming that modern trends have always been the case, and you don't have a very good perspective on hardware of the early 2000's. A TL about video games could be cool, but you clearly didn't do any research, or at least nowhere near enough.

DStecks · Mar 7, 2013

I actually have some hard stats now, thanks to this site and this site.

In November of 2003, an 80GB hard drive cost $98.88, for the cheapest possible model. 500GB worth of that would thus cost $618. 750GB of hard drive, at 2003 prices, would cost $927, which even before calculating the cost of anything else at all, would make the iPlay the most expensive home console ever, assuming my figures are in 2003 dollars and not today's dollars, in which case the SNK Neo Geo would still hold the record at $1128 in 2013 dollars.

Now for the RAM: In December 2003, the average cost of RAM, in terms of dollars/megabyte, was $0.166. 4GB of RAM would thus cost an astonishing $679.94, bringing the price of the X-3DO up to $1297.94 in terms of memory alone. The iPlay has twice as much RAM even than that, its 8GB costing a pants-crapping $1359.87, bringing the cost of the iPlay in memory alone to $2326.87, putting it in the price range of a low-end used car. At this point, both consoles surpass the Neo Geo in price, the iPlay by over a thousand dollars. The consoles will either be utterly unaffordable, or the companies will be selling them at an obscene loss.

I'm not going to make an attempt to price any more of the hardware, because at this point it would just be adding insult to injury. I don't want to be excessively mean, but the hardware specs you've written are so staggeringly wrong that I'm genuinely insulted. While I'm at it, I'll break down some more points:

nezza said:
2. Nintendo and Apple

This alliance was based again on a Japanese giant wanting to expand into other areas. Unlike Sega, Nintendo had been more successful in hardware with the NES and SNES ruling the roost.

Nintendo has never had any major desire to expand into other areas. They rejected Apogee software's offer to port Super Mario Bros to the PC, even though Apogee had basically already done it.

nezza said:
Ninty wanted to expand from games into education possibly as a result of concerns that generations of kids were becoming addicted to Mario et al.

The problem was Nintendo didn't have any educational software ideas. The problem was you couldn't really paint a picture with a joypad.

First of all, Google search "Mario Teaches Typing", "Mario's Time Machine", and "Mario is Missing". Then search "Mario Paint" to see that Nintendo didn't care that you can't really paint with a joypad.

nezza said:
For Sega the alliance was the first step in the realisation that their domination of their home market was coming to an end.

The 1990's had not been a good decade for the big "S". There had been a series of flops and disasters from the Mega CD and the 32X to the Saturn which was briefly a ray of hope for them....That was until Sony and SNK shocked the world with the creation of the "Neo"

Sega fought to the bitter end to remain a player in home consoles, so I'm not sure what you mean by "realization".

As for this "Neo", if it's anything like the real-life Neo Geo I mentioned earlier, it poses zero threat to Sega. Why? Because it was so expensive that almost literally nobody bought it.