I was thinking Germany would go for the Confederacy because the Union develops close ties to Russia because they would be a close ally with the union purchasing Alaska?
The Confederate Empire
- Thread starter ConfederateFly
- Start date
Confederate States of America
1863-2005
President: Trent Lott (Dixiecrat)
Political Parties: Dixiecrat, Southern Populist, New South, many other minor parties
Military: CSA Army: 500,000
CSA Navy: 93,000- 300 armed ships; 5 battleships, also scientific vessels such as Nuclear powered icebreakers, sonar ships
CSA Air Force: 195,000- 2,760 planes
CSA Special Forces- 50,000, include soviet built intelligence trawlers, drones, and many other effective spy and special equipment
CSA State Militia: 300,000
CSA State Coastal Militia: 15,000- 100 armed ships
CSA State Air Militia: 5,000- 75 planes
CSA Strategic Corp: 10,000- 200 ICBM'S and other missles
CSA Merchant Marine: 50,000- 475 ships of all sizes
Confederate Aeronautics and Space Exploration Corp (CASE)
Started in 1953. Reached moon in 1970 one year behind U.S. Neil Armstrong did something that almost brought the world to nuclear devastation when he picked up the U.S. Flag and threw it then planted the Confederate Flag. Most Confederate research has been about Venus, Mars and it's moons, and Pluto.
present day: The Confederacy is more cultrally diverse today. Slavery was ended in 1917. A system of Apratheid was started in 1923 under a sereis of bad Presidents. It was ended in 1970. There is a system of slavery where the slaves are trapped by debt the owners say they owe. Or some blacks are sent to these plantations as a punishment for a crime in plantations in middle of nowheres in the deep south and on Confederate Citizens plantations in Confederate influenced countries such as Nicaragua, Thailand, Congo, and Costa Rica, and some other minor countries. These owners bring Confederate Blacks but buy some from africa and enslave natives unawaring to the local goverment
History The Confederacy won the War of Southern Revolution with material supplies from Britian and France. In 1864 after the War France they made a agreement with the CSA to mutually protect Mexico and Maximillian. Prussia was very impressed with the Confederate action in the War. They started a diplomatic and commercial relationship that almost brought the Confederacy to destruction 80 years later. In 1869 Prussia provokes France into war. CSA, France, and Britian have beeen drifting apart. The CSA wary of France invades Mexico. By 1870 They have conquered Mexico. In the Treaty of VeraCruz. The CSA recieves Upper Baja, Baja Sur, Sonora, Chiuhuha, Tampulias, Coahulia, and Nuevo Leon. Both Baja's become Franklin , Chiuhuha and Western half of Sonora becomes Pacifico, Coahulia becomes New Georgia, and Tampulias and Nuevo Leon become Appalachia. At the 1876 Berlin Conference The CSA makes claims to Western Congo to the sea. They say they helped Belgium manage it they should recieve a piece of the pie or so to say. They get it. CSA and Germany make the Dual Alliance. 1876 CSA and Spain go at it. They win in 5 months due to superior weaponery and german assistence. The CSA get Cuba, Puerto Rico, and The Phillipines. Germany buys Guam. The Confedercay buys or conquers Kirbati, Tuvalu, Samoa, and Vanuatu. They buy the Netherland antillies from The Netherlands. In 1880 The Confederacy forms protectorates over Nicaragua and and the Republic of Yucatan which broke away from Mexico. 1887 the CSA and Germany begin building the Nicaraguian Canal. It is finished in 1891. In 1893 Nicaraguian rebels attack The Canal and destroy the 10 Confederate and 10 German guards. CSA and Germany declare war. Costa Rica and Guatamala site aggression and declare war on Nicaragua. The CSA and Germany win. They continue they trade agreement including military items. In 1913 Austrian Crown Prince, his wife and the Confederate Consul in Vienna are killed by a Serbian Nationalist while riding in a Car. The Contienental Powers of Germany, Austro-Hungary, the Confederacy, and Turkey declare war on Serbia. The Triple Entente of France, England, and Russia declare war on the Contienental Powers. The War is Going well for Germany and its allies. The Confederacy has sent 200,000 soldiers to Germany. It starts to go down hill when a CSA calvary detachment goes into The United States. United States sites aggression and declares War The Confederacy underpowered and outmatched surrenders in 1917. The U.S sends troops to europe and the war is over by 1919. Some future Confedreate leaders such as Patton and Mcarther learn valuable on field knowledge. At the Treaty of Versailles the CSA and Germany lost all overseas colonies. Ths CSA in 1917 started gradual emancipation. Forced emancipation of rest of slaves. Germany forced to pay 30 billion dollars and the CSA pays 15 billion. This gives rise to the Fascist leaders Hitler and Bilbo. Theodore Bilbo reaches and agreement with Hitler. Theodore Bilbo claims himself President for Life. World War 2 starts in the same fashion as OTL. Bilbo sends The Aristocrat Brigade of 10,000 men to Germany which is led by McArthur. The Forces of Patton cross U.S. Terr in 1942 kicking off The North American front. In 4 Years the War is over. The CSA and Nazi Germany have lost and the horrors of forced labor camps in Germany and the Confedrecay are found.Bilbo and 10 other Confederate Military, political, and Prison leaders are tryed in Nuremburg with Nazi Officials and are sentenced to death for Geneocide and War Mungering. In 1950 The CSA joins the U.N. The Populist take over begins when 7 of 9 Presidents are Southern Populist. Patton wins Presidency for Populist party. George Wallace a Dixiecrat begins Andean War vs. Peru, Colombia, and Guyana. Netherlands sale Dutch Guiana to Confederacy. Confedreate Maylasian War. Is called Confederate Vietnam. Everything is quiet until the Moon accident and several run ins with Soviet and U.S. Merchant ships. Civil Rights act in 1970 It is the first major breakthrough since black troops in WW 1, Andean War, and Maylasian War . On Sept. 11 2001 planes fly in World Trade towers in U.S. and Stock Market in Atlanta. War on Terror is the First time CSA and USA troops are on same side. The CSA puts 10,000 troops and 5 ships to Gulf and Afghanistan. Lott and Kerry decide on a joint action to invade Iraq because of their aggression and weapons programs. The Iraqi War is On Going. The CSA offered 150,000 troops. 300 special forces. The Confederates control Basara and Um Quasr. Have Special Forces in Baghdad.
Presidents
Jefferson Davis 1862-1868
Robert E Lee 1868-1874
Robert Toombs 1874-1880
Howell Cobb 1880-1886
John Anderson 1886-1892
States Rights Gist 1892-1898
Ben Tillman 1898-1904
Hoke Smith 1904-1910
Fielding South 1910-1916
Woodrow Wilson 1916-1922
Huey Long 1922-1928
Strom Thurmond 1928-1934
Theodore Bilbo 1934-1946
George Patton 1946-1952
John Wilming 1952-1958
George Wallace 1958-1964
Lydon Johnson 1964-1970
Howard Baker 1970-1976
Jimmy Carter 1976-1982
Lawton Chiles 1982-1988
Sterling Jefferson Lee III 1988-1994
Bill Clinton 1994-2000
Trent Lott 2000-present
Industrial Revolution in CSA started with Lee. Cobb and Toombs stopped it for a little bit then started again with Anderson.
1863-2005
President: Trent Lott (Dixiecrat)
Political Parties: Dixiecrat, Southern Populist, New South, many other minor parties
Military: CSA Army: 500,000
CSA Navy: 93,000- 300 armed ships; 5 battleships, also scientific vessels such as Nuclear powered icebreakers, sonar ships
CSA Air Force: 195,000- 2,760 planes
CSA Special Forces- 50,000, include soviet built intelligence trawlers, drones, and many other effective spy and special equipment
CSA State Militia: 300,000
CSA State Coastal Militia: 15,000- 100 armed ships
CSA State Air Militia: 5,000- 75 planes
CSA Strategic Corp: 10,000- 200 ICBM'S and other missles
CSA Merchant Marine: 50,000- 475 ships of all sizes
Confederate Aeronautics and Space Exploration Corp (CASE)
Started in 1953. Reached moon in 1970 one year behind U.S. Neil Armstrong did something that almost brought the world to nuclear devastation when he picked up the U.S. Flag and threw it then planted the Confederate Flag. Most Confederate research has been about Venus, Mars and it's moons, and Pluto.
present day: The Confederacy is more cultrally diverse today. Slavery was ended in 1917. A system of Apratheid was started in 1923 under a sereis of bad Presidents. It was ended in 1970. There is a system of slavery where the slaves are trapped by debt the owners say they owe. Or some blacks are sent to these plantations as a punishment for a crime in plantations in middle of nowheres in the deep south and on Confederate Citizens plantations in Confederate influenced countries such as Nicaragua, Thailand, Congo, and Costa Rica, and some other minor countries. These owners bring Confederate Blacks but buy some from africa and enslave natives unawaring to the local goverment
History The Confederacy won the War of Southern Revolution with material supplies from Britian and France. In 1864 after the War France they made a agreement with the CSA to mutually protect Mexico and Maximillian. Prussia was very impressed with the Confederate action in the War. They started a diplomatic and commercial relationship that almost brought the Confederacy to destruction 80 years later. In 1869 Prussia provokes France into war. CSA, France, and Britian have beeen drifting apart. The CSA wary of France invades Mexico. By 1870 They have conquered Mexico. In the Treaty of VeraCruz. The CSA recieves Upper Baja, Baja Sur, Sonora, Chiuhuha, Tampulias, Coahulia, and Nuevo Leon. Both Baja's become Franklin , Chiuhuha and Western half of Sonora becomes Pacifico, Coahulia becomes New Georgia, and Tampulias and Nuevo Leon become Appalachia. At the 1876 Berlin Conference The CSA makes claims to Western Congo to the sea. They say they helped Belgium manage it they should recieve a piece of the pie or so to say. They get it. CSA and Germany make the Dual Alliance. 1876 CSA and Spain go at it. They win in 5 months due to superior weaponery and german assistence. The CSA get Cuba, Puerto Rico, and The Phillipines. Germany buys Guam. The Confedercay buys or conquers Kirbati, Tuvalu, Samoa, and Vanuatu. They buy the Netherland antillies from The Netherlands. In 1880 The Confederacy forms protectorates over Nicaragua and and the Republic of Yucatan which broke away from Mexico. 1887 the CSA and Germany begin building the Nicaraguian Canal. It is finished in 1891. In 1893 Nicaraguian rebels attack The Canal and destroy the 10 Confederate and 10 German guards. CSA and Germany declare war. Costa Rica and Guatamala site aggression and declare war on Nicaragua. The CSA and Germany win. They continue they trade agreement including military items. In 1913 Austrian Crown Prince, his wife and the Confederate Consul in Vienna are killed by a Serbian Nationalist while riding in a Car. The Contienental Powers of Germany, Austro-Hungary, the Confederacy, and Turkey declare war on Serbia. The Triple Entente of France, England, and Russia declare war on the Contienental Powers. The War is Going well for Germany and its allies. The Confederacy has sent 200,000 soldiers to Germany. It starts to go down hill when a CSA calvary detachment goes into The United States. United States sites aggression and declares War The Confederacy underpowered and outmatched surrenders in 1917. The U.S sends troops to europe and the war is over by 1919. Some future Confedreate leaders such as Patton and Mcarther learn valuable on field knowledge. At the Treaty of Versailles the CSA and Germany lost all overseas colonies. Ths CSA in 1917 started gradual emancipation. Forced emancipation of rest of slaves. Germany forced to pay 30 billion dollars and the CSA pays 15 billion. This gives rise to the Fascist leaders Hitler and Bilbo. Theodore Bilbo reaches and agreement with Hitler. Theodore Bilbo claims himself President for Life. World War 2 starts in the same fashion as OTL. Bilbo sends The Aristocrat Brigade of 10,000 men to Germany which is led by McArthur. The Forces of Patton cross U.S. Terr in 1942 kicking off The North American front. In 4 Years the War is over. The CSA and Nazi Germany have lost and the horrors of forced labor camps in Germany and the Confedrecay are found.Bilbo and 10 other Confederate Military, political, and Prison leaders are tryed in Nuremburg with Nazi Officials and are sentenced to death for Geneocide and War Mungering. In 1950 The CSA joins the U.N. The Populist take over begins when 7 of 9 Presidents are Southern Populist. Patton wins Presidency for Populist party. George Wallace a Dixiecrat begins Andean War vs. Peru, Colombia, and Guyana. Netherlands sale Dutch Guiana to Confederacy. Confedreate Maylasian War. Is called Confederate Vietnam. Everything is quiet until the Moon accident and several run ins with Soviet and U.S. Merchant ships. Civil Rights act in 1970 It is the first major breakthrough since black troops in WW 1, Andean War, and Maylasian War . On Sept. 11 2001 planes fly in World Trade towers in U.S. and Stock Market in Atlanta. War on Terror is the First time CSA and USA troops are on same side. The CSA puts 10,000 troops and 5 ships to Gulf and Afghanistan. Lott and Kerry decide on a joint action to invade Iraq because of their aggression and weapons programs. The Iraqi War is On Going. The CSA offered 150,000 troops. 300 special forces. The Confederates control Basara and Um Quasr. Have Special Forces in Baghdad.
Presidents
Jefferson Davis 1862-1868
Robert E Lee 1868-1874
Robert Toombs 1874-1880
Howell Cobb 1880-1886
John Anderson 1886-1892
States Rights Gist 1892-1898
Ben Tillman 1898-1904
Hoke Smith 1904-1910
Fielding South 1910-1916
Woodrow Wilson 1916-1922
Huey Long 1922-1928
Strom Thurmond 1928-1934
Theodore Bilbo 1934-1946
George Patton 1946-1952
John Wilming 1952-1958
George Wallace 1958-1964
Lydon Johnson 1964-1970
Howard Baker 1970-1976
Jimmy Carter 1976-1982
Lawton Chiles 1982-1988
Sterling Jefferson Lee III 1988-1994
Bill Clinton 1994-2000
Trent Lott 2000-present
Industrial Revolution in CSA started with Lee. Cobb and Toombs stopped it for a little bit then started again with Anderson.
Xen
Banned
Eeek I dont know man, some of the Presidents are a little awkward, and the years are off on their reign. I dont think Robert E Lee would ever be President, he just didnt seem interested, I could however see him as an ambassador to the United States, or in some position to where he tries to mend the wounds the war caused between North and South.
Alexander Stevens I believe was Davis' Vice President, and a good candidate for President when Davis' term expires in 1867.
John C. Breckenridge might have died young in OTL but in this timeline under different circumstances hed possibly live to be the Third President of the CSA
Woodrow Wilson might have been born in Virginia, but hes still a Yankee, if Im not mistaking he was governor of New Jersey which he used as a stepping stone to President. I suppose you can make him patriotic to the south and become a Senator or something for Virginia.
1922 seems a bit early for a President Long, having him become President in 1933 is alot more realistic.
George Wallace is probably best left for the late 1960's when international pressure is placed upon the CS for its Civil Rights record. I can see Richmond growing very close to South Africa at this point. He can appeal to southerners who think the CS is getting too close to the United States, and resents Washington or Philadelphia (whereever the American capital is) dominating Dixie.
If you want to have some good Presidents James Longstreet would work in the 19th Century, he became involved politically after the war. He was the US ambassador to the Ottoman Empire for a while I believe.
Douglas MacArthur was a crazy son of a bitch, and if he still becomes a war hero, you should consider him as President perhaps 1957-63. Unless he's too closley associated with the regime, but the same goes for Patton (do you have Patton as a Confederate or the American military commander?)
LBJ should be your CS President in the 1950s, hes progressive, likely to please the allies, and takes a firm stance on the important issues. He should then be followed by the Governor of Arkansas, cant think of that fellas name.
Alexander Stevens I believe was Davis' Vice President, and a good candidate for President when Davis' term expires in 1867.
John C. Breckenridge might have died young in OTL but in this timeline under different circumstances hed possibly live to be the Third President of the CSA
Woodrow Wilson might have been born in Virginia, but hes still a Yankee, if Im not mistaking he was governor of New Jersey which he used as a stepping stone to President. I suppose you can make him patriotic to the south and become a Senator or something for Virginia.
1922 seems a bit early for a President Long, having him become President in 1933 is alot more realistic.
George Wallace is probably best left for the late 1960's when international pressure is placed upon the CS for its Civil Rights record. I can see Richmond growing very close to South Africa at this point. He can appeal to southerners who think the CS is getting too close to the United States, and resents Washington or Philadelphia (whereever the American capital is) dominating Dixie.
If you want to have some good Presidents James Longstreet would work in the 19th Century, he became involved politically after the war. He was the US ambassador to the Ottoman Empire for a while I believe.
Douglas MacArthur was a crazy son of a bitch, and if he still becomes a war hero, you should consider him as President perhaps 1957-63. Unless he's too closley associated with the regime, but the same goes for Patton (do you have Patton as a Confederate or the American military commander?)
LBJ should be your CS President in the 1950s, hes progressive, likely to please the allies, and takes a firm stance on the important issues. He should then be followed by the Governor of Arkansas, cant think of that fellas name.
Patton lead the Army of the East of The CSA. McArther was to close to the regime because he commanded the Aristocrat Brigade in Nazi Germany
Xen
Banned
ConfederateFly said:
I just caught this. Do you care to explain how a tiny province in Mexica was renamed Appalachia? Nuevo Leon is way outside of Appalachia it isnt even funny, its much closer to the Ozarks, but is nowhere near the Ozark mountain chain either.
Appalachia is a region in the US East that I call home, it runs through New York and Ohio southward to Georgia, and Alabama, stretching as far west as Eastern Mississippi. Calling a state in former Mexico Appalachia would be like calling a state in Siberia Mississippi.
Appalachia is where West Virginia is right. Well they name it that way because they Wanted to remind the CSA that they wanted West Virginia.
NomadicSky
Banned
I'm not trying to disrespect your work by posting this Confederate fly
But I live in Mississippi and I think that the CSA would be a terrible place to live!
People like Strom Thurmond president and maybe even Pat Robertson and the huge violation of human rights that might have lead to a civil war during the 1960's. I wouldn't want to live in Mississippi without all 49 US states attached to it the south doesn't need to be a country.I think if it had been then it probably would include New Mexico and Arizona after all the Arizona territory was created by the Confederate government in otl
But I live in Mississippi and I think that the CSA would be a terrible place to live!
People like Strom Thurmond president and maybe even Pat Robertson and the huge violation of human rights that might have lead to a civil war during the 1960's. I wouldn't want to live in Mississippi without all 49 US states attached to it the south doesn't need to be a country.I think if it had been then it probably would include New Mexico and Arizona after all the Arizona territory was created by the Confederate government in otl
ConfederateFly said:
With the initial stipulation that it helps to specify _how_ the Confederacy gains its independence (which makes a lot of difference), I'd list things as follows:
OTL Confederacy states are more or less a given, with the possible exception of eastern Tennessee. Depending on the circumstances of the split, the CSA may or may not have Maryland, West Virginia, Kentucky, Missouri, the Indian Territory and the southern parts of Arizona and New Mexico.
Northern Mexican states... we-eell, maybe. Any proposal for the CSA to conquer parts of Mexico has to answer why the USA, Britain and France don't intervene. Having the ruler of Mexico sell territory voluntarily is actually quite difficult, since they would be likely to get turfed out by their own people for doing so. It isn't impossible for the CSA to acquire parts of Mexico, by any means, but by doing so they will burn up a lot of their international credibility, making it harder for them to acquire territory elsewhere. Britain is unlikely to stand idly by while a slaveholding power extends slavery to new territories, for example, barring quite exceptional circumstances.
Cuba is a possibility, especially if the CSA intervenes to 'restore order' during an *Ten Years War, starting around 1868. It may require some good diplomacy to keep Britain out (something the OTL CSA was, well, not known for), and Spain would be no walkover, all things considered, but it could be finessed in the right circumstances. Puerto Rico is also a lesser possibility. Beyond that, I have trouble seeing what they could grab in the Caribbean without the USA or Britain outbidding or outfighting them, as the case may be.
Territory of Hawaii is more difficult. The USA is much better placed to acquire it, and Britain and even Japan would probably rank ahead of the CSA in countries to acquire it. Any chances would at the very least require both a Confederate Pacific port (quite hard to acquire, really) and quite good diplomacy. If the CSA can sell themselves as better than the USA to the Hawai'ians (which suprisingly enough, they might be able to do) it's possible, but it would take some luck.
Territory of the Far East. Weelllll... a few treaty ports or other concessions in China would be a possibility, but the CSA would be one power among many. Anything more than this is probably pushing it. Maybe the Philippines or Guam/Marianas in an alternate Spanish-Confederate War, but the CSA would really have to be crossing their fingers and hoping that Britain, the USA, France and Japan don't intervene.
Cheers,
Kaiser Wilhelm III
NomadicSky
Banned
good diplomacy
maybe southern charm and edicate would help a little, but there is still the issue of slavery not to mention population.
The south was out maned and out guned by well the US 10 to one
Maybe had the CSA fought a purely defensive war
But you have to think of the south without the northern immigration. It would have been more of an Autocracy with a very unhappy white lower class I can't really see much of a middle class there for many years. Industrialization would have been slow, the USA would be a far superior. Dixie would be the land of problems America would still be the land of promise.
Still it might be an ok place to live by now...
maybe southern charm and edicate would help a little, but there is still the issue of slavery not to mention population.
The south was out maned and out guned by well the US 10 to one
Maybe had the CSA fought a purely defensive war
But you have to think of the south without the northern immigration. It would have been more of an Autocracy with a very unhappy white lower class I can't really see much of a middle class there for many years. Industrialization would have been slow, the USA would be a far superior. Dixie would be the land of problems America would still be the land of promise.
Still it might be an ok place to live by now...
Grey Wolf
Donor
Regarding presidents, I would certainly expect to see some of the Confederate generals of the 1860s as presidents in the 1870s-1880s period, not exclusively so but the career path may well go from general to governor of a territory to politican proper to president.
One might be tempted to say that conditions in the CSA turn adventurers to look outwards. Adding to this, one could see an influx of CS citizens in places like Sonora working the mines, and thus a Witwatersrand situation developing in which they begin to claim legal rights. Of course, Mexico has seen it all before with Texas, but there's no rule that says that history cannot repeat itself.
On a more military note, your fillibuster and freebooter types could rampage across Central America, and perhaps if one or two establish viable regimes they will apply for CSA protection.
Grey Wolf
One might be tempted to say that conditions in the CSA turn adventurers to look outwards. Adding to this, one could see an influx of CS citizens in places like Sonora working the mines, and thus a Witwatersrand situation developing in which they begin to claim legal rights. Of course, Mexico has seen it all before with Texas, but there's no rule that says that history cannot repeat itself.
On a more military note, your fillibuster and freebooter types could rampage across Central America, and perhaps if one or two establish viable regimes they will apply for CSA protection.
Grey Wolf