Sports What Ifs.
- Thread starter Dave
- Start date
Considering writing a timeline but searching for the right POD.
The Concept: The old Pacific Coast League changes it's nature and actually competes with the two established major leagues.
The timing is crucial, if they jump too late, the Dodgers and Giants are in LA and San Francisco before they can really establish themselves as a competitive enterprise and their dead within a few years. If my timing is off, in regards to the post-war population shift to the west coast, I put it at too early a POD where it becomes implausible.
Ownership isn't an issue, there were PLENTY of men with means on the west coast, even before the war, that could have bid against the establishment for the talents of players west of the Mississippi (of which there were more than a few), add to that, the only way westerners had of seeing real major league ball prior to the Giants/Dodgers moves was either to go out east (which was a pricey expenditure for the average fan) OR wait for some sort of "barnstorming" or exhibition game to come west.
The first major league professional sports team to make the move to the west coast was the Cleveland Rams when they moved to LA in 1946. Perhaps this event, depending on what sort of gate the Rams were drawing could convince men like Howard Hughes, Walt Disney or some other mogul or ownership groups made up of western buisness men to invest in a baseball league with the goal of "bringing Major League quality baseball" to the west?
I have a pretty good idea of where the teams would be and even who some of the potential owners (and members of ownership groups) would be. Also have a few ideas of how the PCL, with competitive owners and buisness structure, could land a few big splashes that get them some much needed exposure and interest...
It may be obvious as to how it all ends, but it's the getting there that lends itself to some facinating possibilites for butterflies.
The Concept: The old Pacific Coast League changes it's nature and actually competes with the two established major leagues.
The timing is crucial, if they jump too late, the Dodgers and Giants are in LA and San Francisco before they can really establish themselves as a competitive enterprise and their dead within a few years. If my timing is off, in regards to the post-war population shift to the west coast, I put it at too early a POD where it becomes implausible.
Ownership isn't an issue, there were PLENTY of men with means on the west coast, even before the war, that could have bid against the establishment for the talents of players west of the Mississippi (of which there were more than a few), add to that, the only way westerners had of seeing real major league ball prior to the Giants/Dodgers moves was either to go out east (which was a pricey expenditure for the average fan) OR wait for some sort of "barnstorming" or exhibition game to come west.
The first major league professional sports team to make the move to the west coast was the Cleveland Rams when they moved to LA in 1946. Perhaps this event, depending on what sort of gate the Rams were drawing could convince men like Howard Hughes, Walt Disney or some other mogul or ownership groups made up of western buisness men to invest in a baseball league with the goal of "bringing Major League quality baseball" to the west?
I have a pretty good idea of where the teams would be and even who some of the potential owners (and members of ownership groups) would be. Also have a few ideas of how the PCL, with competitive owners and buisness structure, could land a few big splashes that get them some much needed exposure and interest...
It may be obvious as to how it all ends, but it's the getting there that lends itself to some facinating possibilites for butterflies.
Germaniac
Donor
3. No Buckner error in 1986 world series?
Bob Stanley wasn't running to first even if Buckner caught it, Mookie was safe. Stanley would be vilified instead.
8. Babe Ruth stayed healthy?
Well, depends when if he quits drinking and easting pre 1918 he would be on the Red Sox his entire career.
Bob Stanley wasn't running to first even if Buckner caught it, Mookie was safe. Stanley would be vilified instead.
8. Babe Ruth stayed healthy?
Well, depends when if he quits drinking and easting pre 1918 he would be on the Red Sox his entire career.
What ifs
1. What if the Cowboys decide to take the best player on the board with their third round pick in 1979(a man named Joe Montana) instead of taking TE Doug Cosbie?
2. What if the Pacers, despite an NBA memorandum saying not to draft Larry Bird because he is going back to school for one more year, ignore the memorandum and draft Larry in the first round because they need a local draw for their struggling franchise?
3. What if the Broncos would have traded for Jim Plunkett in 1976 instead of the 49ers? Denver's coach at the time, John Ralston, was Plunkett's college coach at Stanford.
1. What if the Cowboys decide to take the best player on the board with their third round pick in 1979(a man named Joe Montana) instead of taking TE Doug Cosbie?
2. What if the Pacers, despite an NBA memorandum saying not to draft Larry Bird because he is going back to school for one more year, ignore the memorandum and draft Larry in the first round because they need a local draw for their struggling franchise?
3. What if the Broncos would have traded for Jim Plunkett in 1976 instead of the 49ers? Denver's coach at the time, John Ralston, was Plunkett's college coach at Stanford.
Considering Cosbie's career numbers (he really was a fantastic two-way TE) what would have been preferable (mind you I'm a Cowboys fan) would be if they reached on Cosbie and took him with their second round pick, THEN used their third rounder to grab Montana. I suggested this exact scenario in the 1970's thread but it was suggested that "Montana goes nowhere because White's the Cowboys QB of the future at that point."
That presumes that Landry was some kind of idiot though. If Landry had drafted Montana, it wouldn't take long before "Joe Cool" wrestled the starter's job from White (who could definately be traded for a decent return) and Joe's leading Dallas to victory in Super Bowl XVII and possibly starting an incredible stretch in the mid-late 80's. (especially if they can land Herschel Walker straight out of college in '83...) Cosbie would be a BIG part of that offense so, the reach would be justifiable.
Xen
Banned
This trade was supposed to have happened in 1992, Bonds was going to be a Free Agent following the seasons conclusion, and many felt there was no way the Pirates could resign him. Thus the proposed trade with Atlanta for Dave Justice and Kent Mercker (Leyland thought Mercker would be an excellent starter, he was an alright starting pitcher, nothing to get worked up about though). I think Mike Stanton was also mentioned, especially if the Pirates would have thrown in Stan Belinda when the Braves were in need of a closer.
Speaking of Braves trades, I always thought the Dale Murphy trade was rather dumb, what if he asked to be traded earlier in the season and ended up going to say Boston in exchange for closer Lee Smith? In 1990 the Braves needed a closer too, and the Red Sox had Smith and Reardon but was in need of a power hitter. In OTL they traded Smith to St Louis for Tom Brunansky.
Atlanta at this time would be desperate for a First Baseman especially with Gerald Perry traded to Kansas City and Nick Esasky out for the season (eventually a career). Perhaps they can acquire John Kruk or Ricky Jordan from Philadelphia or even Alvin Davis from Seattle, Jeff Blauser or Andres Thomas may anchor those trades, if it is Blauser then the Braves resign Thomas.
I don't see Joe Thomas hiring Walsh. And even if he did, Thomas would definitely have had the final control over personnel decisions, which means that he probably wouldn't have drafted a lot of the guys that Walsh did, including Joe Montana, who wasn't that highly rated by most scouts. My guess is that Thomas would have hired Leeman Bennett as coach in 1977, the guy who was hired in OTL. They had an up-and-coming team at the time, and maybe Thomas would have picked some other players that would have gotten the Falcons a Super Bowl by 1980 or 81, and then Leeman Bennett wouldn't have been fired in 1982. However, my guess is that Thomas would have had some sort of falling out with the Falcon organization. That is how he lost jobs in Miami and Baltimore. If that happened, I could see him being gone by 1983. Even if that would have happened, though, he would have had them in much better shape in the mid-80's than in OTL, and they may have contended most or all of the decade, which means that Jerry Glanville never coaches them, and the guy that drafted Favre, Ken Herock, never is their GM. Then, Favre goes to the Jets, and GB doesn't win any SB's.
Here is the picture of the proposed Puget Sound stadium in Seattle from 1963. It is near the end of this page in a forum in Baseball Fever about stadium proposals that weren't built:
http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=64023&page=2
If they definitely started this stadium, and if the AFL was assured that it would be completed by 1966 or 67, then I could see Seattle getting the 10th AFL expansion team, not Cincinnati. That team would start play in 1967, the year after the Dolphins. That probably would have left Paul Brown out in the cold as far as the AFL is concerned because they were more interested in Seattle than Cincinnati. When Brown was awarded the AFL franchise, they wanted him to put it in Seattle, but he refused, and picked Cincinnati.
After that, I don't think that the AFL would have expanded again because of the merger. And, I still think that the same teams, the Colts, Steelers, and Browns, would have went to the AFC for the merger. Then, these are your divisions for NFL 1970:
AFC East: Buffalo, Miami, Jets, New England
AFC Central: Baltimore, Cleveland, Houston, Pittsburgh
AFC West: Denver, Kansas City, Oakland, S. Diego, Seattle
NFC East: Dallas, Giants, Philly, Washington, St. Louis
NFC Central: Chicago, Detroit, Green Bay, Minnesota
NFC West: Atlanta, New Orleans, L.A. Rams, San Fran.
Then, in 1976, I could see Paul Brown finally getting a team in Cincinnati. They would come in the league with Tampa. The Bucs would go in the AFC East, and the Bengals in the NFC Central.
What this would mean to the league:
1. Bill Walsh, since he doesn't go to Cincinnati, stays in Oakland, where he was running backs coach in 1966. And, since he doesn't have that situation happen with the Greg Cook injury, where he has to go to a short passing game with a lesser-armed QB, he doesn't develop the current WCO. He either gets named the HC instead of Madden, or leaves after Madden is hired for a new team.
2. Greg Cook goes to a different team, like the Seattle AFL team, or the Patriots, who had a pick in the top-6 in 1969, and he either doesn't develop a rotator cuff problem, or he doesn't play through it and aggravate it, and he goes on to lead one of those teams to a few Super Bowls sometime in the 70's.
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Eiselman,you have a problem to beat tehe brazilian team in 58 or even the 62 teams,Brazil playing with Pelé and Garrincha was "unbeattable" and undefeated.Brazil never lost a game (62 if i am not mistaken)with the two playing at the same time.Brazil lost games with Pelé and lost games with Garrincha but not when they were playng together.garrincha was like a Maradona but right footed,Brazil was extremily fortunate to have Pelé and Garrincha being part of the same generation.It would be like having Pele and maradona playng at the same team today!
WI Alfredo Di Stefano had not injured himself before the 1962 World Cup?
WI there was no Spanish Civil War? Could Spain have gone to the 1938 World Cup and beaten Italy if they had crossed? (Dr. Strangelove's No Spanish Civil War timeline ponders on this)
WI the referees for the '34 Spain-Italy, '86 Spain-Brazil, '94 Spain-Italy and '02 Spain-South Korea hadn't been blind and/or had taken the correct decisions? ('34, Spain was winning when Italy scored just after injuring goalkeeper Zamora; '86, Spain scored a goal that the referee didn't accept (was a phantom goal); '94, Tassotti smashed Luis Enrique's nose in the Italian area but the referee didn't see anything punishable (should have sent Tassotti off and call for a penalty kick that could have given Spain a victory); '02, Ghandour and the linesmen invalidated several legal goals due to supposed off-sides and once because the ball had come out of the field (TV clearly showed that it was inside the field all the time))
WI FIBA forced the US to play with the international rules in international matches? Would make for a funny scene in the last Olympics' basketball final where the US players did a travelling so many times it wasn't funny.
WI people at the IAAF weren't blind? They would have seen that, in the final of 1500 m, Natalia Rodriguez never pushed the Ethiopian athlete (don't remember her name right now) and would have been given the gold medal she deserved.
WI the IOC had gone by the rulebook during the Pekin Olympics? The Danish disgraceful victory in sailing when they used the Croatian ship instead of their own should have had them disqualified according to the rulebook.
WI there was no Spanish Civil War? Could Spain have gone to the 1938 World Cup and beaten Italy if they had crossed? (Dr. Strangelove's No Spanish Civil War timeline ponders on this)
WI the referees for the '34 Spain-Italy, '86 Spain-Brazil, '94 Spain-Italy and '02 Spain-South Korea hadn't been blind and/or had taken the correct decisions? ('34, Spain was winning when Italy scored just after injuring goalkeeper Zamora; '86, Spain scored a goal that the referee didn't accept (was a phantom goal); '94, Tassotti smashed Luis Enrique's nose in the Italian area but the referee didn't see anything punishable (should have sent Tassotti off and call for a penalty kick that could have given Spain a victory); '02, Ghandour and the linesmen invalidated several legal goals due to supposed off-sides and once because the ball had come out of the field (TV clearly showed that it was inside the field all the time))
WI FIBA forced the US to play with the international rules in international matches? Would make for a funny scene in the last Olympics' basketball final where the US players did a travelling so many times it wasn't funny.
WI people at the IAAF weren't blind? They would have seen that, in the final of 1500 m, Natalia Rodriguez never pushed the Ethiopian athlete (don't remember her name right now) and would have been given the gold medal she deserved.
WI the IOC had gone by the rulebook during the Pekin Olympics? The Danish disgraceful victory in sailing when they used the Croatian ship instead of their own should have had them disqualified according to the rulebook.
With a stadium like that, if it get's built and finished by 1966/67, I've got to figure Seattle possibly draws NFL interest and throws an interesting curve into the mix: if it's going to be ready in '66, does a Seattle club muscle out Atlanta for expansion? If The NFL goes to Seattle in '66, does the AFL promise Atlanta a franchise in '67? (The Dolphins are already coming in in '66, but if Atlanta's ready...)
If Seattle builds that stadium, they probably get the A's in 1968 instead of Oakland too.
Finley looked at Seattle as a possible relocation spot for the A's when he decided to leave KC. If Seattle had a stadium like that, I have to think Finley goes there instead of Oakland.
But then, who get's the fourth expansion franchise in '69, with the A's in Seattle?
The AL in 1968 (w/ proposed Seattle stadium in place, Finley picks Seattle over Oakland)
Boston
New York
Baltimore
Washington
Cleveland
Detroit
Chicago
Minnesota
LA
Seattle
Milwaukee could get the Brewers a year sooner, I suppose.
The Dallas/Ft. Worth area perhaps?
If they get it, where do the Senators go if Arlington's occupied by three year old expansion team in 1972?
If Seattle gets the A's, what about Oakland? They've got OACC to put a team in. Maybe they get the fourth team in 1969?
But now, what happens in '77? Seattle got the Mariners in '77. If they get the A's in '68, who enters the AL with Toronto in '77?
The butterflies that that stadium's construction (or perhaps even just a Sick's Stadium built to Sick's actual 2/3 grandstand, 1/3 bleachers specs and renovated in the early 60's.) would have created...
[Edit] a little info on Sick's Stadium...
http://www.brandx.net/pilots/sicks.html
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Here's a couple to make things interesting in 1983...
The NFL relents and declares Herschel Walker eligible for the 1983 Draft.
Points to consider:
Walker declared up front that the only teams he would sign with were Dallas or one of the two New York teams.
As the draft played out OTL, the first of those three teams to have a shot at him would be the Giants with the 10 pick. Next would be Dallas at 23 and the Jets at 24.
The questions:
Does Parcells forgo building his defense (OTL he took Terry Kinard, an eight year starter and a pro-bowler who made quite a contribution on defense for the Giants '86 and '90 Super Bowl teams.) and take Walker?
Does Dallas trade-up to get in front of the Giants?
Do the Jets trade-up, or do they stay where they are and still draft Ken O'Brien?
Teams with picks 1-9 have a big barganing chip to try and build with if one (or all three) want Walker bad enough.
It would probably alter the entire draft as players move down the board and perhaps end up elsewhere.
Another one...
The Colts take John Elway at his word and take Eric Dickerson with the #1 pick.
I say the Rams (if the Oilers have dumped their #2 pick to the Rams without realizing Elway would be available at #2) take Elway and Elway signs with them.
How does this change the fortunes of the Rams going forward? Do they stay in L.A.?
The NFL relents and declares Herschel Walker eligible for the 1983 Draft.
Points to consider:
Walker declared up front that the only teams he would sign with were Dallas or one of the two New York teams.
As the draft played out OTL, the first of those three teams to have a shot at him would be the Giants with the 10 pick. Next would be Dallas at 23 and the Jets at 24.
The questions:
Does Parcells forgo building his defense (OTL he took Terry Kinard, an eight year starter and a pro-bowler who made quite a contribution on defense for the Giants '86 and '90 Super Bowl teams.) and take Walker?
Does Dallas trade-up to get in front of the Giants?
Do the Jets trade-up, or do they stay where they are and still draft Ken O'Brien?
Teams with picks 1-9 have a big barganing chip to try and build with if one (or all three) want Walker bad enough.
It would probably alter the entire draft as players move down the board and perhaps end up elsewhere.
Another one...
The Colts take John Elway at his word and take Eric Dickerson with the #1 pick.
I say the Rams (if the Oilers have dumped their #2 pick to the Rams without realizing Elway would be available at #2) take Elway and Elway signs with them.
How does this change the fortunes of the Rams going forward? Do they stay in L.A.?
Walker and Elway
If Walker dropped down that far, Parcells would have needed to be committed if he passed over Walker for Kinard, who was an average pro safety.
Here's a possibility: Maybe the Broncos trade the 4th overall pick to Dallas for Tony Dorsett, allowing the Cowboys to draft Herschel.
I think that they stay where they are. They already had Freeman McNeil. Unless, again, they work out a trade with Denver and send them McNeil for their first round pick.
Also, here's another point: If they let Walker come out, they would have had to let other juniors come out and change the junior eligibility rule 7 years before they did. And that would have large butterflies in the NFL and USFL.
I think that, if the Colts would have finally surrendered to Elway and decided not to take him the day before the draft or the day of the draft, they wouldn't have taken Eric because they had Curtis Dickey and Randy McMillan at RB. Ultimately, I think that they would have traded the #1 pick to the Chargers for their fifth and 20th overall picks and DT Gary "Big Hands" Johnson. SD would have taken Elway and groomed him behind Fouts for a year or so. Then, the next three picks happen as they did in reality. As for the Colts, they take Marino fifth overall and OLB Vernon Maxwell 20th overall.
If Walker dropped down that far, Parcells would have needed to be committed if he passed over Walker for Kinard, who was an average pro safety.
Here's a possibility: Maybe the Broncos trade the 4th overall pick to Dallas for Tony Dorsett, allowing the Cowboys to draft Herschel.
I think that they stay where they are. They already had Freeman McNeil. Unless, again, they work out a trade with Denver and send them McNeil for their first round pick.
Also, here's another point: If they let Walker come out, they would have had to let other juniors come out and change the junior eligibility rule 7 years before they did. And that would have large butterflies in the NFL and USFL.
I think that, if the Colts would have finally surrendered to Elway and decided not to take him the day before the draft or the day of the draft, they wouldn't have taken Eric because they had Curtis Dickey and Randy McMillan at RB. Ultimately, I think that they would have traded the #1 pick to the Chargers for their fifth and 20th overall picks and DT Gary "Big Hands" Johnson. SD would have taken Elway and groomed him behind Fouts for a year or so. Then, the next three picks happen as they did in reality. As for the Colts, they take Marino fifth overall and OLB Vernon Maxwell 20th overall.
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Agreed, but if Walker goes and other juniors go, Parcells is also looking at a richer field at #10. Like, say, Irving Fryar as a primary target for Simms?
Very plausible trade. Dorsett ended up there anyway a few years later.
That could work too, but McNeil's serviceable enough and coming off a season (albeit strike shortened) where he led the league in rushing. The need for a QB probably outweighs the need for Walker for the Jets.
Good point, the whole 1983 draft kinda blows up if juniors are eligible. Irving Fryar and Louis Lipps on the table at WR, Wilbur Marshall, Carl Banks and Fred Young at LB, plus guys like Guy McIntyre, Michael Carter and Bill Maas, not to mention Boomer Esiason.
Good points, especially on the San Diego score.
San Diego had gone out of it's way to stockpile picks specifically for the '83 draft based on their evaluation of how deep it was going to be. They've got plenty to unload for the #1 pick and Fouts, while still formidable, isn't getting any younger. It'd be a master stroke if they pulled it off.
Wonder how Elway would fare under "Air" Coryell...
Marino at 20 would be just a sick a steal as he was at 27...wonder where he'd have gone if he'd had a good combine performance...
However, if Marshall, Banks or Young are available (due to the juniors becoming eligable), perhaps the Colts grab one of them at #5 instead of Smith?
Rose and the Cincinnati Reds win the World Series in 1990 behind the pitching of the Nasty Boys, and if we're lucky, Eric Davis doesn't bruise a kidney in Game 4 of the Series.
On-field success eases the controversy of Fraulein Schott's off-field slurs. Paul O'Neill and Roberto Kelley never get brought in because Eric Davis is still a strong power hitter and center fielder, and the Atlanta Braves becomes the perennial bridesmaids of the NL West for the first half of the decade until they get moved to the NL East. Rose becomes known as a solid manager who, as a former player, knows how to handle talent both on and off the field (no Pinella/Dibble altercation in TTL) and easily makes the HoF as a first ballot.
As a butterfly? The Pirates finally figure out the Reds after losing 2 straight NLCS's to them in 1990 and 1991 and win the NL Pennant in 1992, and take the Blue Jays to seven in the Series.
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College Football "what ifs"
These are inspired from some shows that I saw on cable recently:
1. What if Pitt decided to drop football in 1972, and Johnny Majors stayed at Iowa State?
2. What if Johnny Majors didn't go to Tennessee in 1977 after leading Pitt to the National Championship in 76?
These are inspired from some shows that I saw on cable recently:
1. What if Pitt decided to drop football in 1972, and Johnny Majors stayed at Iowa State?
2. What if Johnny Majors didn't go to Tennessee in 1977 after leading Pitt to the National Championship in 76?
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Had Tony Dorsett already committed there? Obviously, he can then transfer and not lose eligibility. (Hmmm, how highly toued was he coming out of high school? Maybe a decision not to go to Pitt is the straw that breaks the camel's back?)
Might he go to Penn State instead? Perhaps it's Joe Paterno who wins the national title in 1973 with Dorsett as a freshman (they were undefeated in OTL, but they'd be more dominant), or '74 or '75 (IIRC, Oklahoma was on probation then, but that could be a different Sooner team I'm recalling. 1974-5 was during the big winning streak, also, for Oklahoma, IIRC.)
In 1976 they were 7-5. I don't know that Dorsett can make that big of a different. Of course, he did have an *incredible* year. 1974, OTOH, has them losing only 2 in OTL and being #7 when they played the Cotton Bowl; so, they were probably close losses. In TTL, Dorsett probably leads them to play Alabama (and Notre Dame goes to the Cotton), where they can win,a nd be undefeated, sharing the title with Oklahoma. As I look at the standisngs, given ND and 'Bama were both undfeated in '73 before the bowls, and Penn State had a great runner as it was, Dorsett probably doesn't make enough of a difference in '73.
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This is inspired by the movie "We Are Marshall":
WI Marshall University drops football after the 1970 plane crash killed most of the team?
(OTL, they almost did so, but the support of many fans of the team prevented it. Marshall's team experienced a lot of success in the 1980s and 1990s and Randy Moss, Chad Pennington, and Troy Brown (among several others) played there)
WI Marshall University drops football after the 1970 plane crash killed most of the team?
(OTL, they almost did so, but the support of many fans of the team prevented it. Marshall's team experienced a lot of success in the 1980s and 1990s and Randy Moss, Chad Pennington, and Troy Brown (among several others) played there)
Dorsett
I don't think that Tony D committed there until after Majors took over the team. When I watched that show about the 76 Panthers, he said that he did his due diligence in checking out Majors' background and how he turned Iowa St. around and led them to their first ever bowl games in the school's history. But, if Pitt just decided to get rid of football, and Majors stayed at ISU, I don't know where Tony D would have went. Penn St. is a good possibility, however. If he did go there, JoePa's best bet would have been to redshirt him, and then he could play in 1977, where he would have made a big difference as a fifth-year senior. PSU was 11-1 that year, their lone loss being a close one to Kentucky. With Dorsett that year, They win that game, go undefeated, and set up a showdown with undefeated Texas in the Cotton Bowl. I think that they would have won that game.
The butterflies of that affect the NFL in 1977 as well. Dallas may not have gone to the SB and won if it weren't for Tony D. Maybe the Rams or the Vikes go, and Denver beats one of those teams. Then, for the 78 Draft, it would have been interesting as to where he may have gone. Barring another Cowboy trade, the Bucs had the #1 pick that year, but traded it to Houston, who took Campbell. After that, his best bets would have been to go to the Jets with the fourth overall pick, or the Bills with the fifth overall pick. With Tony, maybe one of those teams wins a SB in the early-80's.
I don't think that Tony D committed there until after Majors took over the team. When I watched that show about the 76 Panthers, he said that he did his due diligence in checking out Majors' background and how he turned Iowa St. around and led them to their first ever bowl games in the school's history. But, if Pitt just decided to get rid of football, and Majors stayed at ISU, I don't know where Tony D would have went. Penn St. is a good possibility, however. If he did go there, JoePa's best bet would have been to redshirt him, and then he could play in 1977, where he would have made a big difference as a fifth-year senior. PSU was 11-1 that year, their lone loss being a close one to Kentucky. With Dorsett that year, They win that game, go undefeated, and set up a showdown with undefeated Texas in the Cotton Bowl. I think that they would have won that game.
The butterflies of that affect the NFL in 1977 as well. Dallas may not have gone to the SB and won if it weren't for Tony D. Maybe the Rams or the Vikes go, and Denver beats one of those teams. Then, for the 78 Draft, it would have been interesting as to where he may have gone. Barring another Cowboy trade, the Bucs had the #1 pick that year, but traded it to Houston, who took Campbell. After that, his best bets would have been to go to the Jets with the fourth overall pick, or the Bills with the fifth overall pick. With Tony, maybe one of those teams wins a SB in the early-80's.
Being the opening weekend of the college football season, here's one I ponder from time to time:
What if Penn. State had joined the Big East football conference taking Temple's place?
Big East in 1991:
Boston College
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn. State
Pittsburgh
West Virginia
Virginia Tech
Miami
Could a conference with that strong a field be so easily pilfered by the ACC as it was OTL?
Who would the ACC try to get in place of VT, BC and Miami?
Could the ACC peel off Miami and VT if those schools don't believe the Big East is expanding fast enough to build a "Super Conference" with twelve teams, two divisions and a conference championship game?
If so, who does the ACC get as the third team?
If all that happens, who does the Big East get to replace the two they lost AND fill out a twelve team conference?
I think the Big East still brings in UConn, Louisville, and Cinnci for sure, so that brings them up to nine, but who do they get to fill it out?
Do they still bring in South Florida? Maybe they bring in Marshall? Who gets the last slot?
Big East in 2005:
Big East Costal Division
BC
UConn
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn. State
South Florida (?)
Big East Mountain Division
Pitt
WV
Cinnci
Louisville
Marshall
Ohio (?)
I always wished BC had stayed in the BEast. The yearly BC/UConn game could have been "The Chowder Bowl".
What if Penn. State had joined the Big East football conference taking Temple's place?
Big East in 1991:
Boston College
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn. State
Pittsburgh
West Virginia
Virginia Tech
Miami
Could a conference with that strong a field be so easily pilfered by the ACC as it was OTL?
Who would the ACC try to get in place of VT, BC and Miami?
Could the ACC peel off Miami and VT if those schools don't believe the Big East is expanding fast enough to build a "Super Conference" with twelve teams, two divisions and a conference championship game?
If so, who does the ACC get as the third team?
If all that happens, who does the Big East get to replace the two they lost AND fill out a twelve team conference?
I think the Big East still brings in UConn, Louisville, and Cinnci for sure, so that brings them up to nine, but who do they get to fill it out?
Do they still bring in South Florida? Maybe they bring in Marshall? Who gets the last slot?
Big East in 2005:
Big East Costal Division
BC
UConn
Syracuse
Rutgers
Penn. State
South Florida (?)
Big East Mountain Division
Pitt
WV
Cinnci
Louisville
Marshall
Ohio (?)
I always wished BC had stayed in the BEast. The yearly BC/UConn game could have been "The Chowder Bowl".