Her wiki’s page
Luisa could very well do not exist here and the Duke of Brittany who is also son of the King of England need a proper princess not an heiress as bride (still I am working to expand the trees)
Again too low
List of Alternate Monarchs and Aristocratic Lineage II
- Thread starter FalconHonour
- Start date
Again too low
That is the right way to do a John/Eleanor match (either Charles V is already married or Manuel die earlier)
It doesn't say dwarf, she was just ugly and short.
Wild one, but Catherine of the Palatinate if they want Imperial Connections. As you can tell, I'm running out of options.
Anne of Navarre is similar to her cousin, Joan of France which is why she was affianced with Francis I; I suspect they would be married after Fernando's death or in the Treaty of Blois where Ferdinand married Germaine if Louis XII has sons with Anne of Brittany
POD: Elizabeth of York died in childbirth after securing the English succession and Henry VII remarried to Anne of Brittany
Henry VII, King of England (b. 1457) married a) Elizabeth of York (1466-1488), b) Anne, Duchess of Brittany (b. 1477)
Margaret of Austria (b. 1480) married a) Charles VIII, King of France (1470-1498), b) Philibert II, Duke of Savoy (b. 1480) in 1499
Louis XII, King of France (1462-1514) married a) Jeanne of France (1464-1505) ann 1500, b) Charlotte of Naples (b. 1479)
Ferdinand II, King of Naples (1467-1500) married Joanna of Naples (b. 1480)
John, Prince of Asturias (1478-1497) married Isabella of Brittany (1478-1498) in 1493
*firstborn child of Manuel I and Maria of Aragon, who here married in 1497
Henry VII, King of England (b. 1457) married a) Elizabeth of York (1466-1488), b) Anne, Duchess of Brittany (b. 1477)
- a) Arthur, Prince of Wales (b. 1486) married a) Catherine of Aragon (1485-1502), b) Germaine of Foix (b. 1488) with issue
- a) Henry, Duke of York (1488-1510) married Margaret of Angoulême (b. 1492) with issue
- a) Elizabeth of England (b. 1488) married James IV, King of Scotland (b. 1473) with issue
- b) Francis, Count of Montfort (b. 1494) married Isabelle of Lorraine (b. 1494) with issue
- b) Margaret of England (b. 1496) married Christian II, King of Denmark (b. 1481) with issue
- b) Edmund, Duke of Somerset (b. 1498) married Madeleine de la Tour d’Auvergne (b. 1498) with issue
- b) Mary of England (1500-1504)
- b) Catherine of England (b. 1502) married Charles V, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1500) with issue
- b) Edward, Duke of Richmond (1505-1520) married Elizabeth Grey, Viscountess Lisle (1505-1519) without issue
- b) Anne of England (1508)
- b) Eleanor of England (b. 1510) married Charles III, Duke of Savoy (b. 1507)
Margaret of Austria (b. 1480) married a) Charles VIII, King of France (1470-1498), b) Philibert II, Duke of Savoy (b. 1480) in 1499
- a) Anne (1495)
- a) stillborn son (1497)
- b) Margaret of Savoy (b. 1501)
- b) Philip, Prince of Piedmont (1503-1505)
- b) Mary of Savoy (1504)
- b) Eleanor of Savoy (b. 1505)
- b) Charles III, Duke of Savoy (b. 1507) married Eleanor of England (b. 1510)
Louis XII, King of France (1462-1514) married a) Jeanne of France (1464-1505) ann 1500, b) Charlotte of Naples (b. 1479)
- b) stillborn son (1500)
- b) Marie of France (1502-1504)
- b) stillborn daughter (1503)
- b) Charles IX, King of France (b. 1506) married Margaret of Austria (b. 1507)
- b) Anne of France (b. 1508) married ?
Ferdinand II, King of Naples (1467-1500) married Joanna of Naples (b. 1480)
- Ippolita (b. 1498) married Ferdinand of Taranto (b. 1488)
- Alfonso III, King of Naples (b. 1500) married Anne of Spain (b. 1498)
John, Prince of Asturias (1478-1497) married Isabella of Brittany (1478-1498) in 1493
- Ferdinand III, King of Spain (b. 1495) married Madeleine of Navarre (b. 1494)
- Isabella of Spain (b. 1496) married John III, King of Portugal (b. 1498) *
- Anne (b. 1498) married Alfonso III, King of Naples (b. 1500)
*firstborn child of Manuel I and Maria of Aragon, who here married in 1497
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Likely they had changed it… still there is little difference between that description and a dwarf
Like I said earlier I had options… I needed just to work more on that universe for finding the right matches for them
An important tree still missing (but the whole scenario need more work for being consistent)
Philip III, Hola Roman Emperor (b. 1478) married Joanna of Aragon and Castile (b. 1479) in 1496
- Eleanor (b. 1498) married Henry VIII, King of England (b. 1504)
- Charles V, Holy Roman Emperor (b. 1500) married Catherine of England (b. 1502)
- Isabella (b. 1501) married Antoine, Duke of Lorraine (b. 1489)
- Maximilian II, Archduke of Austria (b. 1503) married Anne of Bohemia and Hungary (b. 1503)
- Mary (b. 1505) married Louis II, King of Hungary (1506-1626)
- Margaret (b. 1507) married Charles IX, King of France (b. 1506)
- Catherine (1508-1510)
- Beatrice (1510)
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Constance of Brittany m. Geoffrey II of Brittany(a) Ranulf de Blondeville(b) Guy of Thouars(c)
1a. Eleanor of Brittany b. 1184 d. 1241 m. Peter II of Aragon d. 1213(a)
1a1a. Infanta Leonor b. 1204 m. Ferdinand III of Castile
1a2a. Infanta Blanca b. 1205 m. ?
1a3a. James I of Aragon b. 1208 m. Eleanor of Castile(a) Violant of Hungary(b)
2a. Matilda of Brittany b. 1185 d. 1189
3a. Arthur I of Brittany b. 1187 d. 1204[1] m. Eleanor of Aragon(a)[2]
3a1a. Geoffrey III of Brittany, Count of Anjou b. 1204 m. Sophie of France b. 1204[3]
3a2a1a. Marie, Duchess of Brittany, Countess of Anjou b. 1223 m. Charles I, King of Sicily[4]
3a2a2a. Sophie of Brittany b. 1226 b. 1226 m. Hugh XI, Count of Angouleme
4c. Alix of Thouars b. 1200 m. Henry of Penthievre[5]
5c. Margaret of Thouars b. 1201 m. Geoffrey, Viscount of Rohan
6c. Catherine of Thouars b. 1201 m. Andrew III of Vitre
1. Arthur of Brittany dies in action in Poitiers in 1204, Arthur refuses to participate in a rebellion in the Angevin realms and the Capetian-Plantagenet wars until he has children and allies with France and Aragon against his uncle.
2. Her sister, the former Queen of Hungary marries her OTL husband and she remarries to Frederick II of HRE after Philip II removed her from the regency which makes some of the claimants to Sicily related to the children of Charles I of Sicily.
3. Daughter of Ingeborg and Philip II Auguste.
4. The OTL son of Blanche of Castile and Louis VIII
5. The previous betrothal of Alix of Thouars becomes a thing.
1a. Eleanor of Brittany b. 1184 d. 1241 m. Peter II of Aragon d. 1213(a)
1a1a. Infanta Leonor b. 1204 m. Ferdinand III of Castile
1a2a. Infanta Blanca b. 1205 m. ?
1a3a. James I of Aragon b. 1208 m. Eleanor of Castile(a) Violant of Hungary(b)
2a. Matilda of Brittany b. 1185 d. 1189
3a. Arthur I of Brittany b. 1187 d. 1204[1] m. Eleanor of Aragon(a)[2]
3a1a. Geoffrey III of Brittany, Count of Anjou b. 1204 m. Sophie of France b. 1204[3]
3a2a1a. Marie, Duchess of Brittany, Countess of Anjou b. 1223 m. Charles I, King of Sicily[4]
3a2a2a. Sophie of Brittany b. 1226 b. 1226 m. Hugh XI, Count of Angouleme
4c. Alix of Thouars b. 1200 m. Henry of Penthievre[5]
5c. Margaret of Thouars b. 1201 m. Geoffrey, Viscount of Rohan
6c. Catherine of Thouars b. 1201 m. Andrew III of Vitre
1. Arthur of Brittany dies in action in Poitiers in 1204, Arthur refuses to participate in a rebellion in the Angevin realms and the Capetian-Plantagenet wars until he has children and allies with France and Aragon against his uncle.
2. Her sister, the former Queen of Hungary marries her OTL husband and she remarries to Frederick II of HRE after Philip II removed her from the regency which makes some of the claimants to Sicily related to the children of Charles I of Sicily.
3. Daughter of Ingeborg and Philip II Auguste.
4. The OTL son of Blanche of Castile and Louis VIII
5. The previous betrothal of Alix of Thouars becomes a thing.
Sequel
Eleanor of Aragon b. 1182 d. 1222 m. Arthur, Duke of Brittany d. 1204(a) Frederick II of HRE(b)
1a. Geoffrey III of Brittany, Count of Anjou b. 1204 m. Sophie of France b. 1204
1a1a. Marie, Duchess of Brittany, Countess of Anjou b. 1223 m. Charles I of Sicily
1a2a. Sophie of Brittany b. 1226 m. Hugh XI, Count of Angouleme
2b1a. Beatrice b. 1210 m. John III, Doukas Vatatzes
2b2a. Henry I of Sicily b. 1220 d. 1268[1]
1. Manfred born legitimate.
William I of Brittany b. 1170? m. Matilda of Saxony[1](a)
1a. Alix of Brittany b. 1200 m. Peter Mauclerc
2a. Matilda of Brittany b. 1203
1.He is married to Matilda of Saxony in exchange for him reclaiming Brittany from his sister and nephew, he would take Brittany in 1202 after the Battle of Mirabeau with the support of John of England, where he takes Brittany completely from the regency of Philip II, preventing it from being annexed via the claim of Eleanor of Brittany, the wife of Louis VIII.
@Brita
1a. Alix of Brittany b. 1200 m. Peter Mauclerc
2a. Matilda of Brittany b. 1203
1.He is married to Matilda of Saxony in exchange for him reclaiming Brittany from his sister and nephew, he would take Brittany in 1202 after the Battle of Mirabeau with the support of John of England, where he takes Brittany completely from the regency of Philip II, preventing it from being annexed via the claim of Eleanor of Brittany, the wife of Louis VIII.
@Brita
Hedwig d'Anjou (1374-1399) Queen of Poland, m. Vadislaus II Jogaila (ca. 1360-1434) Grand Duke of Lithuania, King of Poland
1) Vladislaus III (1399-1445) King of Poland 1434, King of Bohemia and Hungary (as Ladislaus V) 1437, m. Elizabeth of Luxembourg (1409-1442) [1]
[2] He counted Casimir the Great as Casimir I (as monarch known IOTL as Casimir III really did during his reign).
1) Vladislaus III (1399-1445) King of Poland 1434, King of Bohemia and Hungary (as Ladislaus V) 1437, m. Elizabeth of Luxembourg (1409-1442) [1]
1) Vladislaus (1427-1444)
2) Louis II (1428-1484) King of Hungary 1445
3) Casimir II [2] (1429-1482) King of Poland 1445
4) John II (1431-1492) King of Bohemia 1445
5) Sigismund (1433)
6) Hedwig (1436-1488)
[1] Sigismund of Luxembourg kept Hungarian throne after death of Mary d'Anjou and failure of Nikopolis crusade, so he will propably survive birth of Hedwig's son too. But his position would be shaky and if he wants to ensure, that his descendants would keep Hungary, then marriage of his heiress with grandson of Louis d'Anjou is must. @Zygmunt Stary [2] He counted Casimir the Great as Casimir I (as monarch known IOTL as Casimir III really did during his reign).
Why are thrones split after his death? Louis II is 17 at the time of his father's death, so he is basically an adult at that point and OTL split after Louis d'Anjou death was literally freak accident, fluke of history, maybe there would be rebellions due to how troublesome would be to govern such a large empire, but they would IMHO not likely take away the thrones from LII immediately.
Having multiple sons Władysław III would want to secure their future. Poland-Lithuania-Bohemia-Hungary moloch would be ungovernable anyway-it is receipe for eternal civil war. And IOTL Sigismund of Luxembourg was meant to split the thrones of Bohemia and Hungary if he had second daughter.
And W3 would know, how grandpa's plan ended and why his mother became queen of Poland.
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Would he? IOTL it was quickly forgotten why Hedwig became Queen of Poland and people started to spew most insane theories about that, and well, I don't think he would leave his multiple son with nothing, but IMHO Casimir would be made duke of Slavonia as Stephen of Anjou was and John would either receive dukedom of Gorlitz or would be pushed to claim Naples (doubtful, but possible) while eldest would be posed to inherit his empire.
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Yes, he would, that is most logical thing he could do and pretty normal for the time.
Well, you're an author, so you have the last word, but I disagree about it being the most logical thing at least from Late Medieval POV, Charles V for example tried to oppose split between him and his brother Ferdinand and even then he tried to have Philip elected as King of Romans after his uncle Ferdinand, Louis I wanted to keep all his crowns under Mary, Ferdinand of Aragon and Isabel didn't split their crowns, Danish monarchs fought to maintain Kalmar Union etc., the most logical thing would be keeping the eldest as heir of all his posessions while giving younger some duchies like Slavonia or Goerlitz/Zgorzelec, Ferdinand I didn't split his crowns between his sons, maybe the whole shebang would fall apart due to instability, but dynastic union-splits are in general freak accidents and flukes of history, not some planned things.
Philip IV of Burgundy (1478-1506) m. Joanna I of Spain (1479-1555)
1) Philip II of Spain (1498-1558) m. Magdalena of Navarre (1494-1554) [1]
2) Charles V, HRE (1500-1558) m. a) Isabella of Portugal (1503-1539), b) Margaret of Valois (1523-1574)
3) Isabella (1501-1526) m. John III of Portugal (1502-1557)
4) Ferdinand (1503-1564) m. Anne of Bohemia and Hungary (1503-1547)
5) Mary (1505-1558) m. a) Louis II of Hungary (1506-1526), b) Francis I of France (1494-1547)
6) Catherine (1507-1578) m. Henry VIII of England (1491-1547) [2]
[1] Lives longer ITTL
[2] Katherine of Aragon died giving birth to Mary
1) Philip II of Spain (1498-1558) m. Magdalena of Navarre (1494-1554) [1]
2) Charles V, HRE (1500-1558) m. a) Isabella of Portugal (1503-1539), b) Margaret of Valois (1523-1574)
3) Isabella (1501-1526) m. John III of Portugal (1502-1557)
4) Ferdinand (1503-1564) m. Anne of Bohemia and Hungary (1503-1547)
5) Mary (1505-1558) m. a) Louis II of Hungary (1506-1526), b) Francis I of France (1494-1547)
6) Catherine (1507-1578) m. Henry VIII of England (1491-1547) [2]
[1] Lives longer ITTL
[2] Katherine of Aragon died giving birth to Mary